ADVANCE TAP TEMPO: LIVE TO FOLLOW LIVE DRUMMER

[emankayker]

Hi All
I am preparing a live gig and wanted to follow a live band adding loops and fx.
Unfortunately I can't follow a live drummer because if I miss a tap tempo the whole thing go bezerk and let's say a tune that was going at 100 would jump to 160 or some crazy shaït like that. That would also occur if I tapped a tiny bit earlier than the grid, if I see what I mean. If you don't, you won't be much help, but thank you for reading.
I resolved by having the band to play to a click, that was disappointing for everybody, but I would really like to have that option... if it ever existed.
Has anyone solved this problem? without all those third party beat detector things, I'm sure they can be usable but not an option for me.
Cheers
e

[emankayker]

bump!

[oddstep]

if you've got suite there must a max for live tempo detection device - don't know if that counts as 3rd party or not.
if you're not into click tracks incorporating sequencers/drum machines is basically djing - it'll be easier if you have a cue mix on your head phones so you can tap and nudge the tempo into roughly the right place without derailing the whole performance

[fishmonkey]

have you tried B-Keeper?

http://www.b-keeper.org/

there used to be a couple of other live tempo tracking apps, but they seem to have fallen by the wayside...

why is a third party solution not an option?

there is this too, but i don't know how you get a copy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PV5Zg0ftVsI

[studiojohnny]

If Live will be contributing significantly to the mix then I wouldn't trust any software to "auto-match" the tempo. All it has to do is mess up one time and suddenly you'll have a massive train wreck on your hands. That is unacceptable at a pro level. You'll have to do what the pros do and have your drummer play to a click track. You can do this by making a click track (hi hats for example) and routing it to its own output and then into the drummer's headphones.

If you're only using the auto-tempo for minor things, like setting a tap-delay on 1 soft-synth, then I might trust an auto-detect program to do that. But even there you could just click the tap tempo with each new song and the tempo will stay within a few BPM for the rest of the song (depending on how tight the drummer is).

[Venetian]

B-Keeper is a good option

If you want to try something new, check out BeatSeeker. www.github.com/venetian/beatseeker

I've put both B-Keeper and BeatSeeker on Github. They are "third party beat detector things", but then I'm not sure of a way round that for the time being. I have however made set up videos for them now (http://youtu.be/XEpD6M7HRLc). Mac OS X required. You would also be pioneering this way of doing things.

regarding what studiojohnny says, there is a tempo function on Beatseeker, and those are good points about pro bands and click tracks. This one should work pretty well to follow and there is a tap function if you felt it had gone out.

[siliconarc]

You'll have to do what the pros do and have your drummer play to a click track. You can do this by making a click track (hi hats for example) and routing it to its own output and then into the drummer's headphones.

this! we used a simple drumrack with hihat pattern as a click, with the main output mix being fed into the same headphone out, mixed low under the clicktrack. we used count-in cues to different sections of the song - chorus, bridges etc - with diff sounds too - crashes, cowbells, snares... works great, and the drummer can't moan about the constant bip-bop-bop-bop. let them choose their own sound for the click too.
they all come around, eventually

[Tekhed66]

I use Ableton quite a lot in my live band (no pun intended...)

I'm the keyboard player so I've used Ableton to play sequences and incidental keyboard parts as part of a live band setup (guitar, bass, drums).

I send the Ableton metronome to the drummer who uses a special type of headphone where (this is weird to explain) you hear the music inside your head... the headphones sit around your head like a radio mic and have two small pressure pads that sit on your temple bones ... they then send the vibrations to your temple bones which resonate and you hear the music from within your head. This way he says that his skull feels the kick of the metronome even if the band volume gets too loud and drowns out everything else. We've tried all sorts of closed headphones but these work the best.

Having said all that, I'm very keen to try Beatseeker as drumming to a click isn't always perfect ... I've just downloaded it but haven't tried it yet ... anyone out there using it and if so, how do you set it up in your track and also, how do you mic the snare drum and send that signal to Ableton while you're playing a set?

many thanks.

[Venetian]

Having said all that, I'm very keen to try Beatseeker as drumming to a click isn't always perfect ... I've just downloaded it but haven't tried it yet ... anyone out there using it and if so, how do you set it up in your track and also, how do you mic the snare drum and send that signal to Ableton while you're playing a set?

There's a lesson that covers this (right click on the device in the browser to 'Show Lesson'

You would put it on a track that has drums routed to it. So, for example, a microphone placed near kick and snare could be routed to a channel and just place device on that channel. If you wanted a combination of drum mics/instruments, you could have a channel for each mic and set the "Audio To" for each of those to a dedicated drum channel and put the device there. Generally there will be no sound from this drum channel in the mix.