I just think it's it's a nonsense way of selling their gear.
Everything should be included in a single package - and that should be priced no more than the boxed Live 6.
That way everybody gets the same experience.
I will re-install a windows partition back onto my MBP, and use a cracked Live 7 - something i *really don't want to do after buying legit Live 5 & 6 for my Mac.
Last week I picked up a retail Logic Studio for £118 (HE). I know it's not fair to expect Ableton to do anything this drastic - but, come on - enough of the yearly rapeage already!
Ableton 7 it's a joke !!!
OK, hang on. Are you saying that the live 7 suite is too cheap?borg wrote:i own both... so basically (if this is true) people who have supported ableton from the start will see other people buy fairly new instruments at giveaway prices. i'm not a grumpy guy, but ableton does very little to loyal customers. very little... (bought 1.5 and upgraded to 3, 4, 5 ,6, operator and sampler... with only a juvenile bonus of a few stickers and a keychain.)andydes wrote:If you already have sampler and operator you get 20 euros off for each...
i think the bare bone upgrade is to some extent justifiable, but the pricing of the instrument pack for people owning sampler and operator is
Or that you should be reimbursed what you paid for operator and sampler, effectively being paid to get the extra instruments?
What do you expect? Ableton is a business. Live, Operator and Sampler are products. Operator and Sampler are towards the end of their product cycle where pretty much everyone who was going to buy them at full price has done. They’ve now offered them as part of a bundle. A lot of people were arguing (and still are) that they be included free. Seems like a good compromise to me.
I assume that you’ve thought about each upgrade and decided that the features added were worth the price. So what’s the problem? You pay your money, you get the software. What do you think that Ableton owes you?
Happens with everything. I bought a Novation Nova for £650. 3 months later, you could get it for £400. Could I ask for the £250 back? Did being a previous Novation customer entitle me to discounts on their other products? Of course it didn’t.
Frankly, everyone should be grateful for any discounts they do get. I think Ableton has done it’s best to give good fair upgrade prices to it’s customers. Especially considering everyone disagrees on whether they should be included or not, developed by ableton or by a third party.
Sorry if you feel hard done by, but some people are always going to do better than others with this kind of deal. Previous users of Logic pro have been much harder hit (since everyone’s making comparisons, these days).
A whiner and a thief...way to represent yourself, mate.TR_606 wrote:I just think it's it's a nonsense way of selling their gear.
Everything should be included in a single package - and that should be priced no more than the boxed Live 6.
That way everybody gets the same experience.
I will re-install a windows partition back onto my MBP, and use a cracked Live 7 - something i *really don't want to do after buying legit Live 5 & 6 for my Mac.
Last week I picked up a retail Logic Studio for £118 (HE). I know it's not fair to expect Ableton to do anything this drastic - but, come on - enough of the yearly rapeage already!
I want a nice big Motorhome with all the trimmings and a studio built in.
Unfortunately they are about £20k or more. I can get a small one on my budget, but I demand that my unrealistic expectations are met because I am me and I cannot think of anyone more important.
If expensive Motorhomes do not go on sale at less than cost price, I will steal one. Because I want one and that makes perfect sense to me.
Signed, King Canute
Unfortunately they are about £20k or more. I can get a small one on my budget, but I demand that my unrealistic expectations are met because I am me and I cannot think of anyone more important.
If expensive Motorhomes do not go on sale at less than cost price, I will steal one. Because I want one and that makes perfect sense to me.
Signed, King Canute
I'm not for cracked software or anything, but your analogy is completely false. A motorhome is actually owned by you and resellable at a decent price. Software loses all value and is not really even owned by you (licensed or some crap). I paid $350 for operator and sampler in september (around 30 days ago) and now it's worth around $50 total. Why? It's software and has no real value except what the company says it is. Software companies sometimes don't let you sell their software or charge you a transfer fee to sell your license (not that ableton does). I love my virus ti, because at least I know its mine (I can sell it, lend it, whatever)Angstrom wrote:I want a nice big Motorhome with all the trimmings and a studio built in.
Unfortunately they are about £20k or more. I can get a small one on my budget, but I demand that my unrealistic expectations are met because I am me and I cannot think of anyone more important.
If expensive Motorhomes do not go on sale at less than cost price, I will steal one. Because I want one and that makes perfect sense to me.
Signed, King Canute
I like software for a lot of things, but I spend a lot of money on software, and it retains no value.
so vehicles don't depreciate?
I think they do
also, the value of them is set by the market, same as with software. They are all just commodities. You think that diamonds are really worth what the shops say?
to extend my analogy:
The value of a motorhome is as perceived by the market, branding somehow adds value. So, despite many complaints that motorhomes are too expensive the public continues to purchase them at that inflated price.
That's how capitalism works, perceived value is actually determined by the consumer acting en-masse. If you dislike a price, you don't pay it and if enough people do that then the manufacturer gets a strong message to lower the price.rices. Following the maxim - if you don't like it then do it better yourself.
I think they do
also, the value of them is set by the market, same as with software. They are all just commodities. You think that diamonds are really worth what the shops say?
to extend my analogy:
The value of a motorhome is as perceived by the market, branding somehow adds value. So, despite many complaints that motorhomes are too expensive the public continues to purchase them at that inflated price.
That's how capitalism works, perceived value is actually determined by the consumer acting en-masse. If you dislike a price, you don't pay it and if enough people do that then the manufacturer gets a strong message to lower the price.rices. Following the maxim - if you don't like it then do it better yourself.
so I take the piss because this guy is whinging , I am a forum nazi , but troll boy says the same thing and it it is ok.steve-o wrote:+1TITBAG wrote:yawn at predictable uptight moaning and even more predictable uptight holier-than-though forum nazis
amazing cognitive dissonance there
[x]killfilter
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dj superflat
- Posts: 1279
- Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:31 pm
- Location: leadville, CO
retains no value? you mean retains no resale value, right? and even there, that's debatable (i'm sure there are kids in mumbai dying to get their hands on live 4, though they may not pay what you'd like). here's the other thing -- you don't need to upgrade, don't really need much of the functionality from recent updates, you just want it. where do you get this sense of entitlement to a free lunch? you pay for food that's got no resale value and quickly loses any value to you, right?
i mean, sure, i'd like to magicly escape the bonds of economics, but doesn't seem likely to happen soon.
i mean, sure, i'd like to magicly escape the bonds of economics, but doesn't seem likely to happen soon.
LOL at your kill filterAngstrom wrote:so I take the piss because this guy is whinging , I am a forum nazi , but troll boy says the same thing and it it is ok.steve-o wrote:+1TITBAG wrote:yawn at predictable uptight moaning and even more predictable uptight holier-than-though forum nazis
amazing cognitive dissonance there
[x]killfilter
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leisuremuffin
- Posts: 4721
- Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2004 12:45 am
- Location: New Jersey
Angstrom wrote:so I take the piss because this guy is whinging , I am a forum nazi , but troll boy says the same thing and it it is ok.steve-o wrote:+1TITBAG wrote:yawn at predictable uptight moaning and even more predictable uptight holier-than-though forum nazis
amazing cognitive dissonance there
[x]killfilter
welcome to the ableton forum!
I feel you're pain, brah.
.lm.
TimeableFloat ???S?e?n?d?I?n?f?o
TR_606 wrote: That way everybody gets the same experience.
Everyone doesn't want the same experience. Live's a great platform. You can buy what you need, rather than having to buy everything and lay out a grand for it. If that were the entry-price for Live, I'd be using something else. That would price a lot of people out.
Ah, I see. Ableton has now forced you to pirate software. Has your version of Live 6 stopped working or something? Mine hasn't. I'm not sure that L7 has anything I can't live without, but the lowest-priced upgrade option keeps me up to date for future and it worth it for the enhancements in the core.TR_606 wrote: I will re-install a windows partition back onto my MBP, and use a cracked Live 7 - something i *really don't want to do after buying legit Live 5 & 6 for my Mac.