Another version,another payment,and no old faults resolved?

MAreco · Post by **MAreco** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 8:54 pm

So,

Live 6 will arrive soon, and it seems that Live will go more into the direction of becoming a DAW. That's been discussed already - but, hey, I don't get it - why do I have to pay 100 Euros again for getting features that have been long awaited and I hoped to see in Live 5.

Two of the more important features (for me) are:
a) no time lag when moving objects when in arrange view - Betatesters - it is solved in Live 6??
b) more midi control options without using extentional tools - like being able to switch through the tracks and use same midi controls for playing, stopping etc. (was called relative controls)

Alright - I might get some new features with Live6 but I'm not sure yet if am in need of them and just fear they will stress cpu and ram use further...but I am sure that I don't want to pay every half a year 100 Euros again!!!

Regarding point b): This have beend discussed several times, and it seems to be possible to realize in some way. But I didn't find the right threads about this topic. Maybe someone got a clue? Still I'd love it to be implemented in Live...

Regarding point a): That's another thing I really don't get. As far as I have followed the posts (see for example http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... sc&start=0)
that's a usual problem with Live. But how can many users have the wish that Live should develop into a usual production tool (and not live tool) when it is not possbile to have a good workflow while arranging??? Either these people do have all very powerfull machines with tons of RAM or most of them don't need more than two tracks in their songs. Probably the last one...because those are the ones who have the time to discuss many topics in forums but forget to realize full-blown tracks...

Sorry, but I am a bit angry to pay again. Because I have bought Live a few months ago in the hope that I could arrange tracks smoothly and to use it on stage flexible without using three or more controllers or with further softwaretools.
Since then I haven't really used it - neither for production nor for live. In the first area there are still better tools on the market, and for the second area hardware tools are still the more reliable (and easier) option. Live is simply and still the best and fastest idea collector - but nothing more! And now paying again to -maybe- get some of those improved things...no.

Maybe Ableton will introduce a slime-line live Live-version

Sorry for any bad english,
greetings
Mareco.

ct43 · Post by **ct43** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:01 pm

i really wish there wasent a time lag in arrange view as well... really does my head in that one!!

I dont understand programing or anything, but I cant understand why Cubase can copy and paste a part instantly and Live cant!!

Im sure someone will tell me why, but its deffinatly a pain.

anti-banausic · Post by **anti-banausic** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:13 pm

I really think that the arrange thing has to do with the fact that LIVE does everything "seamlessly" while audio is still playing. It has to do with the difference in the way the audio engines are coded.

LIVE has always tried to be optimized for doing things while not having to stop the audio engine, while other programs have allowed for stopping of the audio engine due to CPU constraints associated with other tasks.

Just my thoughts, I could be wrong.

AB

ishimaru · Post by **ishimaru** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:24 pm

I say if it isn't working for you ... Don't buy it. Simple. If there are better tools use those.

ct43 · Post by **ct43** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:27 pm

from my POV.. overall there arnt any better tools or ways of working than Live for how I like to work...

peeddrroo · Post by **peeddrroo** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:29 pm

i'd rather not comment about it, cause it's still a beta, but the arrangement performance has been greatly improved lately.
currently, i don't feel no lag anymore (and i was also upset with L5).

anyway, it's just a beta, maybe these improvements won't make it in the final release. who knows.
but ableton is working on it.

kineticUk · Post by **kineticUk** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:41 pm

I understand what you're saying...
Its a valid point

the dark wizard · Post by **the dark wizard** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:43 pm

you shouldnt have bought live 5 if it was missing features your were longing for. whats the point in spending more money on live when its still not giving you what you want.....

my advice is stop spending your time writng big posts and go research on a product that does what you want.....

if you cant find any go get a copy of delphi or summit and make one that suits your needs.

Michael-SW · Post by **Michael-SW** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 10:05 pm

the dark wizard wrote:you shouldnt have bought live 5 if it was missing features your were longing for. whats the point in spending more money on live when its still not giving you what you want.....

my advice is stop spending your time writng big posts and go research on a product that does what you want.....

if you cant find any go get a copy of delphi or summit and make one that suits your needs.

That is a totally counter productive sentiment. If everyone was either happy with their current product (and never wanted any change) or just switched to another product the moment they were dissatisfied, there would never be any product development. So, it is really good that people bitch and moan. That is what drives progress.

Personally, I feel that Live 5 was a totally wasted version. There was ONE new essential feature: Freeze. Which other DAWs implemented ages ago. Live 4 is still the high point of Live for me. Live 6 looks like a worthy successor so far. Lets hope it delivers.

Johnisfaster · Post by **Johnisfaster** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 10:09 pm

the way these threads always go:

"bark bark bark ableton didn't do something that they should have!"

"well then don't buy it."

"totally counter productive man! if you don't agree with me then just go to another thread."

and so on and so forth. what a tired conversation.

Eraldo Bernocchi · Post by **Eraldo Bernocchi** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:29 pm

I agree with you MAreco.
I'm a Live user since version 1.00 and this piece of software is the BEST idea collector I ever had the chance to use...and believe me...it's since '77 I do electronic stuff, I was 14...BUT nothing more.

I don't think I want to pay for v.6. it'll be shite for at least 8 months, then it'll get better...and when it's quite there they'll come up with v.7.
It's all in the bloody picture...using Live since v.1.00 I can say this.
I paid too many times...I'll probably wait for v.7. i'm tired of financing software houses.

djadonis206 · Post by **djadonis206** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:47 pm

peeddrroo wrote:i'd rather not comment about it, cause it's still a beta, but the arrangement performance has been greatly improved lately.
currently, i don't feel no lag anymore (and i was also upset with L5).

anyway, it's just a beta, maybe these improvements won't make it in the final release. who knows.
but ableton is working on it.

You know what - it is a wee bit quicker

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 12:34 am

the dark wizard wrote:you shouldnt have bought live 5 if it was missing features your were longing for. whats the point in spending more money on live when its still not giving you what you want.....

my advice is stop spending your time writng big posts and go research on a product that does what you want.....

if you cant find any go get a copy of delphi or summit and make one that suits your needs.

he bought it because he believed the marketing spiel....I dont think he was hoping for more then he was promised. Just a thought.

quandry · Post by **quandry** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 4:05 am

fwiw, it seems that the dual core support is greatly helping those with dual core on both platforms. I think trying the demo is the way to go--see what you think. The new racks and ways of assigning midi controls are sweet and in line with your complaints on 5. As much as Ableton is adding on the DAW side (due to lots of requests), things on the session side (which is was 80% or so of live performers use) have generally stayed close to the original vision or even gotten better. 5 introduced resizable session tracks, the ability to hide parts of the session view, etc.

fwiw, it seems like if anything, Ableton is too eager to please us demanding users--they really seem to work at breakneck speeds to implement needed features that are requested. Sure, you can't please everyone, and some things get introduced in one version and refined in the next, but they do listen, and they do bust their ass to solve problems. Plus, they also just come up with cool shit no one asked for explicitly, but everyone can use and love, like racks. I'm not a fanboy either, I've had issues with 4 and 5 and still perform with Live 3, but thankfully they fixed an issue with select on launch so that I can now use 6 for live looping--they really do pay attention to what users are saying and interact more with users than any other audio software I know of.

theque · Post by **theque** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 4:39 am

i think quandry has something there, i cant really see myself asking logic for a new feature and actually expecting it. i think no company is perfect but ableton really does seem to try. they even read the forum and chip in now and then