Why do you hate EDM? "House, Trance, Techno"

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:28 pm

dm_hawk wrote:
music with any combination of these three elements is sure to be hated and ridiculed by certain music enthusiasts, especially those who try keep on top of the latest developments

Yo D, don't get me wrong I don't make trance and I don't have naked picture of BT hanging in my cubicle like members on this forum (Thought I didn't knwo about that huh?)

My point was being that since we all MAKE music as oppose to just collect it - how much room do any of us have to hate on one particular style? We can learn from each other, even if it's a particular technique or cool trick, know what I'm saying?

If it weren't for Mathew Dekay and Christopher Lawrence I'd have a weird feeling about trance as well - but those two know how to mix, mix damn good music IMHO.

peace out

Adonis

subterFUSE · Post by **subterFUSE** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:33 pm

I can't believe that anyone would try to argue that house/techno/trance would still be house/techno/trance without the four on the floor kick.

When I play a DJ set, I use tracks with breakbeat pecussion every so often to give the audience something fresh. The same goes for vocal tracks. I like to play vocals every few songs... to keep things fresh. To give an accent on a certan point of the set.

But I cannot say that just because a track uses a breakbeat rhythm that it is no longer house, prog, or trance. I repeat what I said before, these styles are defined more by the sounds and mood.

leisuremuffin · Post by **leisuremuffin** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:44 pm

well, i have to cheerily disagree.

.lm.

stinky · Post by **stinky** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:46 pm

ok, but can't a DJ known for playing a certain genre play something outside of that genre. Just because sasha or digweed plays a breakbeat track doesn't magically change the fact that the track is a breakbeat track.

I can't believe that anyone would try to argue that house/techno/trance would still be house/techno/trance without the four on the floor kick. Imagine going into a club saying that you are going to play a house set and then never dropping a four on the floor kick. What do you think people would say?

.lm.

Dude, you're just trollin.. a ton of house music has breakbeats in it.. Even tech-house will have breakbeats. Even if every track has 4 on the floor, doesn't mean they won't have breakbeat polyrhythms overlayed. You obviously don't listen to these genres that much, but believe me when i tell you.. they don't need your sympathy. The cream will always rise, and the shit will always smell. It's that simple.

leisuremuffin · Post by **leisuremuffin** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:52 pm

ARE YOU ALL FUCKING CRAZY???

Yes some house/techno/trance has momentary breaks but they all come back to four on the floor kicks.

Will someone else please acknoledge this? This is not a horrible thing, but it is true!

and please, how the fuck would you know what i listen to?
post one in this thread i admited to the crime of being an ex raver.
I've heard PLENTY of dance music.

.lm.

PLB · Post by **PLB** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:54 pm

i haven't read all the posts but i've seen a lot of complaining about the simplicity and repetetiveness of a four on the floor beat. this simple kick is like the twang is to country, like the distortion in metal- the four on the floor is the background and if you need some variation in rhythms then start listening to everything else that is going on in a track. snares, hi hats, bongos, bass lines, etc etc....

you wouldn't complain about how lame and uncreative the distortion is in metal, it's just there, and without it it just wouldn't be metal...

stinky · Post by **stinky** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:57 pm

ARE YOU ALL FUCKING CRAZY???

Yes some house/techno/trance has momentary breaks but they all come back to four on the floor kicks.

Will someone else please acknoledge this? This is not a horrible thing, but it is true!

and please, how the fuck would you know what i listen to?
post one in this thread i admited to the crime of being an ex raver.
I've heard PLENTY of dance music.

.lm.

dude, yes, 4x4 characterizes alot of these genres, but that doesn't mean they have to contain 4x4 throughout, and alot of the best producers in these subgenres take heavy liberties... not just in their dj's mixes, but in the production tracks as well, and that's what seperates them. Alot of prog/breaks sounds more like trance than any breaks out there, but there still breaks. It's more than just a steady beat that defines the music.

leisuremuffin · Post by **leisuremuffin** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 9:03 pm

PLB wrote:i haven't read all the posts but i've seen a lot of complaining about the simplicity and repetetiveness of a four on the floor beat. this simple kick is like the twang is to country, like the distortion in metal- the four on the floor is the background and if you need some variation in rhythms then start listening to everything else that is going on in a track. snares, hi hats, bongos, bass lines, etc etc....

you wouldn't complain about how lame and uncreative the distortion is in metal, it's just there, and without it it just wouldn't be metal...

No fucking doubt. That's EXACTLY what i'm saying. Please note i NEVER claimed 4x4 kicks were lame and uncreative, in fact i even asked someone who was saying that why anybody would try to change that about the genre when it works the way it does on the dancefloor.

.lm.

stinky · Post by **stinky** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 9:05 pm

What about Nathan Fake and James Holden? They use alot of different time signatures, and awkward phrasing. Not to mention breakbeats!!! Case in pont, listen to

Nathan Fake - Superpositions on his album Drowning in a Sea of Love

They're considered Prog-House pioneers, and with all the minimal going on these days, they're at the forefront and alot of people are copying their styles endlessly (it's actually getting to be horribly cliched, and alot of this copied music is just crap compared to them)

subterFUSE · Post by **subterFUSE** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 9:12 pm

What about Nathan Fake and James Holden? They use alot of different time signatures, and awkward phrasing. Not to mention breakbeats!!! Case in pont, listen to

Nathan Fake - Superpositions on his album Drowning in a Sea of Love

They're considered Prog-House pioneers, and with all the minimal going on these days, they're at the forefront and alot of people are copying their styles endlessly (it's actually getting to be horribly cliched, and alot of this copied music is just crap compared to them)

Good point.... and I think it supports what I've been saying all along about the style of music not depending so heavily on the percussion itself... but rather on the sounds and moods of the music.

I used to like James Holden a lot more years ago. But now he has gone so experimental, and he has just lost me. To give credit, he is certainly trying to break from the mold... but I'm just not into what he has been putting out there lately. Just so quirky... and not very dancefloor friendly, IMO.

But enough of this for now. I've got a lacrosse game to get to.

ze2be · Post by **ze2be** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 9:40 pm

Well, I dont like house, trance, techno, because it is booring to listen to. Ive been djin it from 1990-99, and I feel it has been dead for a long time, or at least its old and smells realy bad!!

Since then, the only EDM I like is dark twisted psychedelic trance. 90% of that is boorig too, but the 10% keeps me going..

I havent read the other replies, because im just not interested!

nebulae · Post by **nebulae** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 9:53 pm

Listen to Future Sound of London's "Accelerator" and "Lifeforms" albums. (For anyone who doesn't know, these were ground-breaking rave/phy/ambient records.) Then listen to their release last year, FSOL presents Amorphous Androgynous and the album title is "Alice in Ultraland". It's now psychedelic brit-rock that you could swear came out of the late 60s and 70s.

I think it's a clear case of artists who once went into frontiers in EDM, then got uninspired, and went into analog and are rediscovering new frontiers. I have no doubt that give a few years and some more hits of acid, they'll come out with another massive ambient dance record.

I guess my point isn't so much that I hate EDM...far from it. It's just that when I create music, I start with something inspiring, and I follow it to where it leads me. Sometimes the song ends up as rock ( http://www.chlorophyllworks.com/music/bitter.mp3 ) and sometimes it ends up all jittery ( http://www.chlorophyllworks.com/music/stepoff.mp3 ).

I find that when I listen to artists, more often then not, they try to pigeon-hole themselves, either by (bad) instincts, or because of label pressure for marketing. Ultimately, that only helps them not break new ground, make a stale sound, and eventually lead to the crapification of the genre. On the other hand you've got artists always pushing new boundaries, and those are the ones that have true cult followings and a great deal of respect. (Aphex Twin comes to mind.) I hope that all of us as artists do our best to keep stretching our own comfort levels, so that we stay on the creative edge.

leisuremuffin · Post by **leisuremuffin** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 10:32 pm

stinky wrote:Alot of trance has breakbeats (admittedly, not throughout the entire track, but that's why it's called trance, not breakbeat) in it... even PVD uses breakbeats..

Wow, somehow i missed this before.

I added the bold.

So you're arguing with me about something that you don't even believe.

.lm.

stinky · Post by **stinky** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 10:41 pm

Wow, somehow i missed this before.

I added the bold.

So you're arguing with me about something that you don't even believe.

.lm.

yeah, well, if you wouldn't have missed it, then maybe you wouldn't have been so damned argumentative..

Maybe you missed my post on nathan fake.. there are others out there... just like with anything, just like with the hip hop genre.. there are other's breaking ground, and house is 4x4 (but that doesn't mean that it always sounds like a straight pounding 4x4)..

leisuremuffin · Post by **leisuremuffin** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 10:47 pm

well, you're not the only one arguing with me on this one anyway.

I know there's all kinds of range to this kind of music, but i also know that if it doesn't have a kick on every quarter at some point, it ain't gonna fly as house/techno/trance etc.

to me, that means that a four on the floor kick is *one* of the defining elements of those genres, and i don't think anyone, even you, would argue that point.

I'm not saying it's good or bad, i'm just saying that it can't be denied

.lm.