Mastering

spiderprod · Post by **spiderprod** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:03 pm

forge wrote:
radeon wrote:Forget mastering yourself. mastering is high skill and cant be done by bedroom users of live.
twat

lol

spiderprod · Post by **spiderprod** » Tue Jan 17, 2006 9:06 pm

http://www.emasters.co.uk/

they do really good mastering for the price .

smog g · Post by **smog g** » Thu Jan 19, 2006 6:03 pm

i completely dig what inductive said. word!

lola · Post by **lola** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 1:21 am

Make a good mix is more important.

And what is mastering for most people? using a software plug called L3?...yuck.

Again, just make a good mix, and if u get a release somewhere with your tune, the company will master it for u by a pro.

Btw. and ask yerself if u are so stubbon to master yerself, for what medium will i master my stuff?

Vinyl and Cd are 2 complete different mediatypes.

djastroboy · Post by **djastroboy** » Fri Jan 20, 2006 6:47 pm

lola wrote:
Btw. and ask yerself if u are so stubbon to master yerself, for what medium will i master my stuff?

Vinyl and Cd are 2 complete different mediatypes.

What about "mastering" for a live performance where original material is intermingled with pre-produced material? Basically, what can you do at home to make your own stuff not stand out too starkly against a backdrop of already-mastered things?

atmofunk · Post by **atmofunk** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 11:15 pm

Angstrom wrote:If you want to begin to know what to do please evereyone, buy
The Bob Katz book

nice one -- just ordered it!

smog g · Post by **smog g** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:13 am

i would really love to see, that djastroboys post is being answered since its an interesting question which tickles me...

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 12:40 pm

what astroboy is asking about is 'competing with loudness of a commercial track' when on stage.
You can do this simply with multiband compressors, but the problem is what bob katz calls "wimpy loudness" IE there are no attacks as the wave has been flattened. Dynamics are about difference between decibels so this kind of flattening defeats the point, you will be as 'loud' as the mastered vinyl, but not as 'punchy'
this is where the art comes in, how do you get it loud without sacrificing punchy dynamics. Very tricky, but fortunately you dont have to get it absolutely right for live use, just good-ish for that system. A sound check is damn helpful for this.
Just dont expect the 'mastered' live output intended for a rig to sound excellent on a little portable cd player or in your car.

unsuccessful handshake · Post by **unsuccessful handshake** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 12:37 am

global goon said on this forum:

"to the mastering question:
each song on a seperate track. each track has EQ followed by PSP's vintage warmer.
[EDIT: i also use one track as a comparator, which is muted. i solo this track to compare it to the song im mastering at that time. for this case i'm using a track from my previous album - which was mastered professionally]"

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 4:06 pm

ok, i am totally new to this forum, so i like to give a little shout, HELLO.
i am in the music business since over 15 years, but that doesn't matter at all...

i have followed this discussion carefully and with joy.

but i like to add something, by ALL RESPECT and i am doing computer generated music myself... (mainly plus recording of live instruments) with Ableton and Logic. (being mainly a Producer) but putting some material through mediocre soundcards, monitor setups with bad or non room treatmeant from people without at least a decade, at least A DECADE of experience and some plugs or even outboard gear... is NOT MASTERING!!!

that doesn't mean, that it is not possible to tweak things very nicely and to be able to make them louder... and b much better sounding. but all this el cheapo stuff, including waves, yes 4000 dollar for the diamond bundle is dead cheap crap when it comes to real MASTERING, all of that stuff which says mastering on the label, like T-Racks or whatever, has absolut nothing, but nothing to do with mastering at all. ARRGGGHHHH!! sorry for that!

if you like to ignore that fact please do as you whish, but it shows simply that you operate on a very low level... bedroom mastering does not excist, it's just tweaking around, and yes you can come up with better results then without the tweak... no doubt at all.

cheers

SubFunk

if you want it REALLY mastered, give it to a pro mastering engineer, with a mastering monitoring system and room treatmeant!!! the experience and EARS (trained for decades to know what to listen for!!) and the GEAR to do mastering. i don't want to be nosy, specially i am totally new to this forum, but a real mastering EQ (just one of dozens of pieces, you need for REAL mastering!) cost more then probably most of US have worth of gear as a whole. a Weiss eq-1 mkII for example... that is mastering level!!!

i don't write this to offend anyone nor to come across as arrogant nor nosy ............. just to clarify the term "MASTERING"

smog g · Post by **smog g** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 4:26 pm

@subfink: what you write doesnt sound offending at all. its just you point of view and i think there is much truth in it due to the experience you have had over the last decades. but many of the people writing in this thread cannot afford giving their music away to professional mastering studios.
but they can afford plugins or standalone mastering software since the are connected to the net

what i would like to know is this: do you think the software like t-racks or the waves stuff is powerfull in the right hands or crappy however it is treated.
please dont come up with the "analog" myth

andy_slate · Post by **andy_slate** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 5:37 pm

hi there, im following this thread with interests.

i am a mastering engineer at chemistrystudio in budapest and i have to admit what most pro users say here:
go with a pro if you really wanna have a good hi-quality master for your track..!

no doubt, no software can replace any analogue tube/digital eq or compressor... softwares are getting better and better but the real thing is the iron. and of course, your ears gotta be trained well to achieve the maximum.

if anybody is interested in pro mastering, do not hesitate to PM me.

i work with the following equipment:

analogue:
-manley variable mu
-avalon 2055 eq
-prism maselec

digital:
-weiss eq1
-waves
-spl
-tc m6000

monitoring:
-yamaha ns10
-mackie hr 824
-atc 100 ltd

if you need to know more infos, get in touch with me!

have a nice weekend and happy music makin !

mortalengines · Post by **mortalengines** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 6:54 pm

I really like Ozone 3 & it is not too outrageously expensive - if you go to their site (Izotope.com...I think) they have a free mastering guide that is helpful too. I use Ozone for more than just mastering as well.

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 8:10 pm

hi smog g!!, you wrote:

what i would like to know is this: do you think the software like t-racks or the waves stuff is powerfull in the right hands or crappy however it is treated.

i am happy to give you my opinion, and by the way i am fully aware that most of the people, especially in the elctronic underground music genre, god bless it exists!!! (no i am not religious, urgh..) are not able to go to a serious mastering studio... that applies to some of my private projects i do as well (but i am aware of that i can hardly call it "real mastering" what is done during the aftermath to my tracks), if a client pays, it's a different story...

ok, i think that you can achieve very good results as you said in the right hands or with a lot of prax (everyone has to start somewhere, hey!!)

with apps like Sequia, Pyramix, Peak or Waveburner and similar 2track editors loaded with high quality plugs like Waves, Urs amongst others and yeah!! the UAD-1 card by Universal Audio...!!!!!!!! (the precision EQ on that card is even used by some pro MEs) most important however is a very decent monitor system, and foremost a very good ROOM TREATMENT, an accustically propper treatet room is half the business... simply because you can't tweak or fix things you don't hear!!! your ears and your skills are most important.

i personally IF would go that route*, i am certainly don't think much at all of any of the existing "all in one" solutions like T-racks, etc.
* i am on a mac and use peak plus high grade plugs for some tweaking.

and as i said already, it is possible to get really good results, and undoubtly an improvement going... but i still would not consider it as a "full blown mastering" it's a very skillfull business, that's why some people (mastering engineers) dedicate there whole energy and ear training on just, well, mastering.

because you really have to learn how to listen to a track in order to be able to really apply "a mastering process" this is just something which comes with time... prax, prax, prax and again prax.

andy_slate wrote:

i am a mastering engineer at chemistrystudio in budapest and i have to admit what most pro users say here:
go with a pro if you really wanna have a good hi-quality master for your track..!

yes, i back this up 100% i have heard real WONDERS being done to tracks from good MEs, it's worth the money if you can afford it. there is nothing like a killer mastering for a track that really means something to you.

oh, i nearly forgott you wrote also:

please dont come up with the "analog" myth

i have to disapoint you. yes plugs are very powerfull and fantastic sounding our days and they get better and better (like andy_slate stated), but talking top notch production or for that matter mastering, nothing but nothing touches a manly massive passive or a weiss eq or a crane... this is still a different league alltogether!!!

happy tweakin'
cheers
Subfunk

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Sun Jan 29, 2006 9:10 am

i have to apologise, i did missread that:

please dont come up with the "analog" myth

i was thinking of outboard gear in general not just analog stuff, the weiss eq1 mkII for example is digital, but still certain outboard devices like that one, can't be compared to even the best plugs. (and there are fantastic good plugs around!)

and there is something else i like to add on, one other reason, except the higher quality of plugs avialable for 2track editors, why i recommend those over all in one solutions, is that you are not stucked after an investment with the development of one particular company, there is more room and possibiltys for upgrading and future improvement, like new upcoming plugs from 3rd party developers and most importantly you can't run the UAD-1 which is undoubtly pretty much the finest software solution... (sonic quality compared to the price you pay!!! and it contains the best sounding EQ (the precision EQ, for the purpose we are talking about) those plugs coming on there own PCI card and taking zero CPU load of your DAW.*

* there are not usable for laptops, though...

cheers