ZOOM KEYS PLEASE

[Josh Von]

I have a problem with the fact that you act like you know everything about everything.

I click on a link here during my day, pop in for 30 seconds and at times more when something catches my eye to express my opinion.

Thats all this is to me .. honest

Its a very simple thing for me.

If my opinions are strong ones and disagree with the majority, or I have definite ideas about the way things could be better ... I say so

Im not really one to follow along with the crowd or be intimidated to say what I really think. Thats true ..

If over time people have listened to what I have to say, and have taken value from it, then thats great

How can I word my opinions and my posts to make you feel better about yourself? I will take some direction from you on this


.

[leisuremuffin]

oh, i already said everything i need to say about it.


think whatever you want to.



.lm.

[duffcat]

Guys. PLease lets keep this post on topic. Josh Von, I agree with you. You seem fairly knowledgeable in computers generally. Personally, seeing more interface elements mapped would be nice (eg. Logic Audio). However, my main beef is Zooming, as I consider this to be basic functionality when working with large projects.

Out of everything that most people do on a DAW, going in and out of zoom levels tops the list. I must do this 100's of times a day. I compose music for a living. More efficient Zooming would save me valuable time in Live.

I love this program and would like to make it my main Sequencer/Mixer/Editor. Right now, I use Logic as my front end and Live as a secondary tool.... The main reason for this is that Live is missing some basic functions such as audio crossfades and zoom presets., which brings me back to the point of this poll.

Please vote!

-C

[leisuremuffin]

Y'know i think this is kinda funny, because one of the things i really like about live is how it handles zoom in arrangement. To me it's just as fast to look at the visual representation of the whole arrangement that's at the top of the screen and drag the box what i want to look at. Then the click and drag up or down to zoom in or out works great for me....

i hear what you cats are saying, but it just doesn't seem like a big deal to me.



.lm.

[duffcat]

Great! Leiisuremufin. I'm glad you like the zoom functions already existing in Live. I do too. We are not asking to take that away. We are asking to add to this for those of us who use sequencers and editors 10 or more hours a day.

In other words, we are asking to add power keys. The present zoom methods are fine for performance; however, I am arguing that they are too restrictive and slow for editing and composition in arrange.

[mooncaine]

Ableton. Please listen to your users. Zooming with the mouse is not quick and precise enough for pro use.

It's also seriously detrimental to a pro's health to use the mouse too much. When you start putting in long hours using a computer program, you begin to realize why custom shortcut key commands are important.

I'm culling/editing hours of audio this week and next, using Cubase LE because I can set up keys for quick operation: mark, split, delete, copy, zoom in/out, switch track, etc. I've put in more than 40 hours this week alone using that app. If I had used Live, my hands would be hurting long before the week's end.

[mooncaine]

i.e.
a key command that automatically fits the loop length to the width of the arrange window..

Essential to fast, pain-free work. That's one of the reasons I'm using Cubase this week.

[mooncaine]

I would be interested in hearing your opinion: are you missing being able to zoom with other keys than '+' and '-', so you say they are 'rudimentory', or do you miss other functions?

Regards,
Amaury

My opinion: let the user reassign the zoom keys [ANY keys, actually]. They may have a good reason to change them that you haven't thought of.

Examples: left-handedness, using different keyboard, only need certain operations for a certain gig ....

I reassigned keys in Cubase this past week so that I could do most of my work without moving my hands. I used the JKL keys, for example, and the numpad keys. I was listening to dialogue and intercutting it to make several tracks into one conversation [for an animation soundtrack].

Next time I use Cubase it might be for another job, so the fact that Cubase let me save these custom shortcuts to a file means the WORLD to me. I named the files so I'd know what's in them. I can call up these shortcuts again if I do more dialogue work, or go back to a set I use for making my own music.

There's a lot I don't like about using that app, but having power over the keyboard layout, and having separate files that store the keyboard shortcuts, makes it the tool of choice in my humble collection when I need to put in long hours.

[mooncaine]

If you think that sounds neat, please vote. -C

The trouble with voting is that I don't know what I'm voting for, since I haven't used Logic nor Pro Tools enough to know how their zoom tools work.

[duffcat]

Hi Mooncaine. Thanks for the constructive feedback. I am not suggesting that we vote for functions that mimic Pro Tools or Logic. I am making the point that pro apps such as logic and PT and including Cubase, of course, have power keys for zooming. I see this type of functionality as essential. I am asking you to vote on whether or not you would like to see key-command based zooming implemented in Live. ....It seems like you do, so please add your voice.

Ableton IS listening. This is what I love about this company!

[Josh Von]

There's a lot I don't like about using that app, but having power over the keyboard layout, and having separate files that store the keyboard shortcuts, makes it the tool of choice in my humble collection when I need to put in long hours.

This is the key I think, one of the very first things I do (within the first minute) when I open up any brand new program for the first time -- I look for the keyboard shortcuts and editor.

When I looked at all the DAWs it was the very first thing -- when I opened Live 2 for the first time I thought "thats odd" that we couldnt reassign anything, and that the built in shortcuts werent comprehensive

Also that more advanced shortcuts ... like a ProTools Tab to Transient function etc .. are so long in coming (4 versions later). We have more or less the same controls for zooming and focusing we had then

Any repetitive motion -- like zooming -- should be ergonomically re-assignable to any keys we design it to. This is a huge timesaver and saves your hands from cramping with less tedious moves and clicking

User definable shortcuts / Pre-set zoom levels / ZOOM to selection / ZOOM to fit window / Mousewheel zoom .. etc -- all these things are super important imo and not having them is one of the main things blocking creativity and speed still

.

[mooncaine]

Any repetitive motion -- like zooming -- should be ergonomically re-assignable to any keys we design it to. This is a huge timesaver and saves your hands from cramping with less tedious moves and clicking.

Yes!

In my view, any controls should be re-assignable, as a general rule, always, for every app -- it's too great an advantage for users to do without. It helps left-handers, one-handers, no-handers, the blind, whomever ... as well as busy pros trying to get work done quickly and as painlessly as possible. This includes any operations done with a mouse, whenever possible.

Also, the keyboard shortcuts should be saved in an external text file, named & saved by the user [as well as all other personal changes to the program, such as appearance settings, I/O settings, etc].

@duffcat: OK, I voted 'yes'. Thanks for bringing this up. It's been [literally] a painful issue.

[Josh Von]

In my view, any controls should be re-assignable, as a general rule, always, for every app -- it's too great an advantage for users to do without. It helps left-handers, one-handers, no-handers, the blind, whomever ... as well as busy pros trying to get work done quickly and as painlessly as possible.

Exactly -- its a matter of basic ergonmics and muscle memory ....

Gamers - especially multiplayer gamers - totally understand this and we used to meticulously map the movement / fire / interface keys for competition

This includes any operations done with a mouse, whenever possible.

Yes -- this is the mantra we always go back to on this board, just about every person that uses this program in any way -- after a very short time they are realizing that they want the mouse out of the picture as much as possible

Also, the keyboard shortcuts should be saved in an external text file, named & saved by the user [as well as all other personal changes to the program, such as appearance settings, I/O settings, etc].

Great - yes nothing is worse than laboring over the perfect keyboard layout for your purpose then losing it ... other than maybe losing your wallet and cellphone in Miami ...
.

[djfreshbadcompany]

It would be great to have some kind of zoom control for the clips you could assign to midi, when youre mixing you dont really want to be looking at the computer, apart from anything else it just looks really uncool .. in my ideal world i would use ableton live without even having to look at the computer .. and to be honest if you get the right controller/s you can get close

I dont really understand how it can be possible to map the nudge buttons but not the associated clip zoom that allows you to then see where you are in the track!!

definetely mappable zoom controls in general would be amazing

keep up the good work
:thumbs up:

[Josh Von]

I dont really understand how it can be possible to map the nudge buttons but not the associated clip zoom that allows you to then see where you are in the track!!

definetely mappable zoom controls in general would be amazing

Totally agree - User Preset Zoom levels, say three of them:

- Zoom Level 1, Level 2, Level 3

I believe Cubase has a feature similar to this - you manually set a Zoom level then save it for instant recall

For instance: set Zoom to Full Out (entire waveform), 2/1 (about three minutes of an 8 minute track, and 1/1 for DJing

Or -- set the levels at 1/1, 1/8, 1/32nd for production editing

Then we save these as an instant preset and recall them with Keyboard or MIDI

Lots of problems solved imo

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