Ableton 7 it's a joke !!!

Landser · Post by **Landser** » Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:13 pm

I find the workflow improvements from the announcements so far very weak, too.
And what i don't understand, after watching the drumrack-video: L7 is already capable to hide tracks. Why don't they implement folder-tracks then?

friend_kami · Post by **friend_kami** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:19 pm

hoffman2k wrote:Recording CC in Session view...
Touchy subject. I'm disappointed again that its not there. I do however believe that there are enough solutions to make it work.

Lets put things in perspective. Ableton rewrote the MIDI engine. It can now be tested in beta 2. Pretty soon you'll see some results of how tight it is or isn't.
Ableton also stated that they'll be releasing Audio/MIDI fact sheets. This means you'll be able to see how tight they believe it is. And you'll be able to contest it if that isn't the case.

The things I just mentioned are pretty damn essential if we want hair-fine accuracy of recording/playback of our CC's.
And the function is more then just turning a knob and recording it...
We need a Midi-Thinning control, a dry/wet for individual automation envelopes and probably some more things.

The way i see it, you need 2 CC's to control and record 1.
One CC is the one being recorded to your clip. The other one allows you to control the parameter manually without affecting automation.
On the other hand, you would want this controller to be recorded in arrangement view. because the controller allows you to control the intensity of the applied clip automation.

Thats just one solution. Other people have posted their theories.
Its just a matter of having the most stable version of Live as possible.
A lot of energy has gone into fixing loads of bugs. Read Live 6.0.10..... Live 6 has been in beta pretty much all year. If Live 7 actually improves stability (and it is stable as far as i can tell), Ableton wont need a year to make more essential updates to Live.

as pointed out by Silicon/Silicium, now that i re-read this i realise that that it is exactly what it does indeed.

Tweaking Knobs · Post by **Tweaking Knobs** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:31 pm

i really dont care about the new "improvements" the new drums stuff and all those "new instrument"

we need real dummy cliops , are they allready in live 7 ?

TR_606 · Post by **TR_606** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:26 pm

The only thing that *really* upsets me about Live 7 is the pricing structure.

I've always thought that charging extra for Operator/Simpler etc took the piss, but Live 7 for me, crosses the line.

I think the whole thing should be a single package, at a reasonable price. No more of this wallet-crippling mix & match nonsense.

Live 7 is going to do nothing to change would-be crack version users' minds.

Angstrom · Post by **Angstrom** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:18 pm

well, that's just silly.
many people wouldn't want the orchestral stuff, and they certainly wouldn't want to be forced into paying for it. Unless you are suggesting that Ableton give it away. Which isn't going to happen is it?

I don't see how that one-size-fits-all approach is better
wait a minute your last line sheds a bit of light on this.

TR_606 wrote: Live 7 is going to do nothing to change would-be crack version users' minds.

oh well, boo hoo.

condra · Post by **condra** » Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:21 pm

Tweaking Knobs wrote:
we need real dummy cliops , are they allready in live 7 ?

I was also hoping for improved dummy clips via a multi effects device with envelopes, but unfortunatly it didnt arrive. Check out Devine Machine Lucifer, or Sugar Bytes Artillary 2

nathannn · Post by **nathannn** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 2:43 am

so far on paper live does look like just new instruments. alot of uneeded instruments that have been done countless of times by countless of people.
there is the 64 bit thing wich is a plus i guess but, no improvements to the piano roll no dual monitor support no fucking surround mixing.
and it isnt just ableton thats pushing lame upgrades of shit that should have been done v1.
i should have chose pro tools along time ago!

leedsquietman · Post by **leedsquietman** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 3:37 am

You got to be kidding?

PTLE/M-Powered has terrible MIDI, no plug in delay compensation, 32 track limit, uses a proprietary plugin format (rtas) which restricts plugin choice (and yes vst>rtas wrappers exist but is a messy workaround which adds latency), no session view, limited plugins unless you upgrade to bomb factory 2, and ties you to the mbox, m-audio or digi 002 or 003 hardware, no MOTU, RME, Echo etc hardware.

Dominik · Post by **Dominik** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:13 am

gnrg....yeah a lot of negative..

anyway abes are the god's of daw's.

BUT!!!!!!

convince me to UPgrade!!!

Dominik · Post by **Dominik** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:20 am

support no fucking surround mixing.

i recommend a sound card with multiple outputs.

bah, what a stupid.

steff3 · Post by **steff3** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 7:36 am

[quote="Angstrom"]

I don't see how that one-size-fits-all approach is better
.[/quote]

Well, it would make support easier and as Live also lives from the community sharing files (not programs) would be easier.

best

andydes · Post by **andydes** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:47 pm

TR_606 wrote:The only thing that *really* upsets me about Live 7 is the pricing structure.

I've always thought that charging extra for Operator/Simpler etc took the piss, but Live 7 for me, crosses the line.

I think the whole thing should be a single package, at a reasonable price. No more of this wallet-crippling mix & match nonsense.

Live 7 is going to do nothing to change would-be crack version users' minds.

Have you seen the download price of the suite? 6 instruments (counting the drum machines, operator and sampler) for an extra 200 euros. 33 euros per instrument. I believe operator is 129 euros to buy standalone and sampler 169 euros.

If you already have sampler and operator you get 20 euros off for each, so that's still only 40 euros per instrument you're paying.

So how exactly is this taking the piss? Sounds like a much better deal to me. If you want to buy the instruments separately, buy all means go ahead.

People keep complaining about the add on prices, but I'm not sure why. Previously, operator and smapler were too expensive. They've crossed the line in the right direction.

OK, the orchestral samples are pretty pricey, but I get the impression it's about the same as similar packs by third parties (which is what they are).

borg · Post by **borg** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 2:27 pm

andydes wrote:If you already have sampler and operator you get 20 euros off for each...

i own both... so basically (if this is true) people who have supported ableton from the start will see other people buy fairly new instruments at giveaway prices. i'm not a grumpy guy, but ableton does very little to loyal customers. very little... (bought 1.5 and upgraded to 3, 4, 5 ,6, operator and sampler... with only a juvenile bonus of a few stickers and a keychain.)

i think the bare bone upgrade is to some extent justifiable, but the pricing of the instrument pack for people owning sampler and operator is

Rosko · Post by **Rosko** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 2:27 pm

Think the only reason price has become an issue is because logic is so cheap. The only reason logic is so cheap is to get people to buy macs.

Igor L · Post by **Igor L** » Wed Oct 10, 2007 3:11 pm

TR_606 wrote:The only thing that *really* upsets me about Live 7 is the pricing structure.

I've always thought that charging extra for Operator/Simpler etc took the piss, but Live 7 for me, crosses the line.

I think the whole thing should be a single package, at a reasonable price. No more of this wallet-crippling mix & match nonsense.

Live 7 is going to do nothing to change would-be crack version users' minds.

Can't afford the add-ons? Don't buy them. Seems like a very flexible pricing structure. I'd love to drive a Ferrari but I can't afford one, so instead of complaining to Ferrari about their pricing structure I drive what I can afford. That's life.