Add new Scales Globally?

[Lumix]

So i was trying to add a new scale with the Scale MIDI Effect.
But it didnt show up globally (in midi clips and global scale feature).

I saved the Scale preset and then copied into the Core Library, deleted Ableton Database, to reforce a rescanning of the Core Library.

The FIle is there, but Ableton wont show it anywhere?

Is there something i do wrong or is it simply not possible?

Reading the Manual didnt help either ...

[Rivanni]

Preset made for the Scale MIDI effect can only be used with said effect.
You cannot add custom scales to the current clip scale lists.

[Lumix]

Preset made for the Scale MIDI effect can only be used with said effect.
You cannot add custom scales to the current clip scale lists.

thanks for the answer.

i find this a bit poor by Ableton to make global scales hardcoded.

a possible hack might be to go the extra mile over a scl file, made with Scala - but this looks super complicated.

Is there really no other way to use for example a octatonic scale? or even something more exotic, then what ableton offers? :/

or how about this, let us design our scales with the Scale MIDI effect and let us use them as a global scale?

[dontfret]

I went to use the global scale for the first time today for the specific purpose of having a custom global scale that was quickly changeable, like the microtonal scales...

+1!

[dontfret]

I thought I would post my current solution:

Live Scale 2.2 (free):
https://maxforlive.com/library/device/12857/live-scale

Nifty tool allows you to route midi to dynamically create global scales using the conductor patch. I make one-shot midi clips with the scale I want as a chord to be able to have a "chord bank." Then you put the unit patches on the tracks that you want to control. Lets you have up to 4 simultaneous global scales.

Unfortunately it is a partial solution as I have not found a way yet to allow the pitch tool to transpose by scale degrees within the custom scales.

My feature request list for a more thoughtfully implemented global scale awareness:
- Custom scales.
- Custom keyboard mapping (maybe .kbm?).
- No limits on notes per scale.
- Customizable number of notes per octave through the keyboard mapping.
- Integration with microtonal system so one could have scales within tuning systems that would make it easier to organize large systems into smaller sets of notes.

Hope this helps.

[chapelier fou]

I thought I would post my current solution:

Live Scale 2.2 (free):
https://maxforlive.com/library/device/12857/live-scale

Nifty tool allows you to route midi to dynamically create global scales using the conductor patch. I make one-shot midi clips with the scale I want as a chord to be able to have a "chord bank." Then you put the unit patches on the tracks that you want to control. Lets you have up to 4 simultaneous global scales.

Unfortunately it is a partial solution as I have not found a way yet to allow the pitch tool to transpose by scale degrees within the custom scales.

I'm the developer of Live Scale.
Not sure if I get your problem right, but what if you put the Pitch FX before the Scale Follower ?

[dontfret]

Hey! I kinda wanted to talk to you. I'm actually working on a max patch that uses the scale messages from your conductor to create a "scale degree" transposer like ableton's scale degree transposition mode.

Imagine this scenario:

you have a scale that is comprised of 7 notes, F#, G, G#, A, A#, B, C.

If I put the transposer before as I have to create chords, it will send, hypothetically, C E G B to the "unit" and you are left with:

C C G B

When what I want is the 1st degree, 3rd, 5th, and 7th, which in the scale above is:

F# G# A# C

Very different outcomes. I finished my transposer two days ago, but it didn't work quite right.

I also noticed an issue that some of my patches have that the units share, they don't like too many simultaneous notes. It tends to drop note-offs I think. Not sure if it is that or my chain...

Anyway thanks for helping me make music!!

[chapelier fou]

@dontfret :
I did receive your patches and had a very quick look. I can't really help right now, but I kind of see many reasons why your patches would not work properly.
First question is : how do you expect it to know which is the first degree ?
Also : your modifications probably introduce note-off dropping. It's actually quite tricky when you change the note sets while they are being held, because you have to track which note off is supposed to close which note on.

[dontfret]

Thanks for taking a look.

The way my patch works is that it creates an array of all the notes in the scale from octave 0 to 11, then it looks up the input note's index and increments or decrements the index based on the set interval and returns the note that is associated with that index. This part works.

The part that I'm having a bit of difficulty with is setting my global and local sends correctly so that there isn't unwanted crosstalk between duplicate patches.

For some reason I find max a bit more frustrating than PureData even though they're so similar.

I thought I'd share the patches with you in case you wanted to adopt it into your system, as it would be icing on the cake.

I have a feeling Ableton will fix this soon. They've actually fixed every issue I've had and added every feature I've requested in the last 6 years, which is sort of astonishing considering the esoteric nature of my requests.

Anyway thanks everyone!

[[jur]]

a possible hack might be to go the extra mile over a scl file, made with Scala - but this looks super complicated.

That's right. Just in case, here is Ableton's dedicated tool to make .scl files.

[dontfret]

I did manage create a global scale awareness system with custom scales. Special thanks to SZK and CF. I patched together their patches to make it work. It can set the scale with midi input, text box, or from the bank of scales. Can make scale degree chords or just transpose by scale degree by selecting only one transposer.

It currently only communicates 7 note or less scales.

It works well but is beta. PM if you are interested in helping refine it.

Hopefully ableton updates this soon!

[chapelier fou]

Happy to test, of course.

[dontfret]

Thank you!

The patches are about 40% your work, 40% SZK, and about 20% me, so thank you!