Kinda disappointed about 3 features...

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Sep 18, 2003 6:22 pm

he is right!

mp3 compression is file compression

PA compression is audio compression

I cant even believe this sort of thing is missunderstood on this kind of site

fakeproject · Post by **fakeproject** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 2:25 am

OK- those of you who want MP3 support to save space-

ARE YOU RETARDED?????

if your computer is crappy, and you can't store like 10gb
of wav files, then there's NO WAY IN HELL you could possibly
run multiple tracks of MP3's!! You'd need a gig of ram or better.
I'd be willing to bet that your motherboards wouldn't even handle
that much RAM. Hard drives are cheap. Less than 1$ american
per gigabyte. If you were really "serious" about making music,
YOU'D BUY A DECENT HARD DRIVE! come on.

If you're willing to use MP3 compression, why don't you just
downsample your .wav files? like 22050, 16bit, mono? It's
gonna sound pretty close.

And really, kids, do we want Cubase? Live doesn't need VSTI support.
look at the myriad of great apps that already have it- that connect
with live beautifully. particularly Reason.

If you're not happy with Live yet, SURPRISE!!! Live is NOT the app
for YOU. YOU WANT CUBASE or some crappy DJ program.
There is simply nothing like Live out there, with such a great simple
playable, stable, wonderful, fanferf%ckintastic interface. And you
keep whining for Ableton to bung it all up with crap.

Have you ever read the screen when Live starts up? It says
"Sequencing Instrument"
NOT VSTI host. Not buggy piece of trash. It's a new concept.
It's not another crappy POS sequencer. It's a really, really great thing.
Live's midi implementation is superb- it just works.

I am steadfastly anti-VSTI.

hat · Post by **hat** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 2:46 am

I have to agree with fakeproject. What more do you need when you can pipe Reason in Live. Whatever happened to doing the most with what you have, and the combination of these 2 apps is sonically lethal, there isn't much you can't do. If recording audio from live instruments is need, then slave these 2 to a Rewire host, like Cubase or ProTools and strum away.

On the other hand, what I would like to see, is video support. Sonic Foundry managed to do it for years now with ACID, so I'd imagine the Abletons can certainly add this to the to-do list. A simple Quicktime import (.mov, mpeg, etc.) for working on music for commercials and post, which is what I do. Of course, I can do it in ProTools, but when I'm out of the house, video support in Live would be a blessing.

As for mp3 vs. Aiff, well it's clear that if you want your music to sound good, you wouldn't even consider it an option. Uncompressed is the way to go. A 120G FW drive now costs a mere $200. Why compromise?

Deadbeat · Post by **Deadbeat** » Fri Sep 19, 2003 1:17 pm

While I'm not quite ready to be as "blunt" in my response to this as fake project,l I'm getting there : )

Whenever these issues of VSTi and enhanced MIDI support come up, I can't help but feel people are missing a great opportunity to allow Live's revolutionary feature set to influence the way they work for the better. There are a million and one applications out there that promise to "seamlessly integrate" all aspects of the music production process. Anyone who has been at this for any amount of time will tell you this is always a marketing line and far from the truth.

Recognize the strengths of the tools at your disposal, as well as the ways that you feel most comfortable working, and use the best tool for each individual job.

DeADBEAT

noisetonepause · Post by **noisetonepause** » Sat Sep 20, 2003 6:11 pm

Fakeproject - I agree with your message.

But I don't appreciate you coming here unregistered yelling and screaming at other Live users whose opinions on the possible future for this software are just as valid as your own. Please play nice, and please register so as to signal that you're part of this community. You're more than welcome since you're on the right side

-Paws

nerveagent · Post by **nerveagent** » Sun Sep 21, 2003 12:14 pm

fakeproject wrote: If you're not happy with Live yet, SURPRISE!!! Live is NOT the app
for YOU. YOU WANT CUBASE or some crappy DJ program.
There is simply nothing like Live out there, with such a great simple
playable, stable, wonderful, fanferf%ckintastic interface. And you
keep whining for Ableton to bung it all up with crap.

I agree. I still can't get my head around whay people want VSTi in Live. There are some features I'd like Live to have though, some to do with the 'fanfkkrtastic' interface, whcih definitely can be improved!

- know what a right mouse button is. not have to highlight-element, click Ctrl-E, enter name, press enter, to rename a track or a clip. Waaaayyyyy to many keystrokes. Context menus solve this sort of thing. Context menus are not evil.

- 'performance mode' so it doesn't ask me if i want to save the track i mucked around with when i load another. a performance mode would assume i will make changes that are completely transient unless i deliberately perform a save action.

- have some way to cross-fade live songs. i store my work one-song one-file. each song is a whole bunch of little clips that i trigger with midi from my novation remote 25. I'd like the ability to be able to have preset little section in each song that can be cross-faded with the one already playing, when i load the new one. or something like that.

- midi clips. i'd love some sort of ability to store short midi clips so i can use live to trigger my nord modular.

- ability to have a small pre-loop section of a clip, which i think is a feature that's coming? also the ability to start a track on beat 3 or 4 of bar -1; not on beat 1 of bar 1. I know you can sort of fake this with the clips, but, the issue is, i want to make the bar/beat indicator *accurate*, ie the intro is 8 bars and 2 beats long, but at the transition to the first verse we are at the start of bar 9, not bar 10 or bar 9.3

fakeproject · Post by **fakeproject** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 5:30 am

noisetonepause:
my apologies, to you and to the community-
i was out of line using capital letters and rough
language in my post.
i will not register, for personal reasons- but,
my opinion remains unchanged. i guess i felt
i had to yell because of the sheer number of
voices saying what i felt was an absurd thing.
fakeproject.

epiphanius · Post by **epiphanius** » Sat Sep 27, 2003 4:07 pm

Nerveragent -

I sure agree with your current batch of requested improvements, especially context menus. I suppose the lack of these is to do with Live's Macintosh roots. I know you can use a two button mouse with a Mac. But I can't believe they still came with single button as standard.

e.

Amberience · Post by **Amberience** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 1:18 am

In my opinion Live is well suited as a rewire master with Reason and Project 5.

So i'd advise getting them for VSTi, drum machines and stuff. Only thing i do not like is that you cannot run audio through the Reason 2.5 effects online - you have to bounce it all down and import it into the NNXT.

It would be cool if you could do that though.

muthafunka · Post by **muthafunka** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 12:49 am

epiphanius wrote:Nerveragent - I know you can use a two button mouse with a Mac.

4-button, trackball and scrollwheel on the Macs here

epiphanius wrote:Nerveragent
But I can't believe they still came with single button as standard.

I'll give you that one, though learning keystrokes from the get-go is never a bad thing

nik

nerveagent · Post by **nerveagent** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 8:41 am

muthafunka wrote:
epiphanius wrote:Nerveragent - I know you can use a two button mouse with a Mac.
4-button, trackball and scrollwheel on the Macs here

epiphanius wrote:Nerveragent
But I can't believe they still came with single button as standard.
I'll give you that one, though learning keystrokes from the get-go is never a bad thing

nik

ahh but see my example re: editing a name of a clip, scene or track. it's a right royal pain.

regs
nerveagent

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Oct 16, 2003 3:35 am

six_wax wrote:
Anonymous wrote: what are you talking about? MP3 compression is completely different than compression on a PA. I don't see how this could cause anything to be out of phase.

I've played hundreds of MP3s out with no real noticeable sacrifice in sound quality. Granted, most were encoded at 256+, but still--your argument makes no sense to me.
eh... if you can't hear the difference, well...

I'm not saying I can't hear the difference--I can. I was taking exception to the argument that says MP3s put things out of phase and sound like crap on a big system. Yes they don't sound as good as full bitrate, uncompresed files. But phase cancellation or interaction has nothing to do with it.

vashremix · Post by **vashremix** » Thu Oct 16, 2003 4:04 am

hat wrote:.

On the other hand, what I would like to see, is video support. Sonic Foundry managed to do it for years now with ACID, so I'd imagine the Abletons can certainly add this to the to-do list. A simple Quicktime import (.mov, mpeg, etc.) for working on music for commercials and post, which is what I do. Of course, I can do it in ProTools, but when I'm out of the house, video support in Live would be a blessing.

Hey - I had felt the same way - there is a non-ableton way of dealing with quicktime files through rewire though.

Check out 'revision' http://www.grantedsw.com/revision/
It's $30, but it may help you out! :)

Regards,
Vash

dpel · Post by **dpel** » Thu Oct 16, 2003 4:45 am

fakeproject wrote:OK- those of you who want MP3 support to save space-

ARE YOU RETARDED?????

if your computer is crappy, and you can't store like 10gb
of wav files, then there's NO WAY IN HELL you could possibly
run multiple tracks of MP3's!! You'd need a gig of ram or better.
I'd be willing to bet that your motherboards wouldn't even handle
that much RAM. Hard drives are cheap. Less than 1$ american
per gigabyte. If you were really "serious" about making music,
YOU'D BUY A DECENT HARD DRIVE! come on.

If you're willing to use MP3 compression, why don't you just
downsample your .wav files? like 22050, 16bit, mono? It's
gonna sound pretty close.

And really, kids, do we want Cubase? Live doesn't need VSTI support.
look at the myriad of great apps that already have it- that connect
with live beautifully. particularly Reason.

If you're not happy with Live yet, SURPRISE!!! Live is NOT the app
for YOU. YOU WANT CUBASE or some crappy DJ program.
There is simply nothing like Live out there, with such a great simple
playable, stable, wonderful, fanferf%ckintastic interface. And you
keep whining for Ableton to bung it all up with crap.

Have you ever read the screen when Live starts up? It says
"Sequencing Instrument"
NOT VSTI host. Not buggy piece of trash. It's a new concept.
It's not another crappy POS sequencer. It's a really, really great thing.
Live's midi implementation is superb- it just works.

I am steadfastly anti-VSTI.

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dpel

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Oct 16, 2003 6:22 am

It doesn't need sequencing to implement VSTi's. All that's needed are for them to show up as with any other input in the track I/O drop down selector with MIDI routed to it and they can be played live. No need to break the concept of it being a live instrument with things like sequencing of MIDI, I whole heartedly agree. It extends it as an isntrument though, keyboard or MIDI guitar controller triggering VSTi's LIVE and capturing clips LIVE. A whole plethora of LIVE sounds to be captured, rather than JUST prepared clips from a library but as an ADJUNCT to them. You know, noises that are made up and clipped LIVE. No sequencing required by MID, use MIDI for what it is good at as CONTROLLER. LIVE. Just an extension of the LIVE automatuion really.

Kinda disappointed about 3 features...

rewire quicktime