Upcoming Novation Remote SL changes

Timur · Post by **Timur** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:15 pm

Here is parts of a reply I got from Novation on my mail to their support. They replied in less than 24 hours and it's a very useful reply I'd say. The Novation mail contains information on upcoming changes with the Remote SL that also affects its use with Live, so I thought to post it here. Unfortunately I just noticed an attachment to that mail, so don't take anything for granted. Since I found nothing "top secret" in there I will still post it here.

This message and any attachments are confidential to the user of the e-mail address to which it was addressed. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the context of this message which arise as a result of Internet transmission. Any opinions contained in this message are those of the author and are not given or endorsed by Novation or office through which this message is sent unless otherwise clearly indicated in this message and the authority of the author to so bind the Novation entity referred to is duly verified.

First my original mail to them (its format is crippled somewhat):

Dear Support-Team, I like my Remote 37SL very much. It offers a great
keyboard and plenty of controls which I use in combination with Ableton Live. Unfortunately there are several problems which keep me from using the Remote to its full extend. By the way, your Technical Support page shows a dead-link to the Answerbase:
http://www.novationmusic.com/global/sup ... l_support/

-1-

I would like to see a simple addition to the Remote SL Firmware that would make possible to use the Tempo/Tab controls (BPM controls) via Rewire with template 40 instead of template 38. Actually I have found three different workaround to make that work, but all need an considerable amount of work while a very small change on your side could make it so easy. The problem with the Tempo/Tab controls is that while you can change the BPMPorts via Global settings you cannot change BPM-Channel. Because of that the BPM controls always use the ComnChan number of the template, which is 1 for template 40 but 16 for template 38. Since the Automap-Server needs BPM to be on channel 16 while Ableton Live needs controller data to be on channel 1 the easiest solution would be to: - add a global preference or Template preference to set BPMChannel instead of using the template's channel for BPM controls. - alternatively/additionally allow to Edit BPM Controls just like any other Midi control and thus allowing to change the channel of
the controls via Edit Both options would allow to use BPM Controls via channel 16 while using template 40 on channel 1.

-2-

When using the Volume faders with Live it it not possible to hit 0db, it's either +0.02db or -0.30db. I don't know if Live or the Remote SL is to blame for that, but it's very inconvinient.

-3-

I have experienced some considerable jet random Midi jitter when using the keyboard of the Remote SL. Strangely using the DUMP option of Ableton Live (to overwrite the Automap template) seems to cure this to some extend. Since it's so random I will have to take a closer look at it to find out if Live or the Remote SL is to blame.

-4-

When hitting the Remote SL at any place (like when using the Drum Pads) there is a springy sound coming from the unit (as if it had a spring-reverb build-in). The surface of the unit seems alot more stiff in the center than to the sides which makes that the Drum Pads on the left side give in a whole lot more than the ones to the center. This leaves me to fear that the unit might break fairly easily when using the Drum Pads even with only light to medium pressure. Should I return the unit to have it exchanged for another one? Thanks and regards

Hello Timur,

Thanks for the mail.

BMP ports and Rewire:
The new SL release will address the issues of rewired applications running with the SL. Swapping controls between applications will be easier, and we have changed the BPM ports so that the option is simply ON or OFF. The tap tempo button and tempo knob will work with all applications whether re-wired or not, and you will work the same way no matter what template is being used on the SL.

Live Volume Faders:

As far as I know, there is no way to change the resolution of the sliders so that you can hit 0dB exactly. Personally I would like to have the option be able to set 0dB as the highest fader point so that it is easier to set levels in a live situation. However, these changes would need to be implemented by Ableton rather than Novation as it is them who design the 'control surfaces' integration.

MIDI jitter:

We have been aware of certain MIDI timing problems and jitter. This is down to the SL re-draw updates on the LCD screens. We have addressed this issue in the coming release and any MIDI timing problems that you've had should be unnoticeable.

If you are using the DUMP function in Live to 'fix' this, then you are loading up the old version of the SL's live template, and the ports would have changed to Ua, therefore not connecting automap to Live anymore. You should re-install the SL to get the latest Live template back.

Spring Reverb(!):

I am unable to get this effect buy hitting my SL 61 or 37. Can you be more specific about where the sound is coming from. The only place where there are springs on the keyboard. Could it be the unit vibrating against your desk? Is it the grey plastic getting loose and vibrating against the black plastic? If you think that the unit is not 'normal' then are you able to compare it with another at your music dealer?

Let me know how you get on, and get back to me if you need more info,

best regards,

timothyallan · Post by **timothyallan** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:00 am

Too bad they still dont allow it to update via midi messages from the host like every other midi controller on the market.

Ohhh I'm so bitter about that.

Timur · Post by **Timur** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:04 am

Ah yes I forgot about that. I'll write it in my next mail to the resourceful support guy.

Tarekith · Post by **Tarekith** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:45 am

Timur - I have an Sl37 as well. I think the springy noise is from the Fatar keybed they use.

I briefly had a Virus Polar which uses the Fatar keys, and on the first one I got from Access, the keys would make a weird spring noise like you mentioned when I played them. I took it apart, and it looks like the rubber pads they use on the upstops for the key travel are pretty hard, and the keys 'vibrate' on these when they are released. Access sent me another Polar, and it was much better in this regard. So my guess is that Fatar's output is a bit hit or miss on this front, which is why maybe Novation is not seeing this. I'd guess that things like hitting the SL's drum pads are also causing this rattle/vibrate/spring sound.

Personally, I'm a pretty heavy handed player, so this bugged me too. A short term might be to add more grease to the rubber upstops (there's some there already) to help reduce the vibrating. Not sure if it's worth it for you to disassemble the SL to do this though. If you find something else out, please let us know though.

Timur · Post by **Timur** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:00 am

Tarekith wrote:Timur - I have an Sl37 as well. I think the springy noise is from the Fatar keybed they use.

Nope, I found the source to be the spring that connects to the negative pole in the empty battery compartment!

But thanks for the hint!

I still have issues with the build-quality though and will likely have my unit replaced with another SL unit hoping to get a better one. Here is what I wrote to Novation about it:

Still I wonder about the different resistance against pushing between the left side and the center. I can literally push in the leftmost drum-pad (until it's even with grey/silver surface) while the rightmost pad hardly gives in at all. Upto now I didn't use those pads too much because I'm just beginning to dig into a heap of new bought hard- and software. Now I did some test with those drumpads and found out that their sensitivity differs considerably. To demonstrate that I append a midi + audio-file that features me hitting those pads first soft and later hard. Even though I tried to maintain about the same pressure when hitting the pads you will easily notice that the outcome is vastly different with some of the pads even when repeatingly moving from one to another pad. The shop I bought the unit from is about 100km away, so I cannot check my unit against another at the moment, but I will contact them and have it replaced. Softhit threshold was set to 0 and full velocity to 127 for all pads.

Actually I don't really plan to use those pads for playing drum-sounds, they're simply not good enough and lack proper size and layout. But they can be very useful for triggering clips and samples and I plan on using velocity-zones to trigger more than one sample/clip by the same pad. For that I need a some consistent sensitivity.

Also the faders get more "scratchy" and stiff from center to right-side (the center, leftmost one is very easy to use, the rightmost one need considerably more force and sports a slight scratching sound).

Tarekith · Post by **Tarekith** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:14 am

Yeah, sounds like you got a dud, mine has neither of those issues.

Will someone please build a damn solid 37 key controller already? I was liquid filled pots, solid keys, and METAL CHASSIS. Getting kinda sick of budget this, and budget that. I'd happily pay more for a really solid controller!

I'd love to have something with 37 keys in a slim metal chassis, with 8 high quality endless rotaries. Man that would be lovely....

Timur · Post by **Timur** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:58 am

I do have 37 keys in a metal chassis with 3 high resolution endless knobs plus two faders. It's called Alesis Micron.

But the keys are not weighted at all, the semi-weighted keys of the Remote allow for more control when playing.

Tarekith · Post by **Tarekith** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:04 am

Yeah, I want GOOD keys, ala Virus TI 61-Keyboard.

Timur · Post by **Timur** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:10 am

You should try the ones on my Korg 01/W, they make that "click" sound everytime you press them. I just noticed yesterday that they are considerably smaller. Bit of a problem for my fingers, but on the other hand you can grab more octaves with one hand. Build like a tank the whole thing, but heavy (20kg or so). I'll have to take the Korg apart to exchange the battery, a good opportunity to clean the keyboard-mechanism, some keys are semi-stuck sometimes.

I'd happily pay more for a really solid controller!

Not that upto 500 Euros for a Remote 37SL are little to begin with...

Illum · Post by **Illum** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:10 am

Ha, that's funny.

I just tore my remote 49 open and hacked it all up (chopped the keybed down to 32 keys) with the intent to re house it in a steel enclosure.

check it:

Tarekith · Post by **Tarekith** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:41 am

Tearing apart gear is fun, let us know how it turns out!

Illum · Post by **Illum** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 4:54 am

I'll post up when it's done.

I had the same wants for a solid, simple, 37(ish) key controller with a nice keybed that didn't sound like a fucking echo chamber everytime I played a chord on it, but there's nothing out there like that (micron might be the closest, not sure how the keys are).

It's quite easy (and fun!) to mod pre-existing gear. The novation mods are a piece of cake too.

I have a CAD template for the remote series if anyone wants to have a top panel cut.
SL shouldn't be too hard either.

globalgoon · Post by **globalgoon** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:34 pm

ive got the remote zero. It'd be great to have the option for the faders to max at 0dB rather than +6dB(as it currently is) the usable area for the faders is tiny!

Timur · Post by **Timur** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:41 pm

Well, obviously that is an option that Ableton has to include into Live. And the fact that you cannot hit 0db at the moment also seems to be a bug in Live (or a matter of evenly distributing 127 midi values to the full fader path.

XL Foley · Post by **XL Foley** » Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:59 pm

I have an SL25 and the pads are really crap. I have the same sensitivity problems, I nearly need a jackhammer to get a velocity of 127 out of the leftmost pad whereas the others react "rather" ok. I've read that this is a common problem with the SLs...I also want to use the buttons as triggers for certain things, but I haven't found out how to trigger beat repeat with a button. They send only short impulses so you can at best toggle beat repeat on/off with them but I want it so that as long as I hold down the button, beat repeat is active until I release the button. Anyone able to do this already?

so long
XL Foley