Am I missing out without Push?

ash1 · Post by **ash1** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:32 am

the thing push has is the scales feature no other controller has that and its just great to be able to set a scale lock it in and off you go and of course pxt live and plus etc

Sional · Post by **Sional** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:07 am

Actually other controllers do feature scales, either directly (e.g. Maschine in midi mode) or with the addition of software (e.g. Korg PadKontrol with pKC). Plus, if your keyboard features transpose buttons it is easy to play all Major and Minor keys. The biggest feature of Push, compared to other controllers, is that it has 64 pads and therefore the scales feature is more useful.

NoSonic822 · Post by **NoSonic822** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:23 am

yea but it shows the parts of the sequence on the top, pads, so you just play the sequence through the full length and click on the pad that has th part you want to change...no you cant see each individual note of a 16 step sequence all at once on the screen but who cares...i mean thats part of having an 8 pad width grid...deal with it....

and you can see the whole sequence by selecting measure time like 1 bar 3 bar 16 bar....and the reevant time signature

https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/push-se ... di-school/
like what do you want???? a 16 by 16 pad Push? lulz taht would be massiv, go buy an elektron 16 analog or whatever it is and use that

Not sure what you mean by this. The instrument step sequencer in Push is not as useful as you might think because you can only see 8 steps and one octave (8 notes) at any one time.

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Sional · Post by **Sional** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 10:39 am

If you keep things simple (8th notes all within an octave) the sequencer is OK but when you want to do something more complex (16th notes over a number of octaves) it is a lot more difficult to keep tabs on things. This also applies to the chord sequencer.
Just saying as somebody who already owns Push.

tedlogan · Post by **tedlogan** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:01 pm

Sional wrote:If you keep things simple (8th notes all within an octave) the sequencer is OK but when you want to do something more complex (16th notes over a number of octaves) it is a lot more difficult to keep tabs on things. This also applies to the chord sequencer.
Just saying as somebody who already owns Push.

It can get finnicky yes. But I do enjoy using the note sequencer to input random notes/step automation for generating ideas. Works real well for certain aspects of my music.

Once in a while something I like pops out, and then I go and refine it with the mouse.

I wish scrolling up and down with the touch strip was more fluid though, it goes a bit fast for my liking. A move all notes up/down per half-note/octave would be great too (directly from Push). Because789 has a M4L tool for this though, which works great.

Sional · Post by **Sional** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:23 pm

I think it may have been better if all 64 pads were made available for the sequence (the lower row of buttons beneath the display could have been set aside for playhead position). Alternate octave notes is a fairly common progression and currently you can only see every second note.
If Ableton could incorporate the fold facility, as per the software, that would also improve the melodic and chord step sequencer.

tedlogan · Post by **tedlogan** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:26 pm

Sional wrote:I think it may have been better if all 64 pads were made available for the sequence (the lower row of buttons beneath the display could have been set aside for playhead position). Alternate octave notes is a fairly common progression and currently you can only see every second note.
If Ableton could incorporate the fold facility, as per the software, that would also improve the melodic and chord step sequencer.

Yes, that would be very handy. I still haven't acquired PXT (madness I know), I'm guessing those guys implemented something of the nature you suggested.

Sional · Post by **Sional** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:47 pm

Yes PXT does address some of these issues.
Unfortunately Stray believes in giving you an awful lot of features for your money (probably too many) and therefore PXT can be daunting to use.

NoSonic822 · Post by **NoSonic822** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:49 pm

well, idk i think it's a must have if you are an ableton useer who wants to be really creative with your midi, and be able to sequence stuff on the go. it might not be the best @step sequencer@ but it still is a perfect sequencer tool for tralsport, loading clips loading scenes etc, i play trance so for making a trance song live on the go i feel like iot would be perfect. because i will have some canned clips and sequences, but i can make small adjustments to them on the go....and not genereating all of it from scratch. like you wouldnt want to go into a live performance situation expecting to make all your ste[ sequences from scratch cmon, if you want a real step sequencer then get an alektron, i think the postitives and the way push molds with the software is basically incredible. there are so many things that you are taking for granted that its able to do, and just focusing on the step sequencer, ok, it has opnly 8 pads across so you cant expect it to be something it s not yknowmwahti mean

NoSonic822 · Post by **NoSonic822** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 1:49 pm

]well, idk i think it's a must have if you are an ableton useer who wants to be really creative with your midi and perform live, and be able to sequence stuff on the go. it might not be the best @step sequencer@ but it still is a perfect sequencer tool for transport, loading clips loading scenes etc, i play trance so for making a trance song live on the go i feel like iot would be perfect. because i will have some canned clips and sequences, but i can make small adjustments to them on the go....and not genereating all of it from scratch. like you wouldnt want to go into a live performance situation expecting to make all your ste[ sequences from scratch cmon, if you want a real step sequencer then get an alektron, i think the postitives and the way push molds with the software is basically incredible. there are so many things that you are taking for granted that its able to do, and just focusing on the step sequencer, ok, it has opnly 8 pads across so you cant expect it to be something it s not yknowmwahti mean[/quote]

Sional · Post by **Sional** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:29 pm

I am not trying to knock Push or discourage you from purchasing it. In certain ways Push is a fine controller (particularly as a pad based instrument). However you need to be careful of not painting too rosy a picture of its capabilities.
You say that "the way Push molds with the software is basically incredible" but unfortunately there is an awful lot that you cannot do with Push (e.g. loading clips) and you don't need Push to step sequence in Live.
I have found that Push has not added any value to my "pre Push" Live projects and to get the most out of Push you have to learn to work within its limitations, which may differ from how you previously worked with Live (its more suited to midi than audio).
Considering the price, I also think Ableton have not supplied all they should have with Push (e.g. the nonexistent user mode) and we should not have to rely on third party software to make up the shortcomings.

NoSonic822 · Post by **NoSonic822** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:46 pm

well if you work with lot of audio then i see your point. i use barely any, its all midi. what do you mean you cant load clips? i used to be doubtful about push i thought it was just a gimmik or toy, but not any more/, it's the next step in my evolution of using live. trust me. its organic evolution, its not perfect, but its maniofested because there was a demand an avenue

TomViolenz · Post by **TomViolenz** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:04 pm

tedlogan wrote:
Sional wrote:I think it may have been better if all 64 pads were made available for the sequence (the lower row of buttons beneath the display could have been set aside for playhead position). Alternate octave notes is a fairly common progression and currently you can only see every second note.
If Ableton could incorporate the fold facility, as per the software, that would also improve the melodic and chord step sequencer.
Yes, that would be very handy. I still haven't acquired PXT (madness I know), I'm guessing those guys implemented something of the nature you suggested.

ts, ts....

Sional · Post by **Sional** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:05 pm

From the Push controller you can load instruments and FX. Ableton devices are easy but 3rd party devices are not so easy but possible.
You cannot load samples, projects or midi clips from Push.

TomViolenz · Post by **TomViolenz** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:09 pm

Inversoundzzz wrote:like you wouldnt want to go into a live performance situation expecting to make all your step sequences from scratch cmon

Why not?!
Be a little adventureous, the complaint about electronic music is always that it's caned music. Show them that it doesn't have to be!

At least be part of you performance in free flow, playing the step sequencer like a real instrument.

I'm in the progress atm, of preparing just such a performance!

Am I missing out without Push?

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