Quite dissapointed to Sampler

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 10:16 pm

ze2be wrote:
Machinesworking wrote:I was just hoping for more out of Sampler, but I'm starting to see a pattern here in the built in instruments, they get you up and running quick, but for the uber geek user like me, they don't offer enough.
Its not uber geekish wanting to use akai programs!! Its the biggest sample library file format!

That's a bug, not a feature they left out!

Sorry, but people are acting like this a is a finished product. I'm about to purchase a Mackie Control, and right now L6 has no mackie control support, but it's coming. I'm not complaining about features they are working on.

MathematiK I · Post by **MathematiK I** » Sun Jul 30, 2006 11:16 pm

LIKE THE SAMPLER ALOT

would not pay 200$ for it...

it's an awesome instrument... (I managed to get unbelievable sounds out of it LOVE THE OSC )
But I guess I can live without it....
(something I could never say about OPERATOR which helps me keep on living...)

ze2be · Post by **ze2be** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 12:34 am

Machinesworking wrote:
ze2be wrote:
Machinesworking wrote:I was just hoping for more out of Sampler, but I'm starting to see a pattern here in the built in instruments, they get you up and running quick, but for the uber geek user like me, they don't offer enough.
Its not uber geekish wanting to use akai programs!! Its the biggest sample library file format!
That's a bug, not a feature they left out!

Sorry, but people are acting like this a is a finished product. I'm about to purchase a Mackie Control, and right now L6 has no mackie control support, but it's coming. I'm not complaining about features they are working on.

Okay, thats nice then! ..thought you were talking about the akai formats..

What stuf does it not offer for you, that you want?

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 6:28 am

ze2be wrote:Okay, thats nice then! ..thought you were talking about the akai formats.. What stuf does it not offer for you, that you want?

Doh! total misunderstanding there, I haven't imported any AKAI files only EXS, and they work fine. Sampler is in many ways like the EXS....
Problems:
Main one I see is no separate audio out for keyboard/samples etc.. so say if you have 16 vocal samples spread across the keyboard, you can't route them to external audio tracks for processing,

No separate filters for sections of the keyboard, groups etc. along with no audio outs, this is a big one!

and from what I can tell no after touch,

and no sustain pedal recognition for piano samples, (though I haven't tried that).

So basically Sampler works well with multi samples of the same material but if you go into treating samples with FX separately from each other, IE split keyboards etc. then you're having to build Racks, and unless you're layering the sounds for velocity etc. why bother using it in that case? why not Simpler?

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 7:24 am

Machinesworking wrote: and from what I can tell no after touch,

It's Chan. Press. in the mod matrix...

Machinesworking wrote: So basically Sampler works well with multi samples of the same material but if you go into treating samples with FX separately from each other, IE split keyboards etc. then you're having to build Racks, and unless you're layering the sounds for velocity etc. why bother using it in that case? why not Simpler?

Because Simpler won't do half the stuff Sampler does: FM mod, morphing filter, and so on. Using multiple Samplers inside a rack isn't a limitation by any means, if you ask me.

forge · Post by **forge** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 7:33 am

Machinate wrote: Using multiple Samplers inside a rack isn't a limitation by any means, if you ask me.

no, given how easy the keyzone thing is, it's so straightforward - and non CPU hungry

it's just a different approach

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 3:55 pm

forge wrote:
Machinate wrote: Using multiple Samplers inside a rack isn't a limitation by any means, if you ask me.
no, given how easy the keyzone thing is, it's so straightforward - and non CPU hungry

it's just a different approach

You don't get the point do you? Racks are not a "feature" of Sampler. Any soft instrument or synth can be layered into Racks...

But seriously maintaining 8 Samplers in a Rack with similar vocal samples so that you can route them to separate FX etc. is not as elegant as being able to.....

A: add FX to the sample internally...

B: route audio out from Sampler to audio tracks for processing...

While Racks offer this to a degree, it's not a feature of Sampler. As it stands, Sampler to me is not as powerful of a solution as other samplers out there. The one advantage is drag and drop....

MathematiK I · Post by **MathematiK I** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 4:00 pm

Machinesworking wrote:
forge wrote:
Machinate wrote: Using multiple Samplers inside a rack isn't a limitation by any means, if you ask me.
no, given how easy the keyzone thing is, it's so straightforward - and non CPU hungry

it's just a different approach
You don't get the point do you? Racks are not a "feature" of Sampler. Any soft instrument or synth can be layered into Racks...

But seriously maintaining 8 Samplers in a Rack with similar vocal samples so that you can route them to separate FX etc. is not as elegant as being able to.....

A: add FX to the sample internally...

B: route audio out from Sampler to audio tracks for processing...

While Racks offer this to a degree, it's not a feature of Sampler. As it stands, Sampler to me is not as powerful of a solution as other samplers out there. The one advantage is drag and drop....

I SUPPORT FULLY!!!

forge · Post by **forge** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 4:04 pm

I think the integration is the point - it's only meant to work inside live 6 so the racks ARE a part of the features

I dont know, today I made a rack of operators 19 thick and it amazed me how easy it was and CPU light - I've barely played with the racks yet - but I can totally see how doing that with a bunch of samplers is totally feasible

but like I said earlier on - all these conversations were had during the alpha and the same points were raised

maybe it doesnt seem as important for me as I'm not trying to do what you're talking about - in fact I've had Kontakt for a couple of years and used it about twice, so I'm not entirely after a multisampler of any kind - that's why this one appeals to me because it's not really the same thing as all those - it's like a cross between a sampler and a synth - I just cant wait till you can take audio in and treat it as a carrier and use the OSC section to modulate it!

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 4:09 pm

MathematiK I wrote:LIKE THE SAMPLER ALOT

would not pay 200$ for it...

it's an awesome instrument... (I managed to get unbelievable sounds out of it LOVE THE OSC )

I just don't know if I'll have the $300 plus to upgrade the whole package - I like that OSC as well

I'm really feeling the Sampler but it gets a bit expensive when you throw in the upgrade to 6 as well

Like I said before, nigga's got kids, child support, baby moma drama, tution, books and bills to pay

- actually I just said I gotta pay for school and books and a laptop and bills and I'm going down to 30 hour weeks to accomodate a full load - and I pay $40 a week for a tutor <---- who I can't tell if she's hot or not. She's a 23 year old basketball player - math minor, she has braces and reminds me of my girls little sister - but she's on her way to law school, no acne and looks fit <----> oh well she's helping me get a good grade

ekko · Post by **ekko** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 4:15 pm

djadonis206 wrote: She's a 23 year old basketball player - math minor, she has braces and reminds me of my girls little sister - but she's on her way to law school, no acne and looks fit

This post is useless without pictures.

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 4:34 pm

ekko wrote:
djadonis206 wrote: She's a 23 year old basketball player - math minor, she has braces and reminds me of my girls little sister - but she's on her way to law school, no acne and looks fit
This post is useless without pictures.

damn

deva · Post by **deva** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 5:36 pm

Robert Henke wrote:It`s the nature of things that every feature addition unleashes new desires.
We are aware of the fact that a complex routing could benefit from a better visualisation. Maybe some day there will a way to display a diagram of the structure, but this is beyond the scope of Live 6, sorry.

Robert

For really complex stuff, that could be useful. However, I am very happy with how racks were implemented in Live 6. I have used Tracktion and the wired system is not nearly as easy to use as the Live racks for the great majority of uses. The wiring view only really gets an advantage with multiple chains that are cross wired in complex ways.

There are many other features I would rather see first than some schematic overview.

deva · Post by **deva** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 5:49 pm

Machinesworking wrote:
forge wrote:
Machinate wrote: Using multiple Samplers inside a rack isn't a limitation by any means, if you ask me.
no, given how easy the keyzone thing is, it's so straightforward - and non CPU hungry

it's just a different approach
You don't get the point do you? Racks are not a "feature" of Sampler. Any soft instrument or synth can be layered into Racks...

But seriously maintaining 8 Samplers in a Rack with similar vocal samples so that you can route them to separate FX etc. is not as elegant as being able to.....

A: add FX to the sample internally...

B: route audio out from Sampler to audio tracks for processing...

While Racks offer this to a degree, it's not a feature of Sampler. As it stands, Sampler to me is not as powerful of a solution as other samplers out there. The one advantage is drag and drop....

I like the racks approach. What I would like to see is the possibility to select the 8 samplers (You can select multiple chains) and edit them enmass, or to do things like link one Sampler as slave to another.

Using multiple Samplers in racks is ultimately more flexible than what you are asking for. And I think with some refinements, not more difficult to use.

I think it is just as elegant as having to add 8 tracks to be able to do it in 1 rack

ze2be · Post by **ze2be** » Mon Jul 31, 2006 11:04 pm

deva wrote:I like the racks approach. What I would like to see is the possibility to select the 8 samplers (You can select multiple chains) and edit them enmass, or to do things like link one Sampler as slave to another.

Using multiple Samplers in racks is ultimately more flexible than what you are asking for. And I think with some refinements, not more difficult to use.

I think it is just as elegant as having to add 8 tracks to be able to do it in 1 rack

i agree, but it is dificult to understand that such system could run complex akai programs! So if you need your akai programs, would you need another sampler?

Not saying I need it, just curious..

If you open an akai program with lots of different settings on eack sample in say a drum kit, would you then end up with like 20 simplers in the rack? That starts to sound cluttered, but im not a beta tester so I dont know how it would be..