The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Questions and discussion about building and using Max for Live devices
hoffman2k
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The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by hoffman2k » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:20 pm

This is the Honey Mapper. Watch it run with no motion.

Image

Its pretty badass! Look, it maps all over the place…
“Wow, watch out!” says that bird. Ew, its mapped to a return track. Oh, it shows the names on Push?
Oh my gosh! Oh, the Honey Mapper is just crazy…
The Honey Mapper is referred to by the Guinness Book of World Records as the most fearless Mapper in all the Ableton kingdom, it really doesn’t give a shit.


So after about 50 different rewrites of Sixteen Macros, I ended up with this device.
It only works inside a Instrument Rack or MIDI Effect Rack. You choose which of the 8 Macros control the device and what it is mapped to.
One macro can control multiple parameters.
Once a parameter is assigned, it is locked. But you can unlock it by simply turning off the Rack.
The Honey Mapper device only stores what it is controlling, the envelope and which Macro controls it. So it doesn't mess up any parameter values when you reload a preset or device. But the control is absolute. Meaning once mapped, the mapped parameter will jump to where it is supposed to be in relation to the Macro and the parameter envelope.
You can set the minimum and maximum range and anything in between with an envelope. The X axis relates to the Macro going from 0 to 127, the Y axis relates to the range of the mapped parameter. The curve also lets you control when a button turns on or off. Or lets you skip values, for example when mapped to filter type selection.

Since this device works as the guts of a Rack Device, you get all the benefits that Racks have. So you can name your macros and see those names on Push and other controllers with a screen. You do have to enter them manually, but that is also the plus side.. Custom Names! You can also name the Rack as a Bank.
And it'll work with any control surface or with MIDI Learn. And you can map macros to macros to macros to macros and control it all with a bunch of LFO's...
There's no feedback loop protection though, so if things get jittery, it means you mapped something directly to itself. Press Clear in that case.
Duplicating a mapping won't work. So press clear if you duplicate a device. One macro controlling 24 parameters = 1 undo action.

Its as good as done, but it doesn't hurt to give it a proper testing before releasing it into the wild. It still needs annotations and maybe some comments inside the device. Though its actually fairly simple on the inside.
I've attached a project that shows it working in a basic form. There are so many tricks you can do with this device, it'll take a while to explore them all.

Click here to download.
Last edited by hoffman2k on Thu Feb 09, 2017 1:56 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Angstrom
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by Angstrom » Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:57 pm

hoffman2k wrote: ...
OMG, it's a ghost !
8O :wink:

congrats on your new device

[jur]
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by [jur] » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:05 pm

What a come back hoffman!
Ableton Forum Moderator

orionka
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by orionka » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:23 pm

was really worth the effort... very well done! Thank You!

edit: I tried to use it on Lives Tempo and noticed it is really hard to give it a certain range of values. I'm not a M4L Pro, but is it complicated to implement a window where you put in values for the first and/or last point? Some kind of scaling to these values would be beneficial.

chapelier fou
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by chapelier fou » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:45 pm

Very clever device ! I love the concept !
+ 1 for the ability to type in values.
Oh, and come back H2K !
MacBook Pro 13" Retina i7 2.8 GHz OS 10.13, L10.0.1, M4L.
iMac 27" Retina i5 3,2 GHz OS 10.11.3 L10.0.1 M4L.

hoffman2k
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by hoffman2k » Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:00 pm

Cheers guys :)

This is the simple version to really test out the extremes and to get some user cases, so I appreciate the suggestions.
Provided I have the time, I'll do a more advanced version that also includes CC in/out. Its a simple addition, but I need a reliable takeover mode first.
And yeah, the envelope definitely needs some extra features to help it lock to values and make specific breakpoints. It had them at one point, but it didn't make the cut for the slim version. I need to optimise how much it calls the value string. And once I got that sorted, I can also display the string on Push. At the moment its left out, because it loses its meaning as soon as you map 2 values to 1 macro. You can however get the string displayed from whatever you map a regular Macro to. Its really quite versatile.

The only errors it'll throw up for now is an orange one when you duplicate a mapped device. (You can save it as a preset and load that one though, provided everything is within a Rack, Track or Live-clip ecosystem). And some red ones if you remove a device that is mapped.
So that'll be something that'll improve for the simple version.

S4racen
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by S4racen » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:02 pm

Awesome, wish i'd thought of that...

Cheers
D

eMPac
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by eMPac » Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:16 pm

Hi hoffman2k, I remember sixteen macros! (I think from you I learned that you can use poly~ for things other than audio ? very useful) The Honey Mapper looks great, very clear and totally fearless. I too would love a version with more control over parameter values.

(From what I can see, you could disable "use persistent mapping" in the live.observer that observes 'devices' on the selected_track. Right now it creates an undo step everytime you change track selection.)

hoffman2k
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by hoffman2k » Tue Jan 17, 2017 7:12 pm

eMPac wrote:Hi hoffman2k, I remember sixteen macros! (I think from you I learned that you can use poly~ for things other than audio ? very useful) The Honey Mapper looks great, very clear and totally fearless. I too would love a version with more control over parameter values.

(From what I can see, you could disable "use persistent mapping" in the live.observer that observes 'devices' on the selected_track. Right now it creates an undo step everytime you change track selection.)
Ah yeah.. The poly~ magic matrix. The creator of a flood of undo messages :)
At one point I had the whole thing running with a dict that basically kept track of all paths. Then I went back to the persistent ID's again, since presets were quite a hassle to get working with trying to correct the paths. I just zipped up like 800 files because they were cluttering up the browser. This patch probably has seen every possible incarnation. Almost there though.

Thanks for the reminder! The only thing that needs a persistent ID is the main live.object that gets all the information. When reloaded, it'll send its ID to the observer and remote. All the other stuff keeps its data from the preset. So I already fixed that and am now making sure more precise points can be added.

Got a bit sidetracked with pads, since the endgoal for me is to use poly-pressure to control multiple macros, just like the performance mode on the Analog Rytm. But I somehow ran into show-stopping bugs with all the free MIDI-inside-MFL objects. (Still got my reverse Midas touch, yay...) So that'll be something to look at after this.

hoffman2k
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by hoffman2k » Tue Jan 17, 2017 9:49 pm

New version uploaded. Changes:

- Added annotations for the Envelope features

- Added a way to set precise breakpoints. Changing the Y value will also show the corresponding value string (for 3 seconds)

- Hovering over a breakpoint with the mouse-pointer will show the value at that point (for 3 seconds)

- Removed the CC stuff. No sense in trying to shoehorn it into this device. It already supports 2 native MIDI mapping solutions with their own takeover feature. (Control Surface and MIDI Learn)

- Cleaned up some unneeded persistent mappings

Image

Click here to download.

Imag;ne
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by Imag;ne » Wed Feb 08, 2017 2:14 pm

Looks great, however I would like to use it on Audio track to use effects on clips. Is it possible?

hoffman2k
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by hoffman2k » Thu Feb 09, 2017 1:57 pm

Imag;ne wrote:Looks great, however I would like to use it on Audio track to use effects on clips. Is it possible?
Hi Imag;ne,

I just released it on maxforlive.com, you'll find both an Audio and a MIDI version in the package. Have fun!

http://www.maxforlive.com/library/devic ... ney-mapper

Imag;ne
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by Imag;ne » Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:02 pm

Now this is awesome! Thanks!

pranavakazack
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by pranavakazack » Tue Feb 21, 2017 4:35 pm

hoffman2k wrote:Once a parameter is assigned, it is locked. But you can unlock it by simply turning off the Rack.
Can this be somehow done by enabling/disabling the honey mapper.amxd m4l device?
I want this feature so that I can "release" the modulation destination individually instead of release all of the modulation destinations, just like in the normal Multimap device.
If this can be done it'll be awesome as i'll be able to use it as a Modulation Matrix System.

I do not use MultiMap for this because the enable/disable next to the Map button cannot be saved in .adg file extension of Ableton.
For more details on this problem, click here :
But since the Ableton's On/Off state can be saved inside .adg file extension this will be awesome!

hoffman2k
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Re: The Honey Mapper (Supports all controllers)

Post by hoffman2k » Tue Feb 21, 2017 5:10 pm

pranavakazack wrote:
hoffman2k wrote:Once a parameter is assigned, it is locked. But you can unlock it by simply turning off the Rack.
Can this be somehow done by enabling/disabling the honey mapper.amxd m4l device?
I want this feature so that I can "release" the modulation destination individually instead of release all of the modulation destinations, just like in the normal Multimap device.
If this can be done it'll be awesome as i'll be able to use it as a Modulation Matrix System.

I do not use MultiMap for this because the enable/disable next to the Map button cannot be saved in .adg file extension of Ableton.
For more details on this problem, click here :
But since the Ableton's On/Off state can be saved inside .adg file extension this will be awesome!
Yeah, that works. Either by toggling the on/off state of a single Honey Mapper or the Rack that contains it.
Keep in mind that you can't map outside of the Rack if you plan to store it as a .adg or .alc file. If your mapping spans multiple tracks, use .als files.

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