Logic as SLAVE program...?

buchnaner · Post by **buchnaner** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 7:50 pm

for those of you experienced in rewiring with Logic... I've been reading that its impossible to have Ableton as MASTER and Logic as SLAVE

if this is true, what's the point of having both of them? i want to use the ableton interface with all of my Logic instruments and plug in effects.

is there any way around this?

if this is true, are there ANY positives to having Logic being the MASTER with Ableton as SLAVE?

any input is appreciated....thanks

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:14 pm

yupp it's true i am afraid, logic can only be the master towards all other rewired applications, logic is the don, king under audio apps (IMHO), but apart from my opinion it would make hardly any sense, to rewire the strongest application as a slave.

i know that you are keen on having logics instruments avialable, but that is only possible if logic is rewired as the master...

cheers

brainray · Post by **brainray** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 8:55 pm

Thanks buchnaner for that question, I've been asking that a few years ago, and got only strange replies...

While it's true that Logic is at least the wannabe king of audio apps (Protools is), it is in many situations easier to work with Live (working with less than 50 tracks in an arrangement) IMHO.

So, what if you want just the nice softsynths from Logic, like the superloverly ES2? No way! Of course Emapple won't change that, because it would be a lot of work, and there are only very few users requesting this, the most people can't even understand why you would be wanting this.

Cheers

Ray

buchnaner · Post by **buchnaner** » Sat Feb 18, 2006 11:42 pm

i see no benefits of logic as master, live as slave. for me live IS the interface. if i cant use it, what good is it?!

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 5:37 am

mcconaghy · Post by **mcconaghy** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 3:23 pm

Just bounce all your Logic instrument tracks and import them to Live. The only way to get around the fact that, like ProTools, Cubase, Sonar and all other DAWs, Logic can only be the Rewire master.
I believe, if you search this forum for "options.txt", you'll find a way to turn Live's "Rewire Slave" option off, then you can use Soundflower to route the audio from Logic into Live.

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 5:50 pm

mcconaghy wrote:Just bounce all your Logic instrument tracks and import them to Live. The only way to get around the fact that, like ProTools, Cubase, Sonar and all other DAWs, Logic can only be the Rewire master.
I believe, if you search this forum for "options.txt", you'll find a way to turn Live's "Rewire Slave" option off, then you can use Soundflower to route the audio from Logic into Live.

You don't have to, and I'm pretty sure you can't, turn rewire off. You can use Soundflower, or JACK in combination with the built in IAC MIDI in OSX to play and record Logic instruments in Live. It's a bit of PITA, but once you're done, it works.

mcconaghy · Post by **mcconaghy** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 6:13 pm

Machinesworking wrote:
mcconaghy wrote:Just bounce all your Logic instrument tracks and import them to Live. The only way to get around the fact that, like ProTools, Cubase, Sonar and all other DAWs, Logic can only be the Rewire master.
I believe, if you search this forum for "options.txt", you'll find a way to turn Live's "Rewire Slave" option off, then you can use Soundflower to route the audio from Logic into Live.
You don't have to, and I'm pretty sure you can't, turn rewire off. You can use Soundflower, or JACK in combination with the built in IAC MIDI in OSX to play and record Logic instruments in Live. It's a bit of PITA, but once you're done, it works.

Sure, that works too. I'm just thinking that, given Live's resource use on the Mac, it might overwhelm older computers. Bouncing is kinda idiot-proof, and won't force the computer to its knees.

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 7:05 pm

mcconaghy wrote:Sure, that works too. I'm just thinking that, given Live's resource use on the Mac, it might overwhelm older computers. Bouncing is kinda idiot-proof, and won't force the computer to its knees.

Truth, and honestly if you are starting out a song, it really is best to rewire Live to Logic, and get that extra 40% that Logic has compared to Live in terms of CPU. You can render to Live until the songs done, then use Live, live.

mcconaghy · Post by **mcconaghy** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 8:13 pm

Machinesworking wrote:
mcconaghy wrote:Sure, that works too. I'm just thinking that, given Live's resource use on the Mac, it might overwhelm older computers. Bouncing is kinda idiot-proof, and won't force the computer to its knees.
Truth, and honestly if you are starting out a song, it really is best to rewire Live to Logic, and get that extra 40% that Logic has compared to Live in terms of CPU. You can render to Live until the songs done, then use Live, live.

That's how I do it

exaltron · Post by **exaltron** » Fri Mar 03, 2006 5:08 pm

This has been an ongoing problem for me as I have spent all my money and time developing sounds in Logic, but I use Live for performing and need all the tempo change, looping functions that Live has. I've tried wiring Logic's output to Live with JACK (not the most user-friendly app, but it's free and it works consistently when you get the config right). The problem with JACK is that the only possible configuration involves routing all Audio through it, not just Logic, and then you end up with what is for me an unacceptable amount of latency- I spent hours trying to fix this, but I don't think it's possible.
Ultimately I went back to the "idiot-savant" fix that I came up with originally which was to route the digital out of Logic out to analog (I have a MOTU interface with 8 i/os), through a mixer and then back in to Live. It's absolutely retarded, but in terms of CPU load and latency it's the best solution I've come up with.
As far as recording, when I need the sounds I do tend to bounce stuff as previous posters suggested.

scott

11 minute continuous mix of live trumpet and guitar improv with two electro hip-hop songs: www.exaltron.com/mp3s/exaltrondotcom.mp3

LOFA · Post by **LOFA** » Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:07 pm

exaltron wrote: Ultimately I went back to the "idiot-savant" fix that I came up with originally which was to route the digital out of Logic out to analog (I have a MOTU interface with 8 i/os), through a mixer and then back in to Live. It's absolutely retarded, but in terms of CPU load and latency it's the best solution I've come up with.

I went so far as to buy optic cable but I haven't been able to get this method to work yet on either my fw1814 or fw1884.

Speaking of busy, my version of LP7.2 came in the mail last week and I haven't even installed it. My number one reason for this aquistion was its better control of my tascasm fw1884, but I am interested in the ability to send stereo rewires. This should make soundflower more uasable for me. If what you say about audio jack is true, then my former theoretical workaround of using both jack and soundflower would not work (though there is always a way!)

If you just use soundflower, everything is fine. I breathed an enormous sigh of contentment the last time I tested using live only as an interface and used logic for plugins. I had a lot going on at once. It was distracting with only one screen, but an impressive jump in ability. Once I get the stereo pair tested out I will try and post some results. Could be a bit though 'cause it's vacation time! Whoo-hoo!

exaltron · Post by **exaltron** » Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:06 pm

LOFA wrote:
exaltron wrote: Ultimately I went back to the "idiot-savant" fix that I came up with originally which was to route the digital out of Logic out to analog (I have a MOTU interface with 8 i/os), through a mixer and then back in to Live. It's absolutely retarded, but in terms of CPU load and latency it's the best solution I've come up with.
If you just use soundflower, everything is fine. I breathed an enormous sigh of contentment the last time I tested using live only as an interface and used logic for plugins. I had a lot going on at once. It was distracting with only one screen, but an impressive jump in ability. Once I get the stereo pair tested out I will try and post some results. Could be a bit though 'cause it's vacation time! Whoo-hoo!

I did try soundflower and I can't remember what exactly the problem was, but I couldn't quite get the config I wanted and gave up, perhaps prematurely. My setup involves routing the audio of Logic into Live so that it can be monitored realtime and looped as Live plays out to the interface. If soundflower works without the latency issue (though this seems unlikely) it would definitely be preferable in terms of CPU headroom. The digital>analog>digital solution definitely takes some serious memory.

If I were sane, I would probably just suck it up and buy Operator and create all my synth sounds from scratch again, but it just seems so unjust..

LOFA · Post by **LOFA** » Sat Mar 04, 2006 5:41 am

exaltron wrote:
LOFA wrote:
exaltron wrote: Ultimately I went back to the "idiot-savant" fix that I came up with originally which was to route the digital out of Logic out to analog (I have a MOTU interface with 8 i/os), through a mixer and then back in to Live. It's absolutely retarded, but in terms of CPU load and latency it's the best solution I've come up with.
If you just use soundflower, everything is fine. I breathed an enormous sigh of contentment the last time I tested using live only as an interface and used logic for plugins. I had a lot going on at once. It was distracting with only one screen, but an impressive jump in ability. Once I get the stereo pair tested out I will try and post some results. Could be a bit though 'cause it's vacation time! Whoo-hoo!
I did try soundflower and I can't remember what exactly the problem was, but I couldn't quite get the config I wanted and gave up, perhaps prematurely. My setup involves routing the audio of Logic into Live so that it can be monitored realtime and looped as Live plays out to the interface. If soundflower works without the latency issue (though this seems unlikely) it would definitely be preferable in terms of CPU headroom. The digital>analog>digital solution definitely takes some serious memory.

If I were sane, I would probably just suck it up and buy Operator and create all my synth sounds from scratch again, but it just seems so unjust..

whoa... so may things to respond to:

I have trouble hearing someone say that the $100 bucks or so that Operator costs is too much. LIve is a small company. They made so many of our dreams come true. If we can drop 500-1000 on LP7, what's 100(+/-)$? Especially if you are paying brooklyn rent! ( I grew up in Flatbush/Bayridge/ParkSlope/LES BTW) You could either look at it as 200 gray's papaya dirty water dogs, or a hot date with sushi.

There are other options though, but here is the real truth: You have a mac.
I am assuming that you have either a G5 or powerbook, but if you have a macintel my advice from this point on may be moot (hell-it could already be!)

Reason does not cost much more. It is easy and goes together with Live like fish and the sea. Even on a mac you will get seriously cool results. This is purely MIDI though.

Machinate likes Reaktor, and if Machinate ever decides he wants US citizenship I will find him a wife- Just kidding.

That being said, reaktor costs about the same as reason and from what I hear it rewires very well on a mac, but eats cpu like red ants in a leper colony (I'm going to hell for that one

)

Now the problem here is that you say you want to route audio into Live from Logic, and have it manipulated by Live. Hmmm. Does that mean that once you have recorded it in live you want to continue to manipulate it from Live? I ask you this, because you can only pitch/time alter prerecorded stuff *(see- smart-electronix/madshifta) in Live. So, couldn't you just record audio from Logic into Live, complete with all of the CPU friendly dressing, and just manipulate it in Live? This is especially easy if you setup your recording preferences in Live (I believe under the miscelaneous tab.)

So, you already have the most cpu-efficient program for your mac-Logic. It is hard for me to explain how many toys you can use at once in the Live environment once you get it working right with Soundflower (which one of us will help you with if you need it.)

There are also ways of using midiclock (freeware) to get midi tighter. I haven't had to use this yet.

So blah blah blah. I hope some of this helped. Operator is bad-ass. I think you should buy it. It's really cool, and it would make Robert Henke happy. Think of it as a really nice tip for incredible service. Or think of it as a very capable synth that comes with the entire magnitudinal velocity of the Ableton Forums community behind it. Were all pretty swell ourselves.

Vacation started 40 minutes ago.

Jordan Vesteyo · Post by **Jordan Vesteyo** » Sat Mar 04, 2006 10:36 pm

The easiest ways we have found to use Live with logic, is to start a project in Live, rewire into logic and mix it and add more intruments and plugins. Logic 7.2 supports full stereo rewire objects, which Live outputs. Once they are rewired you can still use the Live plugins. You will need a dual G5 to do this, but two programs running is going to be processor intensive anyway. Now If you want to get audio out of Logic there are three extremely easy ways to do it. 1. solo the channel and use the bounce button on the output. 2. Under the File > Export... menu, 'export all tracks as audio' , all tracks in the Arrange Page are rendered out to seperate audio files. 3. The easiest of all is to use under the File > Export... menu choose, 'export region as audio file'. This works for both audio and midi regions. Very easy.

J

Logic as SLAVE program...?

Logic as SLAVE program...?

Ableton as MASTER and Logic as SLAVE

Re: Ableton as MASTER and Logic as SLAVE

Re: Ableton as MASTER and Logic as SLAVE

Re: Ableton as MASTER and Logic as SLAVE