Can Ableton convincingly do guitar effects?

Turkishjade · Post by **Turkishjade** » Tue May 09, 2006 6:38 pm

I've been woodshedding a bit and I have been able to get the most beautiful tones out of Ableton just using my guitar plugged into my D.I. box and Ableton itself.

The one thing I haven't been able to do is get a decent lead metal sound: creamy compressed distortion with gobs of sustain and a decent heavy rhythm sound. I've come close, but it just doesn't sound ... good.

I know I can go out and buy Amplitube or Guitar Rig or even use a host of freeware apps out there. In fact, I've tried the demos on most of them and they sound ... good, but I would prefer it if Ableton could do it natively.

Should I keep trying (and does anyone have any tips..) or is it impossible to get decent and convincing "metal type" sounds out of Ableton.

Cheers

supster · Post by **supster** » Tue May 09, 2006 6:52 pm

Turkishjade wrote:I've been woodshedding a bit and I have been able to get the most beautiful tones out of Ableton just using my guitar plugged into my D.I. box and Ableton itself.

The one thing I haven't been able to do is get a decent lead metal sound: creamy compressed distortion with gobs of sustain and a decent heavy rhythm sound. I've come close, but it just doesn't sound ... good.

I know I can go out and buy Amplitube or Guitar Rig or even use a host of freeware apps out there. In fact, I've tried the demos on most of them and they sound ... good, but I would prefer it if Ableton could do it natively.

Should I keep trying (and does anyone have any tips..) or is it impossible to get decent and convincing "metal type" sounds out of Ableton.

Cheers

If you mean only using abletons built in effects ... no, i know what you're probably looking for and theyre not going to give it to you

Really good metal tones - theres no replacement for specialty gear, either process your stuff external using real amps and pedals then record as audio

OR use some kind of a DI box or staight clean signal thru the insert rack in Live into Amplitube or Guitar Rig or Izotope Trash ...

Live isnt designed to create every sound you can imagine, it specializes in writing and sound modification. But the delays, saturator, reverb, etc etc are awesome use those after you get your tone the right way imo

,.

Turkishjade · Post by **Turkishjade** » Tue May 09, 2006 7:06 pm

Thanks mate, that was quite helpful.

I've been on this "simplify" bent lately and I wanted to reduce the number of plugins I use. A friend showed me some of the amazing things he is able to do with Operator and Simpler alone and I thought it would be awesome if I could similarly use Ableton solo for guitar....

I'm off to try Trash....I've actually never tried that one.
Thanks for the help
Cheers.

kennerb · Post by **kennerb** » Tue May 09, 2006 7:06 pm

I've been able to get pretty good results using saturater, compression, chorus, and some delay. I guess it all depends on what the exact sound that you are trying to achieve.

dj superflat · Post by **dj superflat** » Tue May 09, 2006 7:09 pm

i think you can do it, you just need to use the eq very precisely (because amps have very distinct EQ effects that (e.g.) using saturator alone won't give you).

DrainBamage · Post by **DrainBamage** » Tue May 09, 2006 7:32 pm

I just use my Ibanez Tube screamer and a Boss Delay/Pitch shift into Live, sounds tasty! In the long run I feel better having my guitar processing power external to Live, that way my playing isn't encumbered by MIP limitations, latency etc. With guitar rig etc it is great to be able to tweak your entire tone after recording.

Not really simplifying but repurposing old gear. One of these days I'll convert to a Line 6 Pod.

Turkishjade · Post by **Turkishjade** » Tue May 09, 2006 8:03 pm

DrainBamage: That's part of the reason I was doing this. I agree that it's better to have the effects external, but, in my head, I felt that using native effects in your DAW should be close to the same thing. Notice, I said close...I know that there is a load, I just figured it would be much smaller than going the dedicated package (i.e. Guitar Rig) route.

Plus I'm a cheap bastard and if I avoid spending some extra cash by putting in some time experimenting, I wanted to do it.

DJ Superflat: I had good results with using the eq4. The main problem is depth of tone. I was able to get all the pieces I needed: proper distortion, proper eq so that it's a little dry, some compression, slight reverb. It sounds ok, but there isn't any sustain OR life.

Better way to put it, it sounds like someone is playing their guitar through their computer. Which is what I did...just not what I want.

Kennerb: Those are what I played with, you can get lost playing with all the settings and arranging their stack order.

Like I said, I got close numerous times, I just wanted to find out if I've done all I possibly can in Live.

Thanks everyone for their help,
I really appreciate the input
Cheers.

rbmonosylabik · Post by **rbmonosylabik** » Tue May 09, 2006 8:07 pm

Maybe you could give mda Combo a shot

http://www.kvraudio.com/get/777.html?mo ... 62cbd917df

very handy speaker sim

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Tue May 09, 2006 8:39 pm

there's a really good "rednef twin" cab sim out there. Free, lightweight.

TheAnimal · Post by **TheAnimal** » Tue May 09, 2006 8:47 pm

deleted ( I posted in the wrong thread)

couch boy · Post by **couch boy** » Tue May 09, 2006 9:07 pm

try these for size:

http://www.simulanalog.org/guitarsuite.htm

http://antti.smartelectronix.com/ (the saro plug-in)

Not sure if they are what you're looking for but I like them

Turkishjade · Post by **Turkishjade** » Tue May 09, 2006 9:45 pm

Machinate:
Couch Boy:

Mein gott! That guitarsuite is perfect. I LOVE THAT IT HAS NO GUI INTERFACE. I hate twiddling knobs with a mouse.

And there be some creamy distortion in that bit of kit! It's quiet, simulates feedback properly and it's VERY tasty. I can't believe it's free.

Anyone who hasn't tried it, should do so.

Thanks to the both of you for this!!!!
Cheers

John Sweet · Post by **John Sweet** » Tue May 09, 2006 10:18 pm

If you want the huuuuge metal sound, try routing the guitar to multiple channels & processing them differently, especially spreading the sound around in stereo.

For sustain, though, I don't know… The best sustain is always what you get when yr speaker moves the strings "Foxey Lady"-style. Don't know how any computer can touch that. If you have to go outboard for gear, I think the most important piece is a really nice tube preamp. It doesn't need a lot of bells and whistles, but a nicely designed circuit (no I.C.s) and quality tubes will give you touch, warmth, and brilliance. I don't trust PODs and their ilk.

richardl · Post by **richardl** » Tue May 09, 2006 11:35 pm

I gotta chime in that after evaluating a lot of software guitar effects and simulators like Guitar Rig and Amplitube I decided that the best option for me was a PODxt Live box. It sounds amazing. It puts no load on your CPU. It runs without any computer attached (just switch it on). Optionally, it connects to your computer with an ASIO audio interface plus allows you to edit and download presets from your computer into the POD via USB. It's a great product and it costs less than Guitar Rig or Amplitube.

quandry · Post by **quandry** » Wed May 10, 2006 3:02 am

I too have sought a nice distortion plug in, and after many trys and demos, my favorite hands down is free--fuzzplus2:

http://www.audiodamage.com/product_info ... ducts_id=3

these guys make great plug ins, and from the graphics, I believe this is emulating an old mxr pedal--reguardless it sounds killer on guitar and esp. rhodes sounds, and the knobs allow a huge amount of adjustment of dist amount and tone--love it. I find myself using it too much if anything, it is addictive!

Ryan

Can Ableton convincingly do guitar effects?

Can Ableton convincingly do guitar effects?

Re: Can Ableton convincingly do guitar effects?