[OT] day without immigrants?

NewSc2 · Post by **NewSc2** » Mon May 01, 2006 9:54 pm

Wow, here goes again.

Legal and illegal immigrants are protesting the latest bill which can make it a criminal felony for illegal immigrants to be here. I don't know about you guys but I live in Southern California where, not to be racist, but it seems like 30-50% of all workers here are Mexican.

I used to help run a factory that my father owned, and I can tell you that (not to be racist again) the Mexican workers were the most hardworking ones in the whole factory. They're legal immigrants but many came over illegally and eventually beat the system to obtain citizenship or a green card. What would it look like on their record if they were suddenly felons because they were just trying to find a job?

At least where I live, the boycott is significant. Traffic was at an all-time low, and many of my friends aren't working because the company didn't have enough people to work so they're taking the day off.

All this BS about them not paying taxes is pretty lame too.

Have you any idea how much they boost our economy? They take all the worst, lowest-paying jobs we have to offer (manual labor, fast-food chefs, janitorial, delivery, etc.) so us educated folk can reap in their labor and make profit. Many of them do pay taxes, and in fact they can't file for tax return, so many of their unclaimed tax returns are sitting in the government's coffers.

EDIT: Reading again, mostly *legal* immigrants are protesting the bill. Don't know about what all the sites are reporting but I was just speaking with a few of my mexican friends about this, which some are and some aren't boycotting (they work in hospitals).

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Mon May 01, 2006 10:24 pm

Hey guys

Undocumented citizens do pay taxes - they buy stuff like every one else at the super market, corner store etc

also, most illegals have to obtain a fake social security number to work in most places so...on their pay stubs they pay taxes just like me and you

however, unlike me and you they don't get any of that money back

also, on their paystubs they pay into social security which they will never be able to access

just some things to think about

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Mon May 01, 2006 10:26 pm

thelike5 wrote:If you are not a contributing taxpayer, who can help better schools, roads, or programs designed to help the physically sick and needy, then fuck off. Your living in this Country illegally and have the balls to complain? What other country in the world would put up with this? And don't even get me started on the people who are chicken hawking on them and paying them low wages. All the more reason to educate yourself and become a legit citizen and stop allowing yur self to be taken advantage of.

I think you guys just don't get it? Do you think America hands out work VISAs to mexicans at request? It's not that easy, in fact it's dammed near impossible... hence the illegals. Couple that with the fact that GWB an co. like having them around to do all the labor, and you have a problem...
I work in construction, and I'm directly affected by illegal workers, wages are being driven down. People often ask why I don't have a few illegals working for me. My response is simple, when the US loosens the work VISA laws, and they are able to pay taxes, and must demand a higher wage, then sure.
People should be upset that it's too hard for mexicans and other people from south of here to get a work VISA, and that GWB has crippled the INS. It should be the other way around IMO.

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Mon May 01, 2006 10:28 pm

What adonis said too!

In my line of work, people will pay them cash, and just claim the hours etc. as their own, therefore driving down the price of construction.... lower bids, and a poorer working class. That's what I was talking about.

john gordon · Post by **john gordon** » Mon May 01, 2006 10:58 pm

you guys are just jealous cause all the best djs are hispanic.
little louie vega,HIPP-E,carlos santana etc.

jackmazzotti · Post by **jackmazzotti** » Mon May 01, 2006 11:41 pm

they apper to have little to no interest in assimilating

or learning english

America is nothing more than a job market to these people

they are all waving Mexican and Dominican republic flags

go back there if its so great

otherwise learn the language and culture of the country your in
(guess what if i move to another country I will learn their language.. its something called respect)

my great grandparents did

funny how its on commie day
sorry i meant may day

Jack

computo · Post by **computo** » Tue May 02, 2006 12:17 am

commie day.

simp.

jackmazzotti · Post by **jackmazzotti** » Tue May 02, 2006 1:47 am

who really wants them to be illegal?

that businesses that want super cheap labor
more money for them

metaforensics · Post by **metaforensics** » Tue May 02, 2006 2:04 am

The bill doesn't just make it a felony for the illegals, but anyone who harbors them..Its not just the illegals getting mad, but ppl who have relatives who are illegal, that might catch that felony also..So by ppl going to jail is to solve it, because we will still being be paying for them yet they will not be productive as they were before...I'm totally for watever country you go to stay in learn the language, and whatnot, but thi problem didn't happen over nite..Our government allowed it to happen...Its not just mexicans either...Maybe where your from, but go to the bay (San Francisco), and you might be talkin about the Asian community where its more prelvalent..Or the east coast italions or Europeans in general..This affects any immigrant..i full agree on going through the legal way of doings..But our government enjoyed reaping the benefits of these working famalies, and low wages, and now when the ppl start complain..Mr Dubya wants to do something, after the problem is full blown..Well i hope daddy can help him fix this one..

John Sweet · Post by **John Sweet** » Tue May 02, 2006 2:43 am

The boycott shut a lot of things down here, esp restaurants & construction from what I heard, and the march took over downtown for a while.
And really, all the people chiming in on this from their air-conditioned home studios where they spend too much time worrying about the musical flavor of the month don't really need to speak about this. I can't remember who said it, but it's true:

"The cry of the poor may not always be just, but if you don't listen, you'll never know what justice is."

Illegal immigration is an institution that has been protected and allowed to grow by hypocritical business owners and politicians who profit from it. You don't just say "stop," because that punishes the innocents in the middle and on the bottom. I'm all for doing something to fix the way things are, but that has to come from a place of knowledge, not a purely emotional bias about race or class.

AdamJay · Post by **AdamJay** » Tue May 02, 2006 3:19 am

we went out to dinner tonight at the only Mexican restaurant that was open, which was fortunately our favorite one anyway.

But when i heard about the day of rest thing, i couldn't help but think of John Tuturo's character "Jesus Quintana" in The Big Lebowski

the part where he's like:

What's this "day of rest" shit, man?!

What is this bullshit, man?
I don't fucking care!
It don't matter to Jesus!

snowtires · Post by **snowtires** » Tue May 02, 2006 12:18 pm

metaforensics wrote:The bill doesn't just make it a felony for the illegals, but anyone who harbors them..Its not just the illegals getting mad, but ppl who have relatives who are illegal, that might catch that felony also..So by ppl going to jail is to solve it, because we will still being be paying for them yet they will not be productive as they were before...I'm totally for watever country you go to stay in learn the language, and whatnot, but thi problem didn't happen over nite..Our government allowed it to happen...Its not just mexicans either...Maybe where your from, but go to the bay (San Francisco), and you might be talkin about the Asian community where its more prelvalent..Or the east coast italions or Europeans in general..This affects any immigrant..i full agree on going through the legal way of doings..But our government enjoyed reaping the benefits of these working famalies, and low wages, and now when the ppl start complain..Mr Dubya wants to do something, after the problem is full blown..Well i hope daddy can help him fix this one..

well, wouldn't they just deport those people? granted, they'd be hiding in a hollowed-out truck bed and back in the states in no time, but still. yeah, they're supported by greedy american business men, but that still doesn't excuse the fact that, whether this bill passes or not, they are committing a crime. just because they have family here doesn't make it ok. that seems to be the main point that people are making, that locking up or deporting illegal immigrants will split up families. that's part of the risk your parents and grandparents took by coming here when they knew it wasn't allowed. the 'but i have kids now!' argument doesn't work for any other crime, what makes immigration law any different? your kids are citizens because they were born here, awesome, good for them. but you knew what you were getting into, you knew this might happen, don't be surprised when it does.

how's that old cliche go? do the crime, do the time? if your existence in this country is 100% illegal, you don't get the right to complain when MY government (i.e. not illegal immigrants' government, which, last time i checked was primarily mexico's government) decides to punish you a little bit more harshly than they did before. punishing the people harboring a criminal is a standard clause for every punishment. as an american citizen, it's *supposed* to be your duty to report a crime, no matter how you feel about the crime or how you feel about the person perpetrating the crime. end of story.

in these times of mass hysteria and terrorism, keeping people who shouldn't be here out is one of the only ways we have to try and fight another attack on our soil. of course, i doubt mexicans are going to go on a jihad anytime soon, but you can't make exceptions for something like that. by requiring people to go through customs, to get a passport, to register the fact that they're here, it's easier for us to protect ourselves. i'm not for illegal wiretapping and all of that, but we need to do something. i read somewhere that the next wave of terrorists is likely to cross over into the us from mexico. hell, they're probably here already. but the fact that they can do that just illustrates how big of a problem illegal immigration is in this country. as with every other country, if you aren't supposed to be there or you don't have a passport, you shouldn't be allowed in.

as far as the people who hire them putting them on the books - the whole point of hiring these people is so you don't have to put them on the books; you pay them cash, they do the job, they don't complain and you don't tell. nobody has to know. why would you hire an illegal worker and then tell the us government? didn't walmart just get nailed for doing that exact same thing, and like 1100 employers and immigrants were arrested for doing that? 1100 people sounds like a lot, but seeing as about a million people turned out to protest, i'd say it's safe to say that 95% of the time, these people aren't getting a paycheck, they're getting cash.

as far as chinese and italian people being here illegally, what, did they swim here? i'm sure there are a bunch of both groups here, but take a look at pictures from the protest and you'll see where these vast majority of the illegals came from. i'm with the other guy, if you're here and you're fighting for your right to stay and be a citizen, waiving the flag of another country while doing so isn't exactly going to make people want to help you, or even give two shits about what you're saying. let's sneak into china or russia or iraq, hell even britain for that matter, and wave american flags and yell about how we want equal rights. people elsewhere would never put up with this shit, just because america as a whole is a bunch of vaginas, we have to?

for the record, i'm chiming in from the client accounting department of an insurance company. i only WISH i was in an air-conditioned studio.

lummux · Post by **lummux** » Tue May 02, 2006 12:40 pm

AdamJay wrote:we went out to dinner tonight at the only Mexican restaurant that was open, which was fortunately our favorite one anyway.

But when i heard about the day of rest thing, i couldn't help but think of John Tuturo's character "Jesus Quintana" in The Big Lebowski

the part where he's like:

What's this "day of rest" shit, man?!

What is this bullshit, man?
I don't fucking care!
It don't matter to Jesus!

eight year olds, dude

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Tue May 02, 2006 3:21 pm

And South Park is going on 10 years old - I still quote the fuck out it!

Some of my more memorable quotes taken from South Park

"Screw you guys, I'm going home!" <---Eric Cartmans classic line

"Clown hat curly hair smiley face." <---when Eric Cartman was searching for older friends on the internet

"I don't want to wait, for our lives to be over." <---Theme song to Dawsons Creek

"Yeah, I'm a dumb Jew." <---Butters said this (Hilarious)

"Oh I'm sorry Mr. Garrison. What I said was, HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO SUCK MY BALLS Mr. Garrison!" <---Taken from the Hit Movie "bigger, bolder longer

"No, I'm talking about MANBEARPIG!" <---Al Gore in MANBEARPIG

I could go on and on but I have work to do - this does nothing for my productivity

sqook · Post by **sqook** » Tue May 02, 2006 3:58 pm

jackmazzotti wrote:America is nothing more than a job market to these people

they are all waving Mexican and Dominican republic flags

go back there if its so great

otherwise learn the language and culture of the country your in
(guess what if i move to another country I will learn their language.. its something called respect)

my great grandparents did

This is funny; the same exact things happened to my ancestors, who were Irish. Nonetheless, those people got shit on for decades by people from their ivory towers, but now that they've "integrated" into american culture, I guess it's ok for them to hate on other immigrants.

This debate isn't about politics or immigration law at all. It's a chance for people to vent xenophobic and racist feelings without having to feel un-PC about it.