KORG ER-1 - keeps losing sync in Ableton

[Agent_Trig]

Hoping someone can help me here...

Not used my ER-1 in a long time and decided to give a blast yesterday, however that didn't last long as I couldn't for the life of me get it to keep in sync with Ableton.

I have the clock on the ER-1 set to External.

I have the MIDI OUT on my Komplete Audio 6 going into the MIDI IN on the ER-1.

With a loop on the ER-1 playing, I adjust the MIDI timing within Ableton's MIDI settings until the beat is in time with the metronome.

At this point, all is good. Until I hit stop and then play again and now it's totally out of sync and requires a completely different MIDI timing to pull it back in time again.

So something is not right. Is it something I'm missing or could it be a hardware issue with either the Komplete 6 or ER-1?

Any help much appreciated

[Richie Witch]

Sounds like you don't have your MIDI preferences set right in Live. If you have Sync - Out set properly, the ER-1 will track to Live's clock, even as you drag the mouse up and down. The ER-1 will literally speed up and slow down right in step, after a beat or two, with Live'c clock. And the ER-1 will start and stop with the transport buttons in Live. I do it all the time with my ER-1.

If you're having to "adjust the MIDI timing" to match the metronome, you're not actually using Live's clock to sync the ER-1.

[markwphoto]

Hoping someone can help me here...

Not used my ER-1 in a long time and decided to give a blast yesterday, however that didn't last long as I couldn't for the life of me get it to keep in sync with Ableton.

I have the clock on the ER-1 set to External.

I have the MIDI OUT on my Komplete Audio 6 going into the MIDI IN on the ER-1.

With a loop on the ER-1 playing, I adjust the MIDI timing within Ableton's MIDI settings until the beat is in time with the metronome.

At this point, all is good. Until I hit stop and then play again and now it's totally out of sync and requires a completely different MIDI timing to pull it back in time again.

So something is not right. Is it something I'm missing or could it be a hardware issue with either the Komplete 6 or ER-1?

Any help much appreciated

I used to have an ER-1 and I always had issues keeping sync when using loops. This was also an issue with EA-1 as well. I recall contacing Korg or reading somewhere that it has to do with the loop itself when using an external clock. The external clock will trigger the loop to play but it drifts out of sync each time it loops. By 4-8 bars in it's gone totally wrong. The external clock only sends the signal to start and stop the loop but it won't keep internal sequencer in time with the external sequencer/clock. As I recall I ended up exporting the midi from the Electribes to a track in my DAW versus using the midi clock to start/stop a loop. This also allowed me to play the Electribes with an external keyboard and create my own loops within my DAW. You can use midi CC to change on your midi track to change patches, etc.

Unfortunately I no longer have any electribes to recall exactly how I did it.

Hope this helps.

[markwphoto]

Hoping someone can help me here...

Not used my ER-1 in a long time and decided to give a blast yesterday, however that didn't last long as I couldn't for the life of me get it to keep in sync with Ableton.

I have the clock on the ER-1 set to External.

I have the MIDI OUT on my Komplete Audio 6 going into the MIDI IN on the ER-1.

With a loop on the ER-1 playing, I adjust the MIDI timing within Ableton's MIDI settings until the beat is in time with the metronome.

At this point, all is good. Until I hit stop and then play again and now it's totally out of sync and requires a completely different MIDI timing to pull it back in time again.

So something is not right. Is it something I'm missing or could it be a hardware issue with either the Komplete 6 or ER-1?

Any help much appreciated

I used to have an ER-1 and I always had issues keeping sync when using loops. This was also an issue with EA-1 as well. I recall contacing Korg or reading somewhere that it has to do with the loop itself when using an external clock. The external clock will trigger the loop to play but it drifts out of sync each time it loops. By 4-8 bars in it's gone totally wrong. The external clock only sends the signal to start and stop the loop but it won't keep internal sequencer in time with the external sequencer/clock. As I recall I ended up exporting the midi from the Electribes to a track in my DAW versus using the midi clock to start/stop a loop. This also allowed me to play the Electribes with an external keyboard and create my own loops within my DAW. You can use midi CC to change on your midi track to change patches, etc.

Unfortunately I no longer have any electribes to recall exactly how I did.

Hope this helps.

Midi was pain in the rear back in the day. Found this in an online manual. This may explain your issue:

6. About synchronization
Two or more sequencers can be connected via MIDI and made
to playback in synchronization. Messages used for synchronization
(realtime messages) include Timing Clock [F8], Start [FA],
Continue [FB], and Stop [FC]. In a synchronized system, one
synthesizer (the master) will transmit these messages, and the
other sequencer(s) (the slave(s)) will receive these messages. The
slave devices will playback according to the tempo specified by
the Timing Clock messages transmitted by the master. Twentyfour
Timing Clock messages are transmitted for each quarter
note. When the ER-1’s Global mode parameter Clock is set to
INT, it will be the master device, and will transmit these realtime
messages. When Clock is set to EXT, it will be the slave device,
and will receive these realtime messages. However even when
Clock is set to EXT, the ER-1 will operate according to its own
internal clock if no Timing Clock messages are being received.
The Start message specifies when playback will begin. When
the Start/Pause key is pressed on the master device, it will transmit
a Start message. Slave devices that receive this Start message
will synchronize to the Timing Clock messages subsequently
received, and will begin playback from the beginning.
If the Start/Pause key is pressed on the master devices when it
is paused, the master will transmit a Continue message. When
a slave device receives the Continue message, it will resume
playback from the point where it is currently stopped. If the
Stop key is pressed during playback, the master will transmit a
Stop message. Slave devices will stop playback when they receive
a Stop message.
7. Synchronization in Song mode
In Song mode, the ER-1 can transmit and receive Song Select
and Song Position Pointer messages. When you switch songs, a
Song Select [F3 ss] message will be transmitted (ss: song number,
where one of 128 songs can be selected. On the ER-1 you
can select 16 songs.) If the ER-1 receives a Song Select message
in Song mode, it will switch songs. Transmission and reception
of Song Select messages can be restricted by the MIDI Filter
settings of MIDI mode. If you change the current position on
the master device (i.e., the device whose Clock is set to INT)
when the song is stopped, a Song Position Pointer message [F2
pp pp] will be transmitted. (pp: the number of MIDI beats from
the beginning of the song; i.e., the number of Timing Clocks
divided by six.) Song Position Pointer indicates the location at
which the sequencer is currently stopped. When Song Position
Pointer is received in Song mode by a slave device (i.e., a device
whose Clock is set to EXT), it will change the location at
which its song is currently stopped to match the location of the
master. However on the ER-1, the length of each pattern may
be different, so the master and slave will not necessarily be in
the same location. When the Start/Pause key is pressed on the
master device, a Continue message is transmitted, and the song
will begin playback from the currently selected position. When
the slave device receives the Continue message, it will synchronize
to the Timing Clock messages and begin playback from
the current point in the song. In the same way as synchronizing
the playback from the beginning of the song, you can specify
43
8.Appendices ????? ??????????????????????????????????????
8.Appendices
the location at which playback will start, and then playback in
synchronization. If you use the dial or Select keys to fast-forward
or rewind while the song is playing, Song Position Pointer
messages will not be transmitted. Be aware that if you perform
these operations during synchronized playback, the synchronization
will be lost. Also, even if Song Position Pointer messages
are received during playback, the playback location will
not change.

[Richie Witch]

I recall contacing Korg or reading somewhere that it has to do with the loop itself when using an external clock. The external clock will trigger the loop to play but it drifts out of sync each time it loops. By 4-8 bars in it's gone totally wrong. The external clock only sends the signal to start and stop the loop but it won't keep internal sequencer in time with the external sequencer/clock.

This has not been my experience at all. I frequently record 16- and 32-bar loops from the ER-1 without sync problems. I test my MIDI connection by dragging my mouse over the bpm counter in Live, moving the bpm value up and down, while the ER-1 tracks the tempo change. It sometimes takes a beat or two to stabilize to the new tempo, but that's not uncommon for any MIDI device.

If the ER-1 was only receiving start/stop commands, it would not react to tempo changes in real time.

[Richie Witch]

When Clock is set to EXT, it will be the slave device, and will receive these realtime messages. However even when Clock is set to EXT, the ER-1 will operate according to its own internal clock if no Timing Clock messages are being received.

This could be where you're getting confused. It's a handy feature on the ER-1, that if no external clock is being received, it will default back to its internal clock. This means that even if you normally have the ER-1 clock set to EXT, if you aren't using any other MIDI devices, the ER-1 will play normally. This saves you the hassle of constantly switching it back and forth every time you just want to quickly work out a beat on the ER-1.

When the Start/Pause key is pressed on the master device, it will transmit a Start message. Slave devices that receive this Start message will synchronize to the Timing Clock messages subsequently received,

[markwphoto]

When Clock is set to EXT, it will be the slave device, and will receive these realtime messages. However even when Clock is set to EXT, the ER-1 will operate according to its own internal clock if no Timing Clock messages are being received.

This could be where you're getting confused. It's a handy feature on the ER-1, that if no external clock is being received, it will default back to its internal clock. This means that even if you normally have the ER-1 clock set to EXT, if you aren't using any other MIDI devices, the ER-1 will play normally. This saves you the hassle of constantly switching it back and forth every time you just want to quickly work out a beat on the ER-1.

When the Start/Pause key is pressed on the master device, it will transmit a Start message. Slave devices that receive this Start message will synchronize to the Timing Clock messages subsequently received,

This goes back to what my issue was when I had my Electribes. If the ER-1 wasn't receiving the timing clock properly then it would go out of sync with the EXT sequencer because it defaulted back to the its internal. It received the start and stop signal properly but timing was always off. Again granted this was many years ago when I had this issue and I was also using a different DAW (Cakewalk I believe at the timee). This is why I just used the Electribes as an external synth and controlled everything via the sequencer in my DAW vs relying on pattern playback.

Back to the OP if he starts in sync, pauses and then tries to continue there still may be a timing clock issue causing everything to go out of whack.

[Agent_Trig]

Thanks for the replies guys.

If I press play in Ableton, it will trigger the ER-1 to start playing.
The ER-1 will also be playing at the correct tempo, just not in time.
To get it in time, I adjust the MIDI timings on my interfaces OUTPUT settings in Ableton's MIDI prefs.
It will now stay in time.
But... if I press stop in Ableton and then press play again, it it now out of time (still correct tempo).
I then have to adjust the MIDI timings again to a different timing to get back in time.
If I press stop and start over and over, sometimes I might drop lucky and it's bang in time.

This doesn't sound like normal behaviour to me and never acted like this a while back when I used to use it more often.

Can anyone let me know the exact MIDI pref settings they have in Live so I can see if I'm missing anything please?

Thanks

[tomthemagic]

I seem to have the same problem when I turn on the er-1 and it sync well as soon as a hit the space bar in live the er-1 stop but restart where it was and not at the beginning of the pattern if there was a way to "tell "the electribe to restart the pattern every time I stop live it will save the day otherwise I think the er-1 is not supper daw friendly

[aljazk]

Hello everybody. I am experience different kind of problem with syncing the ER1 (mk2). I have in the middle of midi path (tr8 - >er1 -> minilogue -> BSP - 1 channel to minitaur and one to Mam mb33 retro. Everything is perfectly synced together, except er1 is a little bit late. I cant seem to find anything that would solve that problem, can maybe one of you guys help?

Thanks!

[coop3rp0ny6]

Hi guys!
I have a similar problem with Volcas.
I think Ableton sends a start message only at the first bar of the arrangement view. and then, anywhere on the timeline for some gear the stop message is interpreted as pause / continue messages ; because i have this wheird problem with the volca's:

i have them synced to Live via MIDI. all settings good and this is what happens:
I hit play in ableton and everythings is fine: they start, they stop, they stay in sync, no problem so far...But this happens only when i hit play from the beginning of the arrangement view on first bar! If i hit play and the start marker is anywhere else in the timeline they don't start from the beggining of the sequence, they start from where they where stopped / paused last time...
Let's say you want to edit something in the middle of a traCK, maybe add a loop...anyway, the sequencer of the volca's doesn't reset from first bit every time u hit play in live. they start from whatever different position they remember ....hitting play from the first second of the track fixes again the start. resets everything and all good.
....so i guess is something to do with what kind of midi messages Ableton sends since the volcas start/stop/sync but don't reset unless u hit play from the first bar of the arrangeview...