Savable Clip envelopes please

ethios4 · Post by **ethios4** » Wed Jan 14, 2004 2:32 am

I just noticed that the Envelope settings are not saved with the Clip. It would be very useful to be able to save those settings. I like to use the envelopes for rhythmic gating-type effects. It's great to have a series of 1 bar rhythms that are selected by changing the start position of the unlinked envelope loop. But when the funs over all that envelope programming is lost when the clip is deleted. So, being able to save the envelopes with the clip would be great! thanks for the absolutely fabulous software!

Jed · Post by **Jed** » Tue Feb 03, 2004 12:05 am

Definitely!!

P King · Post by **P King** » Tue Feb 10, 2004 5:03 pm

add to that to have preset envelopes for eg 16 note gating...and some for interesting pitch bends in clips...

Per Boysen · Post by **Per Boysen** » Tue Feb 10, 2004 6:19 pm

--> ethios4

I can't agree more on that!

Clip envelopes should be saveabel but saved "clip envelope pre-sets" should also be assignable to midi commands for being recalled and applied to the clip.

With a wonderful (but yet simple) feature like that we would be able to recall audio data on the fly and with a kick on a midi pedal apply melodies or groovy rhythmic gates.

I think Live is great for tweaked playback of pre-fabricated loops from the drive, but it still doesn't cut it for live looping with original "on the fly" material.

Mbazzy · Post by **Mbazzy** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 10:10 am

Create a number of basic envelope presets with just a minimal amount of audio info [ Live won't read empty audiofiles ] .

Reserve one track for that kind of "clips" ...

Now whenever you need to apply that envelope to a certain clip, drag the clip in question upon the clipview [ minimal ] waveform [ not the slot ! ] and the envelope will be applied to that sample.

Ctrl-Z will undo .

As there is just a minimal amount of audio in such a clip, you could even keep it looping with the rest to have better sync.

Per Boysen · Post by **Per Boysen** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 12:56 pm

Yes, I know. THat's the recent "workaround" I'd like to get away from. Would be much more "live" to apply stored clip envelopes presets by external midi command (i.e. stomping a midi floor board while using your hands to play instruments)

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:01 pm

I think Live is great for tweaked playback of pre-fabricated loops from the drive, but it still doesn't cut it for live looping with original "on the fly" material.[/quote]

I'd have to strongly disagree there and say that Live kicks andy hardware or software loopers butt imho. Save for the overdub and reverse functions, Live has a huge myriad or advantages, let see--unlimited number of clips/loops, each clip can be as long or short as you want, great effects, sends, pans, faders, clip envelopes, felxible midi routing--sure some of these aren't as easy to do with just foot pedals, but c'mon, Live is wayyy better than the best hardware (echoplex or repeater), and it definitely cuts it for live looping with original "on the fly" material. Check it out, all live and no pre-recorded (using FL rewired)

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/7/mixedbagmusic.htm

Ryan

Per Boysen · Post by **Per Boysen** » Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:36 pm

Ryan wrote:I'd have to strongly disagree there...

I seems as we're not talking about the same kind of "on the fly" audio loop manipulation. Here are two sound clips that illustrate live looping techniques that are not yet possible to perform in Live.

http://www.boysen.se/studio/edp_strat_01.mp3
This is a firsttake guitar/echoplex improvisation. Guitar signal and echoplex signal were recorded into Live on separate tracks. The drum loop was set up in Live as pre preparation. Check out how the echoplex lets me chop out 32 notes and cut them into the loop and also how the loop can be pitch shifted one octave up/down and also reversed.

http://www.looproom.com/audio/Five_Nord ... s_clip.mp3
This is a saxophone/Repeater/Echoplex improvisation, also a first-take with all loop manipulation happening in realtime while playing the instrument. I was working two loops here, but the loop in the Repeater had four tracks (one used for bass by pitching down one octave). Recorded to one stereo track. No multi tracking, the true "live sound".

quandry · Post by **quandry** » Tue Feb 24, 2004 1:11 am

I enjoyed your clips, per. I guess I was just trying to illustrate that Live is a formidible looping tool in and of itself. It's got advantages and disadvantages when compared to the repeater or echoplex. The disadvantages I've noticed and that you're pointing out are lack or midi controllable pitch shifting (though you can do it with a mouse), lack of reverse (though there are plug-ins and rewire apps that can do this), the lack of overdub (okay Live loses here, but makes up for it in number of tracks you can loop on), and the lack of slicing features offered at your toes by echoplex.

I think your underlying comments are based on what Live can (or can't) do with just midi and a foot controller. This is somewhat limited, but I think its great to push for Live recognizing this type of performer, and implenting features (midiable delete button, hello!) that would be of use to the hands-free performer. I think it would be great if clip properties we're midified (that would get us the pitch shifting), if we could save clip envelopes (slicing effects), and if they give us reverse and throw in midi control of the playback position of the clip (scratchin).

But for all these shortcomings to hardware loopers in a hands-free perfromance atmosphere, Live still has a lot to offer. At least for me, I find that the number of tracks available on Live for loops allows me to get some stuff going and then have both hands dedicated to manipulating the loops and sounds. The continuous ability to control the volume, pan, length, and effects for each individual loop is a huge advantage of Live over hardware. The greatest thing about Live right now is its flexibility--each person seems to use it in a slightly different way, there's much to be learned from everyone's setups. The tracks in my link are also 100% Live from the night of the perfromance, recording Live's master out as a stereo clip, they're just edits in the middle of tunes that are built up.

Ryan

Savable Clip envelopes please

Savable Clip envelopes please

Workaround