I only use one delay
Studio's - lets talk about 'em for a second
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djadonis206
- Posts: 6490
- Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2004 4:23 pm
- Location: Seattle, WA.
you can do a lot with software, granted
but how are you gonna get the sound when you:
take a hardware sampler, run it into mixer, pump up the volume so you get saturation and run the mixer into a hardware compressor.
->
correct, this is not possible with software
another:
digital hardware synth filters sound different than software filters
if you want a fat dirty cranchy sound due to stauration (you know, the little sparkles) you gonna need hardware for sure.
If you re into trance, goa or other mellow dance stuff and when you want the most "clean" sound, software is your route.
bu for me, I need my mpc, my HW compressor and my cheap little dj mixer. I could live without a hardware synth though. but a hardware sampler is needed!!
but how are you gonna get the sound when you:
take a hardware sampler, run it into mixer, pump up the volume so you get saturation and run the mixer into a hardware compressor.
->
correct, this is not possible with software
another:
digital hardware synth filters sound different than software filters
if you want a fat dirty cranchy sound due to stauration (you know, the little sparkles) you gonna need hardware for sure.
If you re into trance, goa or other mellow dance stuff and when you want the most "clean" sound, software is your route.
bu for me, I need my mpc, my HW compressor and my cheap little dj mixer. I could live without a hardware synth though. but a hardware sampler is needed!!
let me correct myself... I could use a software sampler seperate -> a second computer with a soundcard with fat converters serving as a sampler (which goes into the mixer, into the hw compressor, into the recording comp) could do the trick as well but the soundcard needs excellent ADs and DAs.
also, hardware is just easier. I press the on/off button on my mpc4000 and all samples, programs, multis, effects (settings) and everything is loaded within 10 seconds (depends on how much) the sampler got 400mb (max 512) and has cd/dvd drive, ide hd, and usb connections for usb hds, usb hubs, mem sticks, and all. it has 16 pads and other controllers. Its an instrument! Its a violin, a drumkit, a bassguitar, etc... by the press of one button
.... software cant beat that either!
same goes for my Indigo... press on/off and start playing. its a vocoder as well! i remember having a hard time running a decent software vocoder with live input and zero latency in my software days
especially when your project is bigger and your cpu meter is reaching the 60% !
and besides, Ableton Live vs hardware equals LOTS of FUN !!
also, hardware is just easier. I press the on/off button on my mpc4000 and all samples, programs, multis, effects (settings) and everything is loaded within 10 seconds (depends on how much) the sampler got 400mb (max 512) and has cd/dvd drive, ide hd, and usb connections for usb hds, usb hubs, mem sticks, and all. it has 16 pads and other controllers. Its an instrument! Its a violin, a drumkit, a bassguitar, etc... by the press of one button
.... software cant beat that either!same goes for my Indigo... press on/off and start playing. its a vocoder as well! i remember having a hard time running a decent software vocoder with live input and zero latency in my software days
especially when your project is bigger and your cpu meter is reaching the 60% !and besides, Ableton Live vs hardware equals LOTS of FUN !!
Last edited by ikke on Mon Jul 03, 2006 12:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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DeadlyKungFu
- Posts: 3603
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 8:26 pm
ikke wrote:you can do a lot with software, granted
but how are you gonna get the sound when you:
take a hardware sampler, run it into mixer, pump up the volume so you get saturation and run the mixer into a hardware compressor.
->
correct, this is not possible with software
another:
digital hardware synth filters sound different than software filters
if you want a fat dirty cranchy sound due to stauration (you know, the little sparkles) you gonna need hardware for sure.
If you re into trance, goa or other mellow dance stuff and when you want the most "clean" sound, software is your route.
bu for me, I need my mpc, my HW compressor and my cheap little dj mixer. I could live without a hardware synth though. but a hardware sampler is needed!!
Can you achieve the same results by taking the outs from a software sampler and running that into a mixer and compressor????
i'm trying to beef up my sound...i dont see a reason why this wouldn't be equivalent to just using a hardware sampler...
and yes you are right....most digital filter algorithms are terrible....
its just swing.. i dont notice a different in the swinging of an MPC60 MPC4000, Pro Tools or Cubase SXDeadlyKungFu wrote:There's also that swing to the mpc that sounds sooo creamy.
.. It just swungs ...on the MPC4000, though, you can pre hear the swing when the sequence is playing. (which is a godsend!) I dont think thats possible with cubase or protools but im not certain
there is a great video on the net from Jeremy Ellis talking about the mpc. He freestyles. He build songs from scratch live. Its an inspiring video. Lemme see if I can find it..
here you go... http://youtube.com/watch?v=o1Ea1QJcMxo&search=
here you go... http://youtube.com/watch?v=o1Ea1QJcMxo&search=
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djadonis206
- Posts: 6490
- Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2004 4:23 pm
- Location: Seattle, WA.
In da studio on this fine Sunday. look at my nice little Nord Rack I got for $80 <-- brand new knobs and everything
oh and that's Roman - the other half of all my techno projects
I'm using my dj mixer as a mixer now (thanks Mike)
that's a old school Rane Mojo
That's a DJ Rush sample record
That's a thing from MLK Day
Ok the records on the wall
Adam Jay's Naptown Renegade on Primate
Christian Smith and John Selways Titan
Christian Smith and John Selways Weather (Primates 50th release on see through vinyl
Mike Inks DataJax on some weird german 10 inch
and
Electronic Battle Weapon # 1 <--- the real deal before all the bootlegs came out "It doesn't matter It doesn't matter It doesn't matter"
When I first started djing I went by Hi-C and a friend made that for me
a keyboard stand and and a mic stand
now you know how I live
oh wait - 6 year old plastikman slip mats
a Sopranos poster, a poster from our gig with Misstress Barbara and a DJ Dan Mixed Live poster (I played the CD Release party with him <--- we both pretty much brought the house down, seriously it was fucking nuts)
anywho - late
If anyone has a little 2 or 3 seater couch please send it to me
oh and that's Roman - the other half of all my techno projects
I'm using my dj mixer as a mixer now (thanks Mike)
that's a old school Rane Mojo
That's a DJ Rush sample record
That's a thing from MLK Day
Ok the records on the wall
Adam Jay's Naptown Renegade on Primate
Christian Smith and John Selways Titan
Christian Smith and John Selways Weather (Primates 50th release on see through vinyl
Mike Inks DataJax on some weird german 10 inch
and
Electronic Battle Weapon # 1 <--- the real deal before all the bootlegs came out "It doesn't matter It doesn't matter It doesn't matter"
When I first started djing I went by Hi-C and a friend made that for me
a keyboard stand and and a mic stand
now you know how I live
oh wait - 6 year old plastikman slip mats
a Sopranos poster, a poster from our gig with Misstress Barbara and a DJ Dan Mixed Live poster (I played the CD Release party with him <--- we both pretty much brought the house down, seriously it was fucking nuts)
anywho - late
If anyone has a little 2 or 3 seater couch please send it to me
Bit late to this thread...but it raises a very important point. One we need to keep in mind I reckon.
I'm fairly new to computer-based recording ( 2-ish years), but I've learnt heaps in that time. And, yeah, I've been drawn into the whold gear thing to an extent.
For me it's more about mics than vintage synths though
I think what happens is that you go crazy for a while with all these digital googaws & baubles, and then begin a process of whittling down what's really useful & what's just fluff.
I have a real bare-bones set-up ( by circumstance rather than choice I will add) and the one thing that I think is totally lust-worthy is greater cpu power. If you're trying to battle through with your computer's inadequacies & it's impeding your creativity whilst recording, then that's a different story.
There's a minimum standard of gear you DO need to do this stuff without losing heart is basically what I'm saying.
And I'm not there yet ( 450 mhz G4 PowerMac)
I'm fairly new to computer-based recording ( 2-ish years), but I've learnt heaps in that time. And, yeah, I've been drawn into the whold gear thing to an extent.
For me it's more about mics than vintage synths though
I think what happens is that you go crazy for a while with all these digital googaws & baubles, and then begin a process of whittling down what's really useful & what's just fluff.
I have a real bare-bones set-up ( by circumstance rather than choice I will add
) and the one thing that I think is totally lust-worthy is greater cpu power. If you're trying to battle through with your computer's inadequacies & it's impeding your creativity whilst recording, then that's a different story.There's a minimum standard of gear you DO need to do this stuff without losing heart is basically what I'm saying.
And I'm not there yet
( 450 mhz G4 PowerMac)The same thing cropped up on Home Recording BBS recently.
Here's what one guy had to say ( & I think he's bang on the $)
"....BUDGET: First and foremost, just because you have money doesn't mean you need to buy something. The ONLY time you should upgrade your gear is if you notice something that's not up to par. How will you know if it's not up to par? Trust your ears. As you record, your ears get better, and what sounds fine now won't sound good in a year. But why spend the money now when you won't notice a difference? It's immensely frustrating seeing how many people here waste money on gear that they won't be able to utilize. If your Behringer pres sound fine, use them until they don't, then move on to something else.
Second, though asking people for their opinions is good, don't only rely on them. You won't go out and buy a car based on a BBS members word and only that, and the same deal applies to gear.
GEAR: Here's what pisses me off the most, and ties into budget: The whole BS circling around what companies are good and bad. This is a twofold issue, and it forms a sort of paradox, so bear with me.
As a homereccer, the final say on quality is yours. If you think your ART compressor is the best thing since sliced bread, then it is. BUT only for you.
Once you move from internal needs to external needs, the playing field changes, and ART isn't such a great company anymore. Sure, you may not be able to hear the difference, but there are 100 other people who can and who've already progressed past ART, and saying that their opinion is not valid because you don't think so is hearsay. You wouldn't tell Lance Armstrong to use a Wal-Mart bike, would you?
Here's an example of how all this mumbo jumbo works in real life:
Joe has just started recording. He knows very little, and using a reccomendation from a friend, gets a Boss 8-track and a Nady mic. He uses this gear for a year, and is pleased with the results. During the second year, though, he notices that the Nady mic sounds a little harsh, so he gets a Shure KSM condensor.
Another year goes by, and Joe starts to push the limits of the Boss. Time for another upgrade, so he moves to a PC based system with an MAudio soundcard and Cubasis and a pair of MAudio SP5B's. He uses this for a while, and realizes he doesn't have enough mics. He picks up a couple more for a different variety of sounds, and all is well.
Fast foward a year, and Joe is unhappy with his sound. His mixes seem to be lacking clarity. He has a few choices to make on what to get next, and he decides to upgrade the preamps to Grace. immediately he notices a difference, and is pleased with his purchase.
His next upgrade is the monitor speakers, because even though he can hear with the SP5s, he just can't hear all the high and low end that he needs to mix well, and the speakers seem to color the sound. He moves up to a pair of Mackies, and all is well again.
What does that mean? Trust yourself when you need an upgrade, and only yourself. If you notice something is wrong, fix it, but if nothing is wrong, don't mess around...."
And if you get locked into thinking like Joe in this example....you are never going to have enough gear & are forever destined to railroad your creativity on a fool's errand. Sure, you may end up being a good engineer and/or know heaps about the latest BLT-909 TugMonkey Pro Rectifier Plug-in.
But you used to be an artist...
Here's what one guy had to say ( & I think he's bang on the $)
"....BUDGET: First and foremost, just because you have money doesn't mean you need to buy something. The ONLY time you should upgrade your gear is if you notice something that's not up to par. How will you know if it's not up to par? Trust your ears. As you record, your ears get better, and what sounds fine now won't sound good in a year. But why spend the money now when you won't notice a difference? It's immensely frustrating seeing how many people here waste money on gear that they won't be able to utilize. If your Behringer pres sound fine, use them until they don't, then move on to something else.
Second, though asking people for their opinions is good, don't only rely on them. You won't go out and buy a car based on a BBS members word and only that, and the same deal applies to gear.
GEAR: Here's what pisses me off the most, and ties into budget: The whole BS circling around what companies are good and bad. This is a twofold issue, and it forms a sort of paradox, so bear with me.
As a homereccer, the final say on quality is yours. If you think your ART compressor is the best thing since sliced bread, then it is. BUT only for you.
Once you move from internal needs to external needs, the playing field changes, and ART isn't such a great company anymore. Sure, you may not be able to hear the difference, but there are 100 other people who can and who've already progressed past ART, and saying that their opinion is not valid because you don't think so is hearsay. You wouldn't tell Lance Armstrong to use a Wal-Mart bike, would you?
Here's an example of how all this mumbo jumbo works in real life:
Joe has just started recording. He knows very little, and using a reccomendation from a friend, gets a Boss 8-track and a Nady mic. He uses this gear for a year, and is pleased with the results. During the second year, though, he notices that the Nady mic sounds a little harsh, so he gets a Shure KSM condensor.
Another year goes by, and Joe starts to push the limits of the Boss. Time for another upgrade, so he moves to a PC based system with an MAudio soundcard and Cubasis and a pair of MAudio SP5B's. He uses this for a while, and realizes he doesn't have enough mics. He picks up a couple more for a different variety of sounds, and all is well.
Fast foward a year, and Joe is unhappy with his sound. His mixes seem to be lacking clarity. He has a few choices to make on what to get next, and he decides to upgrade the preamps to Grace. immediately he notices a difference, and is pleased with his purchase.
His next upgrade is the monitor speakers, because even though he can hear with the SP5s, he just can't hear all the high and low end that he needs to mix well, and the speakers seem to color the sound. He moves up to a pair of Mackies, and all is well again.
What does that mean? Trust yourself when you need an upgrade, and only yourself. If you notice something is wrong, fix it, but if nothing is wrong, don't mess around...."
And if you get locked into thinking like Joe in this example....you are never going to have enough gear & are forever destined to railroad your creativity on a fool's errand. Sure, you may end up being a good engineer and/or know heaps about the latest BLT-909 TugMonkey Pro Rectifier Plug-in.
But you used to be an artist...
Last edited by evernaut on Mon Jul 03, 2006 8:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Hatchets McGee
- Posts: 251
- Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2006 12:23 pm
