Calling all Live loopers! UnEvEn loop length issue

mariner · Post by **mariner** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:01 pm

I've read enough posts to know that there are a great many of us who use this software as a real-time looper/phrase sampler(not unlike the JamMan, Echoplex, Repeater, Boomerang, RC-20, etc.)

My question is this: Are any of you experiencing uneven loop lengths?

NOTE: this issue seems to be most prominent when running live in sync w/ another device. Although some have experienced this problem while flying solo.

A few months back, I started a thread in hopes of getting to the bottom of this issue, but alas, the problem still exists.

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

-respect

Post by **Alex** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:07 pm

Hi mariner,

would be helpful if you could check if you get this with the current Live beta too:
http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30728

regards,
/Alex

mariner · Post by **mariner** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:00 pm

Alex,

I tested 5.0.3b5 for about an hour last night and there wasn't a single unquantized loop. However, when I continued testing this morning, it wasn't long before the little buggers started showing up. In fact, I had one set where the first two loops were 0.3.3 intead of an even bar(I'm emailing that .alp file to Dom).

We gotta get to the bottom of this ASAP. it's just killing be staying back in ver. 4;

I wanna play w/ 5 like the rest of you.

be well,

-m

Groovecake · Post by **Groovecake** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:52 am

I had this same problem tonight when I had my computer running Live slaved with Live on my drummer's computer. When I would attempt to record a 2 bar loop, it consistantly came out at 1.3.3.

Here is the setup:

My computer - iBook 933, 1.2 GB RAM, Presonus Firepod, Live 5.0.2

His computer - Powerbook 333, M-Audio Quattro, Live 5.0.2

I tried the beta...same thing.

When we reversed the flow (I generated the click and his computer was the slave), my loops came out fine. However, this is a real big problem for us. We want to do it the other way around. After all, the drummer should send time.

Please advise.

mariner · Post by **mariner** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 2:46 pm

hey there Groovecake,

I've been experiencing this problem ever since ver. 5 came out and have been assured that the Abes are working on it.

I've spent close to 100 hours trying to find a concrete way to reproduce this and from what I can tell this bug has a mind of its own. I thought for sure it had something to do w/ ext. sync, but I've heard of folks experiencing this issue in "stand-alone" mode as well(see original post).

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... highlight=

Our set-up is similar to yours but w/ one small difference; both my computer and my drummer's are slaved to his midi drum brain.

Please keep us posted as to any discoveries you make.

We gotta get to the bottom of this ASAP!

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:35 pm

Wow i cant believe this! When i got my footpedal I was noticing that my recorded loops were showing odd length even though they sound ok. This could well be me being stupid and/or playing odd things but since others are experiencing similar things im getting curious.

Groovecake · Post by **Groovecake** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:23 pm

One thing I forgot to mention is that the loops I am attempting are audio loops, not MIDI. It seems that a lot of people have had this problem with MIDI loops. Well, it's audio too.

Mitch

mariner · Post by **mariner** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:25 pm

Meef Chaloin wrote:Wow i cant believe this! When i got my footpedal I was noticing that my recorded loops were showing odd length even though they sound ok. This could well be me being stupid and/or playing odd things but since others are experiencing similar things im getting curious.

are your loop lengths uneven, or is it just the track status display?

see post: http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30916

in other words, are you getting 1.3.3 instead of 4 in the clip view or is it just the "pie-chart" that's reading odd?

usually, if your getting actual uneven loops, the # in the track status display will be yellow and read something like 7+ instead of 8.

-M

mariner · Post by **mariner** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 5:35 pm

Groovecake wrote:One thing I forgot to mention is that the loops I am attempting are audio loops, not MIDI. It seems that a lot of people have had this problem with MIDI loops. Well, it's audio too.

Mitch

I'm looping audio as well.

My drummer is looping midi w/ out any problems what so ever; he only has issues when resampling, which would be audio.

-M

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 6:02 pm

mariner wrote:
Meef Chaloin wrote:Wow i cant believe this! When i got my footpedal I was noticing that my recorded loops were showing odd length even though they sound ok. This could well be me being stupid and/or playing odd things but since others are experiencing similar things im getting curious.
are your loop lengths uneven, or is it just the track status display?

see post: http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30916

in other words, are you getting 1.3.3 instead of 4 in the clip view or is it just the "pie-chart" that's reading odd?

usually, if your getting actual uneven loops, the # in the track status display will be yellow and read something like 7+ instead of 8.

-M

yes its the track display pie chart that's showing odd numbers. They're not odd as in they are in between a bar, just strange loops lenghs displayed when i thought it wouldve been even.

Like i said, this probably is just me being silly, i havent had a change to pursue it much & i was able to do the job i wanted (looped fine)so i guess its not a problem.

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 6:08 pm

just read that thread again, didnt realise it had been acknowledged.

Groovecake · Post by **Groovecake** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 6:57 am

Well, things have gotten worse.

Tonight, I started fresh and tried some different MIDI interfaces. In each case, with my iBook slaved to my drummer's Powerbook, my attempts at a two bar loop came out 1.3.3. This happened every time.

So, we installed Live on my drummer's iMac G5 which seemed to solve the problem. We had speculated that the problem might be caused by his older Powerbook.

We played live for about an hour or so straight. Everything was fine until suddenly the problem arose again...loops of 1.3.3, 3.3.3, 7.3.3, etc. Once it started doing it, it did it consistantly.

To summerize, slaving to the Powerbook 333, the uneven loops happen every time. Slaving to the iMac, it didn't happen until we had been playing for a while...but it did happen.

As I am sure I don't need to stress, this is a real problem. We are preparing to tour and we have built our whole show around using Live. Now we are not sure if this is an option. In some ways I am glad that other people have experienced this problem (not that I would wish problems on anyone). However, I kind of wish it was just user error. But I am pretty sure it's not.

I have contacted Ableton support and they responded right away. Hopefully we can reach a solution for this problem.