Fucking orange dot

[serotoninsteve]

Hopefully we don´t get this for the next update:



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Yes, it got a family!


Greetings

[AmazingRuss]

I'd just like to add:

FUCKING ORANGE DOT!

There must be somebody that gets use out of it, but I'm also too stupid to understand it. I would love a setting that just MADE IT GO AWAY!


AAAAAHGGGGH!

[AmazingRuss]

Seriously though...how do you make this go away after accidentally activating it?

I have one that triggers in the middle of a clip, so half the clip gets played. I just want it GONE so that i can play the whole clip.

Thanks.

[bensuthers]

RTFM

just click revert.

personally, i find it no strange leap of understanding. The orange dot represents where the clip starts. Most of your problems are caused by not comprehending how the loop length and bar number interact. This all makes sense in the arrange page and is suddenly wonderful and useful.

most of your problems could be fixed. however if ableton would simply let you click on the orange dot and move it.

Ultimately, though, I take offence at the idea that Ableton can't innovate and change their software without a bunch of Luddites complaining. I also don't understand; if you want the old clip transport because it was musically more like an old instrument for you, keep the old software handy. You don't throw out your old telecaster just because Fender made a new one, do you?

[AmazingRuss]

Thank you...and I did RTFM.

The orange dot, in my case, was representing where the clip ends, not where it starts. Maybe you should RTFM.

You can take offense all you like...but if you add a feature into a piece of software, you need to document it adequately. Adequately means so that a user of average intelligence can comprehend the feature. My intellect may be sub-average, but from a search of posts, I couldn't find anybody else that grasped this feature either. Either you cerebral folk have been holding out on us, or the feature is inadequately documented.

Nobody is throwing Live out...and to return to your guitar analogy, if someone bolted a device onto your telecaster that induced seemingly random pitch transpositions when you moved your hand over the 14th fret, you would be unbolting that thing pretty quick

[AmazingRuss]

Well, so much for that...the revert button does clear the dot...until i restart the clip. Then the dot comes back. Interestingly enough, it also ends my loop halfway to the orange dot...whereas it used to end the loop at the orange dot.

Mind, the regular loop markers are placed correctly...they are just being ignored.

Please cast the the light of your brilliance into the inky blackness if my ignorance, if you would.

Thanks

[bensuthers]

"When clip play is offset from global time in this manner, a little dot will illuminate in the Sample Display or MIDI Editor to display the offset start position."

once again, the key here is 'global time'. that's what's confusing you.

"The current offset as indicated by the dot can be made permanent by moving the start marker to the dot's position - and this is exactly what the Keep button, found just beneath the Nudge buttons, does. Or, the current offset can be undone using the Revert button."

ok. the best way to show how the orange dot vs what's playing is to turn off global quantise, load some warped, looped audio, and press play. trigger the clip, then in the scrub area, hold down the mouse

the current audio will re-trigger continuously, and the orange dot will travel backwards through the audio to show what the start time would have to be in order to play this clip from this point (the point you are clicking on) at the current global time. it's like a frame of reference. that is the key.

when you turn on quantise, you get a little confused; because suddenly it's not what you're clicking on now, but you're telling it what to play 'next'. try v.small latencys to use this effectively. the global quantise interacts strongly with this; both in where you click and when it will start playing what you clicked on. Nudge becomes useful now, because it helps you to understand exactly what you are doing.

now my DJ friends tell me this means they can trigger a section or sample in a track instantly, rather than moving the loop points around it. they just have to click. like moving the needle over the record. I'm not a DJ, but they are VERY excited about it. I'm just excited about being able to scrub. I think that it would make it easier if you could click on the dot to move it. I'm pleased they've uncoupled actual start time from the loop; but that has necessitated the orange dot.

The interaction with 'global' time suddenly makes the arrange page even more useful.

[supster]

The orange dot represents where the clip starts.

following the example i gave earlier (wont retype it), how does this represent the clip start?

ie. if i scrub from a certain area, and the ucking forange dot appears way back at the beginning of my track (long clip) .. what is this supposed to be accomplishing

because i clicked at bar 97. not bar 7, or 13, or 11.

I take offence at the idea that Ableton can't innovate and change their software without a bunch of Luddites complaining.

so the long time customers that paid for multiple versions, use the program in-and out every day, and in many cases come up with solutions and innovative ideas (that often eventually become features ... )

we dont have the right to evaluate the program when its in our hands and question whether or not something was the best way of doing things? or might not be working at all? and petition for correction?

i doubt most of ableton agrees with you on that, could be wrong ..

keep the old software handy.

so rather than improve on an existing feature - have it thouroughly explained - and/or have it modified .. we should just accept whatever we get, and do a long pain in the ass workaround instead.

developers are not gods - mistakes are made and things are overlooked - and they're not mindreaders.

people that come on and bitch about the ones that are trying to improve things .. now that i dont understand ...
.

[bensuthers]

> following the example i gave earlier (wont retype it), how does this represent the
> clip start?

read my second post explaining the interaction of GLOBAL TIME and clip offset. The orange dot is where the clip would need to start in order for what you clicked on to be playing at the appropriate (quantised) global time.

This isn't rocket science. It's easy to work it out, if you just give it a go. As I suggested in my second post, try turning quantise off. You'll understand it a lot faster.

That said, I have no idea whether you have given the new clip transport a chance or not. I did, and I ended up liking it. That's what I suggest. Give it a go. It's new, it's different, and it's powerful. For 'realtime' scrubbing It's more intuitive for than altering the start time; especially for long clips....finally you can click on a part of a long clip (say a breakdown or a sample) and hear it. And if you find a new clip orientation that sounds good you can easily keep the alteration.

...and when used in the arrange page it's fucking magical.....the whole arrange stays with you when you click on the clip view....(this was what triggered my understanding - it's all about 'global' time).

[Chris J]

hey bensuthers, you mustn't have used it much because the behaviour of the dot is much more unpredictible than what you've noticed.

In session view, copying clips makes a mess. And fuck it I've explained it so many times, I'm sick of it.

BTW I've read the manual, but I've also spent a lot of time on L5, maybe you should drop the manual and start reading what we're saying

[ekko]

I'd just like to add:

I'm glad I'm not the only fucking person who doesn't understand the fucking orange dot.

That is all.

/been using Live since 2.0

[DJRetard]

>

...and when used in the arrange page it's fucking magical.....the whole arrange stays with you when you click on the clip view....

I just noticed this myself as I havent been using arrange page at all recently. It makes sense in arrangement view but I feel it doesnt make such sense in session view. Good for those that have long audio files in arrange mode. it gives them some of the freedom that you get in session view. But the problem I feel is the new feature has taken something away from session view. Maybe just a feeling, but its definitely affecting a number of users.

[bensuthers]

> you mustn't have used it much because the behaviour of the dot is much more
> unpredictible than what you've noticed.

no, I've noticed that it appears unpredictable; but it's actually not.

> In session view, copying clips makes a mess. And fuck it I've explained it so many
> times, I'm sick of it

I haven't noticed this at all. No issues with copying clips. and before you ask I DO use the session view all the time.

..and if you are having problems understanding this feature, why don't you simply stop clicking in the scrub area?

I'm using live 5 every day as my main creative & production environment; both as a writing tool and as a workhorse system. I'm having no problems integrating the clip transport and scrub features into my work flow, and they are helping.[/i]

[AmazingRuss]

...and when used in the arrange page it's fucking magical.....the whole arrange stays with you when you click on the clip view....(this was what triggered my understanding - it's all about 'global' time).

Brain...smoking...can't...quite....grasp....concept....



I don't get it now, and don't have time to puzzle on it as I'm goin on vacation tomorrow, but thank you for your patient explanation. I will return to this post when I get back and try to figure it out.

[Chris J]

>.and if you are having problems understanding this feature, why don't you simply stop clicking in the scrub area?

I don't, that's the problem. If you copy a 4 bar clip while running live, and it's for instance in the middle of bar 2 while you paste, then the start point will be on bar 2. And the revert button is blacked out. So you have to move manually the start point. If you copy/paste 10 clips, you have to do it 10 times etc...
GET IT ?