Question regarding pre-recorded loops with FX in Ableton...

rossc · Post by **rossc** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 12:28 pm

I'm trying to recreate a song I made in Cubase so that it can be played live using Ableton. I've recorded various short instrument loops from the original track like drums, bass, main lead, etc. Loops like the main lead also contain the fx (i.e. long delay) I used on that instrument. The problem is that when I play the loop in Ableton everytime the loop retriggers (Every 8 bars) the fx are cut short.

My question is whether there is any way round this without either...

a) having to revert to record the instruments dry and re-program all the fx within Ableton

or

b) Record the entire track as a loop, rather than just 8 bars of it.

Any ideas would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Ross

bigbadotis · Post by **bigbadotis** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 4:39 pm

The only idea i had:

1. Render each loop for double the length you want it to play w/ effects

2. Use the last half of the loop in live, either by editing the file in a wave editing program or just adjusting the loop time in Live.

The effects from the first half of the loop will trail into the second half that is actually played, simulating what would happen if the effects from the end of the loop were carried over to the beginning.

kenan · Post by **kenan** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 4:48 pm

Try this:

1. Record the loop dry in Cubase
2. Load the loop into Live
3. Add effects in Live
4. Record to the arrangement
5. Render "As Loop"

This will cause Live to "wrap" the effects around to the beginning of the clip.

-kenan

kenan · Post by **kenan** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 4:54 pm

I suppose I should read the whole post before I go responding....

Apologies.

Another idea:

If you render 9 bars out of Cubase (the last bar conaining just the effects tail), you could then set up 1 loop containing just the full 8 bars and then another loop that contains the 1 bar of the effects tail and then 7 bars of silence. These 2 loops could then be rendered to disk as a single loop.

-kenan

Amberience · Post by **Amberience** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 4:58 pm

That last idea is the one I would use dude.

rossc · Post by **rossc** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 5:30 pm

Thanks for the taking the time to reply guys, much appreciated.

Your post about rendering the file so as to wrap the effects back to the beginning was interesting - if Cubase had a similar function then my problems would be solved but as far as I'm aware it doesn't? Anyone know?

I will give your other suggestion a go this evening though, sounds like it might well do the trick.

Thanks a lot

Ross

bigbadotis · Post by **bigbadotis** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 9:00 pm

That seems like some extra steps from what I described above. Maybe I wasn't clear enough.

How about this:

1. Render the loop playing twice w/fx from inside Cubase.
2. In Live, set the loop points for the file to only play the repeat of the loop.

That's it.

rossc · Post by **rossc** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 9:38 pm

bigbadotis...

Your absolutely right! I must admit when I wrote my first reply I hadn't quite figured out what you had meant. It was only after i'd logged off the net that the penny dropped and I realised what it was you were saying. Haven't had a chance to try it yet but i'm sure your method is going to work out.

Thanks again for all the replies,

Ross

kenan · Post by **kenan** » Wed Feb 18, 2004 11:18 pm

Yep. bigbadotis' method is quicker and less error prone. And it has the added advantage that you have access to a 'dry' first beat should you want it.

-kenan

Ti-Groove · Post by **Ti-Groove** » Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:38 pm

The best way is trying to recreate the fx in Ableton,because the delay i.e. is "delayed" that means it is just after a few ms audiable.
So if you only play the 2. 8-bar Loop the delay is audiable from the very beginning which is mostly not wanted.Same for reverbs

Just my 2 cents

rossc · Post by **rossc** » Fri Feb 20, 2004 1:39 am

Just a quick note to say that i've tried the method bigbadotis suggested and it's working well. Your right Ti-Groove, it's not perfect and the isolated delay at the start of a loop the first time you trigger can be a problem, but all in all i'm happy with it.

Cheers,

Ross

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Feb 24, 2004 11:41 pm

Hi, I downloaded the demo of Live yesterday, and I'm having a similar (but different) issue.

As I understand it, what bigbadotis was suggesting is to create 1 loop (of 2 segments).

The 1st half of the loop being the "first iteration" of the loop, where there's no trailing effects at the start of the loop segment. And, the 2nd half being the "loop iteration" where the trailling effects -are- at the start of the loop segment. Then what happens is that you just change the loop points depending on what half of the loop you want to play.

Is this correct?

If so, is it practical to extend this idea further where you have a 3rd iteration of the loop which just contains the trailing effects? I was thinking that this would be handy for sweeping pad sounds that have long trails, so that you could smoothly mix them in and out; without it stopping abruptly?

So, in a nutshell you'd play the 1st segment when you trigger the sound. You'd keep looping through the 2nd segment as long as necessary. Then, when you want to mix the sound out you'd play the 3rd segment. Does this sound plausible?

bigbadotis · Post by **bigbadotis** » Wed Feb 25, 2004 12:34 am

Sounds like you've got it all together, and that's a good idea about the trail as well. Just put the three different clips in the same track and trigger as needed.