ableton creating a saturated market for producers?

[slicedbread]

ableton live + illegal immigration is taking all our jobs away!

seriously, be the best at what you do and you'll never have to use that argument.

[Josh Von]

When it comes down to it you either have skill or you suck. The people that have no talent usually get overwhelmed by technology and produce garbage. Music lovers can always spot a great song from a bad one.

This is the answer I think as well ...

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[knotkranky]

The computer above all else. Thankfully, poop in is still poop out. But sometimes poop in can be greatness out with the right talent on a computer working ot. And in turn, greatness in can be poop out in an instant at any moment. So, the ever expanding field is level at the end of the day.

[kennerb]

I don't remember where this stat is from exactly but I read an article a while back about a large group of 16-24 yr olds who when asked 80% thought that in their lifetime they're be famous.

could you imagine a concert with 80 people on stage and 20 in the audience!

Sounds like polyphonic spree to me

[forge]

Seems like it might be self-balancing to me. Sure, there are 1000% more bedroom producers out there, but that just means its harder than ever to get noticed, which means 99.9% of those bedroom producers will give up after a few years because they can't handle the sacrifice necessary to actually make a living doing this.
....

that's how I see it

god I've wasted the last 10 years of my life thinking I could get somewhere and I've given up now because I've accepted it's just more effort than it's worth

(ironically now I'll probably start making music with more substance)

the people who do well have to live and breathe music and if they do then it will one day work out for them - because only a small percentage of people can really do that

one of my best mates in England I started making music with a few years ago has just carried on living and breathing it, and now he's actually starting to get somewhere - and the respect he's getting is REAL respect (as opposed to the disposable 15 minutes kind) because people know he's worth his salt and has put in the hard yards

someone not so long ago made a post here about people "cheapening" the title "musician" by using it too liberally

but to me this whole line of thinking is really insecure, (and maybe a little greedy or miserly) - like you're scared all these people having their stab are taking away your chance at the limelight

I heard an interview with Paul McCartney once where the the interviewer asked how many tunes he had made up and then lost and he said "probably thousands, but if it's any good it sticks. if I cant remember it the next morning how can I expect anyone else to?"

I think you have to just do what you do and if it's any good and you put it out there at some point it will come back - the law of Karma

really if you're too caught up on the end result I think you end up sabotaging your art

[elektrovert]

I've seen some absolutely incredible musicians playing for peanuts... even for nothing.

Respect to those with character not interested in selling their souls for the Almighty Buck...

Not really, you can make a living from your music without selling your soul, in fact, I think if you're that good at it you owe it to yourself to earn money from it.

Why let manufactured groups, big corporations and the mega-rich keep it all?

if you can earn money from your music you should, if you care that much about it you can always put the money back into it, or into helping bands with no money get off the ground or something.

that "not in it for the money" attitude is bollox!

[hambone1]

True, as long as money isn't your primary objective.

If you can keep true to yourself and to your craft, and make a living out it, that's fantastic!

[-art-]

Seems like it might be self-balancing to me. Sure, there are 1000% more bedroom producers out there, but that just means its harder than ever to get noticed, which means 99.9% of those bedroom producers will give up after a few years because they can't handle the sacrifice necessary to actually make a living doing this.

I agree with this. Nothing has ever been the same things are always changing. File sharing, netlabels, myspace, all these things have taken off in a matter of years. People are into music for passion, love and sharing again and thats great. The producers will be fine, thats what they do, produce, remix, get signed, tour. Its not for everyone, some people just want to make tunes and share and its not about getting noticed or becoming big. I think for some people it is simply no choice. I am feeling more and more like this every day. There is nothing else i can do. Music is my life. I can't be a builder or a labourer, this is the only thing i can do. So if your going to survive off it you have to push. Getting big or noticed should only be as a result of your contribution to the community, to the network around you and to the world. It will happen automatically when you deserve it.

[adrianalex]

Come on guys. Make music for yourself first. Who cares what recognition you get?

I know most do. I do. but first I want to become an Ableton expert, use whatever gear I have to surprise myself.

If I wanted to go the standard route I wouldn't be using Ableton. I'd be in music school. I am getting too old to entertain fantasies about being as successful asthe Neptunes. be true to yourself and success will come right?

Okay jump on me now for being a hippie.

Music has ALWAYS been about marketing. Play that game if you want to. If you havethe talent. Otherwise for the rest of us, be proud of every track you finish, see the originality in it that no one else sees. And send me the myspace link to your good quality mp3, because I WILL PLAY IT WHEN NO ONE ELSE WILL.

Promoters in town were asking me to describe my music. You know what I said?

LOW BITRATE BLOGTRASH. I like playing music I find on myspace and blogs.

Frick the mainstream.

[nebulae]

to a certain extend but im more inclined to think its the fault of cracks rather than any of the DAW makers. Anyone can download a crack & make music to their hearts content, however, like in the days of hardware, if they have to shell out a few hundred bucks to do it i think a lot less would be out there.

Does feel like there's too many artists now to ever get noticed. But then im not really sure what being noticed means...record deals? They seem to becoming less in number and importance at the same time as artists are growing.

The fewer barriers to entry there are, the more talent comes to the pool. If the talent pool is crowded, then if forces everything to bring a better game and push the envelope. I don't care if its software, hardware, or cracks, but the point is that there are a lot more people making music. Therefore, the music itself must get better, and that's a really good thing.

Record companies have only stagnated creativity in the past 15 years. I love how the Internet has come along and made record companies obsolete. That too is a good thing.

[Johnisfaster]

to answer the original question I don't think ableton is saturating the market, I think fruityloops is highly to blame for producer saturation as well as items like the electribe that people buy and instantly start making trance and house.

[ethios4]

forge, you're awesome

[nebulae]

But the concept is still the same...one can say that before Live/Acid/Sonar/looping technology, people had to do their own drums. The principle is same - making music easier allows more people to create music. But doing so, the music itself must get better.

Another example is the recent crop of glitch plugins. Now you too can glitch just like BT and Hybrid! Well yes, and no. Just means that now glitching must be that much better, since the ease of glitching is now upon all of us.

[Johnisfaster]

it's not unlike the guitar world actually, almost every kid in a suburban neighborhood owns a guitar. but most of them don't play well and even if they do play well they never start a band, and even if they start a band they get a crappy singer. and if everything pulls together right maybe they do start a good band and just plain don't have the magic it takes to make it big.

it's not unlike that in the electro world. just cause alot of people are doing it doesn't mean they are any good.

I wonder how many accoustic guitars were getting used in the folk era. oddly enough I've heard people compare the new electronic surgance to the old folk rise. for the first time since the folk era you have millions of people sitting by themselves making music, only this time they aren't playing a guitar they are using a laptop.

[nebulae]

Yeah, I can see the folk comparison. Sort of like Kraftwerk meets Dylan meets Gates/Jobs.