Recording loops on the fly

MashedBuddha · Post by **MashedBuddha** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 12:18 am

I'm not having any success recording MIDI loops while live in a session. I'm using softsynths and a keyboard controller. As for audio loops, there doesn't seem to be a seamless way to do it. I have trigger finger pad assigned to the start/stop button at the bottom of a track in session view. When the track is armed I can trigger the recording, then I have to stop the recording and restart the loop before the last bar is over if I want to hear the loop contrinue right after I record it. This of course means I can't finish playing the idea. It seems like leaving the quantization at 'bar' is the best idea or I run the risk of having the loop come in at the wrong place. I wish I could have Live (4.14) record only a 4 or 8 bar phrase and automatically stop recording, and just continue looping what I played. Any way to do that?

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 1:17 am

for starters try this with midi loops:

Just create an empty 8- or 16-bar midi clip and overdub into it. Works really well.

With the audio you could set the quantize high, above one bar, this would let you send the end-record command, earlier in the loop, which might make it more comfortable for you. If that doesn't work for you, I can definitely recommend getting a footpedal. They're great.

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 1:27 am

At the risk of sounding self-promotional .. I made my Angstrolooper to get round this issue of seamless audio loops.

If you are on PC it may be one option.

stick it on a track and set it to 4 bars or whatever record into it and it makes a seamless loop, if you like the loop then record it into a live clip.
Key fact : remember that the looper is an effect, so if you want to record a clip of it you need use a different track to 'sample' the output.

just use 'audio input from' on a different track.

click the link in my sig to get it. you can donate me money if you use it more than 23 times, or something.

MashedBuddha · Post by **MashedBuddha** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 1:49 am

With the audio you could set the quantize high, above one bar, this would let you send the end-record command, earlier in the loop, which might make it more comfortable for you. If that doesn't work for you, I can definitely recommend getting a footpedal. They're great.

I changed over to using a footswitch and that's definitely better because it frees up my hands. It almost works great, because the footswitch sends to record command, end record, and then play loop. But I can't get the loop to start on the next downbeat right after I finish recording it. There has to be a way. If the loop would automatically continue playing after I hit end record, then I'd be all set. Any way to do that?

Re: midi loops, I somehow am able to do it now. THe problem is softsynths only output sound when I have monitor set to 'On.' And when I record the MIDI and then loop it, I can only hear it as long as it's still armed. If I unarm the MIDI track, I have to switch the monitor to 'Auto.' Then I can hear the recorded MIDI but I can no longer hear live playing of that synth.

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 2:18 am

MashedBuddha wrote:There has to be a way. If the loop would automatically continue playing after I hit end record, then I'd be all set. Any way to do that?

yes there is, but I don't know exactly what you're doing and when so it's a bit hard to determine... But once you hit record it should start recording on the next downbeat, if set to one bar. And likewise, if you hit record again while recording, then it should start playing back at the next downbeat - provided that you've set the monitor to Auto or Off.

MashedBuddha wrote: Re: midi loops, I somehow am able to do it now. THe problem is softsynths only output sound when I have monitor set to 'On.' And when I record the MIDI and then loop it, I can only hear it as long as it's still armed. If I unarm the MIDI track, I have to switch the monitor to 'Auto.' Then I can hear the recorded MIDI but I can no longer hear live playing of that synth.

If you load a simpler to a midi track, set monitor to Auto, and arm the track, you should be able to hear yourself play through the synth - does it work so far? Okay, now start recording on this track. Hit record again to end recording and start playback. Does this not work for you?

Best,
Andreas

MashedBuddha · Post by **MashedBuddha** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 2:38 am

yes there is, but I don't know exactly what you're doing and when so it's a bit hard to determine... But once you hit record it should start recording on the next downbeat, if set to one bar. And likewise, if you hit record again while recording, then it should start playing back at the next downbeat - provided that you've set the monitor to Auto or Off.

I have my footswitch assigned to the play/stop button at the bottom of an audio track. When that track is armed, it does record when I hit the foot switch, but when I hit it again, it just stops that track. I have to hit it a third time so that it plays. Set to one bar, and tried both auto and off. What am I doing wrong?

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 3:02 am

MashedBuddha wrote: I have my footswitch assigned to the play/stop button at the bottom of an audio track. When that track is armed, it does record when I hit the foot switch, but when I hit it again, it just stops that track. I have to hit it a third time so that it plays. Set to one bar, and tried both auto and off. What am I doing wrong?

you have to assign it to the play button that appears when you enter midi assign mode. See it?

ben_blue · Post by **ben_blue** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 3:03 am

think i got it.

whats your defualt clip launch?

toggle? - that will do what your describing.

i once tried toggle as defualt, that was a crappy week

MashedBuddha · Post by **MashedBuddha** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 3:33 am

think i got it.

whats your defualt clip launch?

toggle? - that will do what your describing.

You got it! Much better now. I had it set to toggle so I could easily start and stop loops from the trigger finger. But this is worth that tradeoff.

Now how to assign MIDI to the arrow keys so I can move around the clips (i.e. with the trigger finger).

MashedBuddha · Post by **MashedBuddha** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 3:47 am

or more importantly is there any way to have the footswitch always trigger recording in whatever audio track is selected at the time?

scottfro · Post by **scottfro** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 5:12 am

what kind of pedal do you have that sends midi data? i'm trying to do the same thing you are and free my hands up. would a pedal for my oxygen 8 send a midi signal that i could use to trigger loop record? thanks!

MashedBuddha · Post by **MashedBuddha** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 2:11 pm

would a pedal for my oxygen 8 send a midi signal that i could use to trigger loop record? thanks!

Most likely. Does it have a footswitch or footcontrol input? Then you just midi assign that to the record button on an armed track (it appears as a play button at the bottom of every track above the faders when in MIDI assign mode). Be wary of your pedal polarity settings as well.

My current conundrum is how to use that same single footswitch to record on any active track (I would simply keep them armed always). I can only assign to one track at a time it appears, and I don't want a bunch of footswitches.

scottfro · Post by **scottfro** » Sat Oct 08, 2005 3:51 am

MashedBuddha wrote:
would a pedal for my oxygen 8 send a midi signal that i could use to trigger loop record? thanks!
Most likely. Does it have a footswitch or footcontrol input? Then you just midi assign that to the record button on an armed track (it appears as a play button at the bottom of every track above the faders when in MIDI assign mode). Be wary of your pedal polarity settings as well.

My current conundrum is how to use that same single footswitch to record on any active track (I would simply keep them armed always). I can only assign to one track at a time it appears, and I don't want a bunch of footswitches.

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/EXP-main.html

this is the device i'm considering...what do you think?

i can see myself having the same perdicament as you. i'll have to test it out with just a midi signal coming from my keyboard and see where i can get.

MashedBuddha · Post by **MashedBuddha** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 5:11 am

As that is an expression pedal, it's not a good choice to send a quick trigger signal. A keyboard sustain pedal would work better and is what I use, but it's tricky because it sends two signals, one down and one when you release. I haven't had 100% success with it. Perhaps a better application would be to press down the footswitch, allowing for a different mode while depressed, where the keys on your MIDI keyboard are mapped to fuctions in Live until you release the pedal, where then the keyboard returns to normal and plays notes again. I don't even know if this is possible; I got the idea from the company I work for (KAT Percussion/Alternate Mode), who produces powerful MIDI percussion instruments with insane MIDI functionality barely seen in keyboards. I'll have to look into this further and get back to you.

aviavi · Post by **aviavi** » Mon Oct 10, 2005 10:39 pm

"But I can't get the loop to start on the next downbeat right after I finish recording it. There has to be a way. If the loop would automatically continue playing after I hit end record, then I'd be all set. Any way to do that?"

You can in Trigger mode, but I don't find this mode to be usefull because you can't stop a clip by pressing on the midi button designated for that clip. In other words - as far as I know - the only way to get a clip to stop in Trigger mode is to select another clip in the same track.

Toggle mode WILL stop by pressing again on the designated midi button. BUT in Toggle mode, playback of a newly recorded clip will not start immedicately.

What is sorely needed is a combination of Trigger and Toggle - "Triggle" mode. If you do a search, this has been a requested feature for a while. It would turn Live into a far more useable live looping machine: One button for record/play/stop.

Avi