bidule vs. max/msp vs. reaktor vs ?

stratusseeker · Post by **stratusseeker** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 4:07 am

I liked the bed because I could keep my audio settings on soundflower and then use the handy menu bar to hear what I was doing and also send the audio somewhere else. Without it I have to change my audio settings if I want to hear what I'm doing.

computo · Post by **computo** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 4:55 am

no, just select Builtin audio for the second apps output.

select SF for the input, and Builtin audio for the output.

stratusseeker · Post by **stratusseeker** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 5:07 am

right, but it's the first app that I want to hear when I quit the second app or something goes wrong with the second app.

Laziness I know, not wanting to switch the first app's output, but it was a convenient way to do it.

dubbyah · Post by **dubbyah** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 5:36 am

Can max/msp host vsts?

computo · Post by **computo** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 6:52 am

yes it can. Its pretty sick too. you can route lfo's or ANYTHING to any parameter, you can go crazy like few other programs allow.

conny · Post by **conny** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:39 pm

computo wrote: you can route lfo's or ANYTHING to any parameter, you can go crazy like few other programs allow.

Do you mean internally in the MAX things or also to hosted VST's?

// C

computo · Post by **computo** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 4:05 pm

also, VST's hosted in Max.

Its crazy. Check out the demo...its AWESOME.

conny · Post by **conny** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 6:27 pm

Maybe, but after installing the demo, how do I get some action from Live?

Installing the MAX demo in the Live VST folder - Live just dies after some scanning.
Shit...

asintppc.dll seems to be the problem.

// C

computo · Post by **computo** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 6:41 pm

no man, you asked the wrong question.

Max cannot act as a vst in another program. Doesnt work that way.

You can get pluggo, and make vst's with that, but you have to use max through soundflower, or rewire. Frankly, it would dumb down max for it to act as a VST. Its far more powerful to do it the way I described.

I did that entire video with midi sent from Live into Max.

the whole Vst-hosting thing is really overrated in my opinion. Bidule gets away with it, because there isnt the range of possibilities that are in Max.

conny · Post by **conny** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 6:50 pm

computo wrote:no man, you asked the wrong question.
Max cannot act as a vst in another program. Doesnt work that way.

Bidule may be an VST and host other VST's.
What's wrong with that?

// C

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:00 pm

computo wrote: Frankly, it would dumb down max for it to act as a VST.

I'm sorry, I don't get this bit: Why is that "dumbing it down"?

You can't send any info over rewire that you can't send to a vst plugin, as far as I know.

computo · Post by **computo** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:41 pm

frankly, I dont expect non-max users to understand this,

but basically, Bidule is VERY limited in relation to Max. Max can do stuff, that cannot communicate with regular programs, without attentuation, and sometimes, that isnt desirable. basically, there are some projects that make sense to be turned into VST's, thats what pluggo is for.

But Max itself, has far too many options, and there are far too many other ways of getting it into Live, than to open it as a vst. that would cause more trouble than its worth.

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 7:53 pm

We're talking about vst functionality, I think it's a fair question, man. uhm, I guess I know bidule is limited

Now, what's this "causing trouble" you're talking about? I find the benefits of vsts quite nice, and full-featured, but then again I'm not controlling robots.

computo · Post by **computo** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 9:00 pm

by "causing trouble" I mean, Max is an event driven piece of software.

Without going too in depth, porting it as a vst is not necessary nor would it be a good thing. The cpu could be an issue, and you'd undoubtedly see all kinds of anomolies with the performance of max.

Lets just say, it would cause issues that no max user wants to contend with.

If you are really concerned about it, write to the max email list, or cycling74 themselves, and you'll likely get a response of some sort... probably more specific than I can get.

What it comes down to, is that max can serve these all these functions. Pluggo is how you create vsts with max. soundflower is another solution... basically, Cycling has thought about all of this stuff... PLuggo is there, so the final product will be stable, and for midi and all the other possibilities, just run max.

I really dont understand what the bunching panties are all about...just kidding!

stratusseeker · Post by **stratusseeker** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 10:01 pm

Does anyone have any good max patches for tweaking VST's? I loaded up the vst~ and help patch and see a lot of options. I'd love to see someone's patch that tweaks the VST in cool ways. Anyone got one they are willing to share?