loose change 2 this shit is crazy

john gordon · Post by **john gordon** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 2:00 pm

http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid= ... ose+change
just watch the first 15 minutes.not only does it prove that our gov.knew about sept 11,but they were behind it.our fucking government is nuts man.

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 10:43 pm

loose change is light weight stuff, good for its purpose but it only touches the surface.

Johnisfaster · Post by **Johnisfaster** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:02 pm

assuming our government did it simply cause the facts don't add up doesn't make alot of sense. the government covers stuff up, thats what they do.

solovox · Post by **solovox** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:05 pm

I was blown away by Loose Change for...well...minutes. Then I did more research and combined that with common sense. Now Loose Change just makes me angry because it muddies the issue about what we KNOW and what is right out in the open: Presidential incompetence and the failures that are obvious to all. Docs like Loose Change make everyone who criticizes the President & Co. look like crackpots. Thanks alot, jerks.

This one is the most info-packed...a complete dismantling of Loose Change:
http://www.ccdominoes.com/lc/LooseChangeGuide.html

http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/

http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/05/ ... les-i.html

D DAS · Post by **D DAS** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:23 am

also look into some of what steve jones and the scholars for truth have been researching and digging up about 9-11. he is a pshysics professor at BYU. Below is a link to a movie of one of his lectures about 9-11.

i think the idiot that posted above me needs to look into this as well. people need to stop trusting their political parents so much.

the loose change kids did make a great documentary that got a lot of people to start thinking about this, but they did mees up some data in it. these scholars for truth however come at it from a sciencetific investigation way.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... ones&hl=en

how did tower 7 collapse? why do most people not know that the 47 story tower 7 that was not hit by a plane imploded perfectly down to the ground into it's own footprint? that is just one of too many things that do not add up from that day

solovox · Post by **solovox** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:46 am

Calling someone a idiot belittles the conversation and reduces the respect that other people might have for your argument. Just a tip.

I'm quite versed in all the conspiracies of 9/11...I was reading this stuff back in the fall of 2001 on www.copvcia.com . Loose Change is SO late to the party. And again...they don't "get some of the data wrong." That's like saying the Nazis weren't "best friends" with European Jews. Loose Change does such a poor job that it works against those who would pursue the truth of that day. Again, take several hours out of your day and read the links I posted...and never forget the principle of Occam's Razor.

Instead of explosive charges and mystery missiles, we should be proving that Bush & Co. had advanced knowledge and let it happen. Consider that not all who see it differently are idiots.

D DAS · Post by **D DAS** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:57 am

i apologize for referring to you as an idiot.

and yes the simplist answer is usually preferred

but something is up here.

my dad was talking about all of this since it happened, and yes mike ruppert at copvcia has some scary ideas but i believed none of it, until the day i saw footage of tower 7 collapsing. then i started spending time looking into it because that just wasn't right, that building for sure was blown the fuck up. who did it and why i do not know but someone did. then i looked at the other towers come down as well, just does not add up.

maybe bush and co. did or did not have something to do with this, but because of this they did start a war based on lies that has killed thousands of americans and thousands upon thousands of innocent iraqi's agghani's. etc. and for that alone they should be punished for war crimes. so believing that maybe they also had something to do with or are covering something up about 9-11 is not so hard to do, these are some evil fucks.

so the simplist answer is preferred, that is the razor you brought up, and for the the simpler answer, the one that makes more sense is that explosives were used to bring those buildings down and a passanger jet did not hit the pentagon, that sounds more truthful than the offical fiction story told. because believing that fires caused not one but all three of these building to perfectly collapse would require me to believe in miracles performed by god, and if there is a god i pray he does not perform those kind of miracles. because it is impossible for that just to happen without a miracle or explosive charges.

Apocrypha · Post by **Apocrypha** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:41 am

The human race is a strange breed. What I can never understand about this whole thing is that people who read about the conspiracy theories and the arguments against them argue with each other like they are the ones who spent the countless hours studying every angle to come up with their theories when they never did any research on their own. What they consider research is basically regirgitating things they have read from others who did all the work. We can talk all day about the possibilities about what could have happened or who was responsible but no one here is going to solve this "mystery". People will believe what they choose to believe. That's really the only thing we can do, right? We won't ever unlock the key to life's greatest mysteries by arguing about them in an internet forum or even in person. Why we choose to continue to debate and argue about things like this I will never know.

rtopia · Post by **rtopia** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:22 am

solovox wrote:Instead of explosive charges and mystery missiles, we should be proving that Bush & Co. had advanced knowledge and let it happen..

If the current administration announced on Sep 10th 2001, that the FBI/CIA raided the homes of 21 people and arrested them for conspiracy to fly planes into the WTC and Pentagon...

...would you have believed them?

- r

glu · Post by **glu** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:32 am

Are looking for the answer No?

So would that justify letting them fly planes into these buildings fully knowing what was about to go down? I don't understand. What are you getting at?

Trust the administration? Ha!

Not since this bitch

and this state

glu · Post by **glu** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:36 am

CORRECTION

I HAVEN'T TRUSTED THE US GOVT since I was a little kid and I found out what they did to these folks

rbro · Post by **rbro** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:41 am

glu wrote:Are looking for the answer No?

So would that justify letting them fly planes into these buildings fully knowing what was about to go down? I don't understand. What are you getting at?

Trust the administration? Ha!

Not since this bitch

and this state

Saw this just now:

http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/08/20/l ... #more-4088

Oh, good lord. Katherine Harris is rapidly becoming the LaToya "Little Jackson that Couldn’t" Jackson of the Republican party. The Good General kindly (and 100% heterosexually) points us to this article:

ORLANDO, Fla. - Katherine Harris’ attempt to boost her campaign with a series of high-profile endorsements wilted Thursday when none of the officials appeared at her campaign rally and one of them said Harris wrongly included him on her list of supporters.

State Sen. Daniel Webster, R-Winter Garden, said he has not endorsed Harris and instead is supporting one of her challengers, Orlando attorney Will McBride.

Harris, McBride, retired Adm. LeRoy Collins and developer Peter Monroe are battling for the right to take on Democratic Sen. Bill Nelson in the general election.

Webster, a former Florida House speaker and now a state senator, said he’s been with McBride since May, when the candidate jumped into the race.

"I’ve always backed Will," said Webster. "He’ll make a great United States senator."

Webster said he had no idea why Harris listed him as one of her supporters. He said he never endorsed her.

Harris insisted that Webster promised to attend her rally Thursday at Orlando Executive Airport.

"They called back twice and said he’d be here," said Harris. "He said he was going to be here on the stage with me today."

Jesus, Katherine, how many copies of He’s Just Not That Into You am I going to have to send to you this year?

He wasn’t the only no-show for Harris’ "Soaring for the Senate" rally.

None of the nine officials listed on her event flier appeared, leaving Harris on her own to address a group of about 40 supporters, reporters and campaign staff members.

(snip)

Harris spoke in an airplane hangar that seemed to highlight the modest size of the crowd. She said a last-minute location change - required because a tree fell on the hangar where the event was supposed to be held - kept crowd numbers down.

In other words, it’s the "A Big Black Dog Ate My Campaign" approach to coping with failure.

Airport officials, however, said no hangar had been damaged by a downed tree and that the rally was held in the hangar that had been originally booked.

Mm-hmm.

"She’s truth-challenged," McBride said this week. "She has problems with the truth."

You don’t say. Shut. Up. But she was such a paragon of nonpartisan virtue back in 2000 during the recounts!

But wait, it gets better. This bit made me laugh out loud:

Harris spoke for 10 minutes saying she was the only candidate with the conservative credentials to defeat Nelson. When she finished, red, white and blue balloons dropped onto an empty stage, rendered unnecessary by the sparse crowd. (Emphasis mine.)

That image is so beautiful, it calls for a haiku:

The slow balloons fall

Like cherry blossoms in spring.

Your campaign is toast.

I’ve said it before, and I feel fairly certain I’ll say it again. Karma’s a bitch. And she knows where you live.

Dear God,

I don’t know if you just happened to be running low on your supplies of shame and self-awareness on the day you made Little Katie Harris, or if you simply sent her to Earth for comic relief, but thank you. I think. I don’t know if any amount of public humiliation will ever be able to make up for the role she played in unleashing the Bush administration upon the world, but in the meantime, watching her impale herself on the cruel spike of public indifference this fall may be one of the single greatest pleasures of the political season, so thank you.

In Jesus’ name I pray,

Amen.

eyeknow · Post by **eyeknow** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:03 am

glu wrote:CORRECTION

I HAVEN'T TRUSTED THE US GOVT since I was a little kid and I found out what they did to these folks

that is one thing I will agree with........unfortuanatly this type of behavior has exsisted longer than recorded history, in all parts of the world.

It goes on everyday. All jobs, all companies competing with each other, relationships, sports........attitudes in countries........yes.......even other than the united states............!

Today, it mostly has a different face. It's called "business"...............

Meef Chaloin · Post by **Meef Chaloin** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:26 am

solovox wrote:...and never forget the principle of Occam's Razor.

you cannot use occams razor in this circumstance, it is purely a philosophical tool, not one for decoding reality. There's certainly no logic in using it where politics is involved because the simplest explanation is rarely the correct one.

solovox · Post by **solovox** » Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:36 am

Meef Chaloin wrote:
solovox wrote:...and never forget the principle of Occam's Razor.
you cannot use occams razor in this circumstance, it is purely a philosophical tool, not one for decoding reality. There's certainly no logic in using it where politics is involved because the simplest explanation is rarely the correct one.

I disagree. When trying to convince others of a wide, wide, WIDE conspiracy of such gargantuan proportions, I think Occam's Razor is quite apt with "reality." I only mention it here to draw a distinction between the "what ifs" of a conspiracy vs. the more prosaic and likely explanation of Muslim fanatics attacking us. I agree with you completely that the why of the attack and the politics surrounding it all is more complex...no doubt.

But as they say, with extraordinary claims must come extraordinary evidence. And I've become convinced that millions of Americans are not content with the prosaic explanation of 9/11. The why behind that would certainly keep us away from music-making for too long.