PCI till I die! RME vs. MOTU

Sales Dude McBoob · Post by **Sales Dude McBoob** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 2:53 pm

Hey all,

I may be moving soon and I'm trying to figure out the best way to go for my new studio set-up. I've been using my roommates Digi 002 for years, and when I move I'll need something new.

You'd think that since I sell this crap everyday for 50+ hours a week that I wouldn't need to consult an internet forum to decide what to get for myself... not the case. The peanut gallery knows best.

I started out in the DAW world on a PCI card interface and then moved to firewire. I want to go back to PCI.

I've been looking at the RME + MOTU PCI stuff. It's well known that the general consensus around here that the RME gear tends to get a little better reviews than the MOTU stuff. That said, you don't have to look to hard to find a MOTU user who is happy with their equipment.

The thing I like about MOTU is that they are committed to only producing gear that is future-proof. They are proud that the oldest piece of MOTU hardware with work seamlessly with their latest offering.

The thing I like about RME is that they're German. MOTU is from Boston. I lived in Boston for 9 years. I don't like Boston anymore. I'm even starting to root for the Yankees now-a-days.

Seriously though, I want the best sound I can get, and I've heard enough people tell me that the best sound they could get came from RME gear [Not to say that I haven't heard the same from MOTU users].

I'm considering the RME Multiface 2 I/O Box and HDSP PCI Card Interface Bundle. The delima I'm having is that the Multiface connects to the PCI card through a firewire port. I know everyone loves this set-up, but my whole point was to get away from firewire. It's stupid to be hung-up on this, I know, but that's how I feel.

The MOTU I'm considering is the 2408mk3 24 Input / 26 Output. This one has waaaay more i/o than I'll ever need, but it has just a dumb old PCI card which appeals to me.

So to break things down, my questions are:

1) RME- the firewire port on the PCI card is just as solid as a standard PCI, yes? And also, the Multiface looks like half a rack size, yes? . Is there a rack ear kit for that? Does it not come with one or do you have to order it separately? [Another shameful question to be coming from a pro audio sales dude]

2) MOTU + RME- Both of these are compatible with a dual 1.8 G5 older model with 8 slot, PCI-X (I believe )?

[Shamefully hides under his desk and awaits a response]...

Hedroom · Post by **Hedroom** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 3:34 pm

Don't worry, Multiface isn't Firewire. Is connects using a firewire carble, yes, but used proprietary rme technology, not FW technology. I.e. it just uses the same cable.

rikhyray · Post by **rikhyray** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 4:44 pm

Another advantage is MIDI timing and latency, way better then any FW or USB , I am not talking what is written anywhere but my own experience, while recording, playing etc, honestly the difference is dramatic and then nicest surprise, I got it for the sound but the midi thing is the great bonus.
The box is much smaller, lighter then I expected. The cable is a special one looking like FW but it is not.
I hope Mac will realise the mistake of dumping PCMCIA and will go Sony`s way in future models- including both standard and the new -express.

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:01 pm

ciau, after all you wrote... RME is the answer, you want the best possible sound... RME! or actually Metric Halo is a choice as well.

splashmas wrote:

Don't worry, Multiface isn't Firewire. Is connects using a firewire carble, yes, but used proprietary rme technology, not FW technology. I.e. it just uses the same cable.

that is half true, it is essentially firewire but as stated with an advanced / enhanced RME "inhouse" protocol and i can assure you it does the job all the way. (that applies to the PCI 'firewire' cards, like the multiface)

RME is fully a quality product in every aspect.

you really can't get wrong with it.

and as i said, after your request... if in doubt about the choice then either RME or Metric Halo, that said Motu is certainly also a very solid quality product, but the other two are a little ahead when it comes to pure sound quality issues.

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:09 pm

all that said, if you possibly can put your PCI strictness aside, go with the fireface 800, without even thinking twice!!!

you will be thankfull for it in years to come.

lord toranaga · Post by **lord toranaga** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:19 pm

the motu pci card aso use a firewire cable, calling it audio wire

lord toranaga · Post by **lord toranaga** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:20 pm

also, I have used motu pci products in the past, and love them. They work great

my favorite comdo, wat the motu 2408 combined with tascan dm24 digital mixer.

Sales Dude McBoob · Post by **Sales Dude McBoob** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:43 pm

SubFunk wrote:you will be thankfull for it in years to come.

Which raises an interesting point. I don't want to find myself in a situation a couple years from now where I'm looking at getting a new and more powerful desktop computer and being forced to buy a new interface as well.

I'm bummed Apple went with the express card on their laptops. The chances of them being loyal to PCI are slim. There is the Apogee Ensemble, but it seems too Logic-centric. I don't like the design either. If there are 4 pre amps inside then I want 4 knobs to control the gain. It's nit picky, but that turns me off. I'd rather have 4 preamps, an interface, and an A/D converter in a 6 space rack with cool knobs and blinky lights. And I don't want firewire.

Damn. Maybe I should just go back to the Delta 10/10!

Firewire has too much latency. I've sold the Fireface to people and they come back and tell me they are happy with it, but they can still detect the latency when working, even with optimized settings.

Picking out microphones is so much easier!

markaugust · Post by **markaugust** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 7:32 pm

I switched from a digi 002r to a multiface mk2 pcmcia.
I could not be happier.
I run my extensive liveset (8 audio tracks 3 vst instruments, 26 different effects/dynamics plugins) on 256 samples-6 ms ; no problem.

mikemc · Post by **mikemc** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 7:52 pm

[Shamefully hides under his desk and awaits a response]...
_________________
On the desk = Dual 1.8 G5 (8 slots), OS 10.4.2, 2.5 RAM. Live 5.0.3, Komplete 2 (w/ Kontact 2 + Reaktor 5), Sample Tank 2, iZotope Ozone, Peak Pro XT 5, MX4, 002 rack
On the stage = 15" PB 1.5, 512, 10.4.2, Live 5.0.2, Ozonic

Which one of these are you talking about using in conjunction with the interface you seek, for which you request advice so shamefully?

Sales Dude McBoob · Post by **Sales Dude McBoob** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 7:54 pm

mikemc wrote:
[Shamefully hides under his desk and awaits a response]...
_________________
On the desk = Dual 1.8 G5 (8 slots), OS 10.4.2, 2.5 RAM. Live 5.0.3, Komplete 2 (w/ Kontact 2 + Reaktor 5), Sample Tank 2, iZotope Ozone, Peak Pro XT 5, MX4, 002 rack
On the stage = 15" PB 1.5, 512, 10.4.2, Live 5.0.2, Ozonic
Which one of these are you talking about using in conjunction with the interface you seek, for which you request advice so shamefully?

The one on my desk:
Dual 1.8 G5 (8 slots), OS 10.4.2, 2.5 RAM. Live 5.0.3, Komplete 2 (w/ Kontact 2 + Reaktor 5), Sample Tank 2, iZotope Ozone, Peak Pro XT 5, MX4

jahnlay · Post by **jahnlay** » Thu Jun 29, 2006 11:55 pm

RME kills any competition, by far the best soundcards I've heard.

drumroll57 · Post by **drumroll57** » Fri Jun 30, 2006 2:32 am

Making sure that any potential buyers realize, but this fantastic RME system will not work with the new MacBook Pros.... (It takes "ExpressCard" only)

trust... I own a couple of them for portable use, and will not upgrade to MacTel computers, because :

-1) RME has not come up with an 'Expresscard' interface for the Multiface II

-2) Their supposedly wonderful Fireface 400 is not shipping yet...

So for now, stuck with a 2-year old laptop. Doesn't prevent me from making music actually.. LOL

D.

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:34 am

SDMcB wrote:

Firewire has too much latency. I've sold the Fireface to people and they come back and tell me they are happy with it, but they can still detect the latency when working, even with optimized settings.

if you consider 48 samples with a fireface 800 a to high latency, then i don't know what to say!!??!!??!!

RME is well reputated to have amazingly dead stable ultra low latencys and a clock stability that beats nearly everything else on the market ( and that is a very important factor for the overall performance and SOUND of the card)

jahnlay wrote:

RME kills any competition, by far the best soundcards I've heard.

in that pricerange i absolutely second that!

jeez Sales Dude Mc Boob get rid of your PCI paranoia, really!! we are talking RME here!!!

of course the ensamble is an absolut killer card, but as you pointed out especially made for killer Logic, he, he

)

SubFunk · Post by **SubFunk** » Fri Jun 30, 2006 9:40 am

to be honest i am actually fed up with discussing the "to buy or not to buy a RME card" to be really honest that is completly stupid and a waist of time, the only reason not buying a firewire RME card is to not having the money for it, there is no other reason or a 'you should not buy it because of... blah, blah.'

damn, get a fireface 800 there is NO card which comes even close in that pricerange.