Upcoming Novation Remote SL changes

[Timur]

XL Foley, go to Edit and change "BtnType" to "Momentry" that will give you exactly what you need (I just tried). For some reason in Live Minimum Value must be set to higher than 0 and Maximum Value must be set to 127 (or vice versa if you want to use the button the other way around). Usually Live default to 64/127 which should work fine.

[bagginz]

I have an SL25 and the pads are really crap. I have the same sensitivity problems, I nearly need a jackhammer to get a velocity of 127 out of the leftmost pad whereas the others react "rather" ok.

You guys do know the Novation Remote SL's have a calibration option per drum pad to adjust how hard you have to hit it to trigger notes?

It's in the global setup.

cheers,
bagginz

[Timur]

I do know, but since all pads were set to the same values they should behave the same.

[Timur]

For all those who don't know, "Automap" actually is nothing but a Sysex mode mixed with normal CCs, similiar to the Korg Padcontrol's "native" mode or the Roland FC-300's Sysex mode. Problem is that there exists no puplic documentation on the Midi implementation of the Remote. Manufacturers/Coders obviously get these infos, else Live couldn't offer Automap to Remote SL owners. Now it seems that Novations plans to make these informations public, which would allow anyone to program his Remote SL the way you need it.

>Where do I find a documentation about the SL's Midi implementation that
>describes which Sysex data to be sent (like memory adresses and stuff)
>to the SL to display Automap messages on it's LCD?

A SDK will be released shortly after the next SL update, it will contain information that will be useful to you. So please check back at www.novationmusic.com in the near future.

Because of this plus the promised bugfixes/improvements I am waiting eagerly for the next update.

[pat the dog]

hey fellas, i've not yet bought a remote sl... still hanging on to see what the update brings (and maybe even hold out for namm). but in the meantime i have a few questions that maybe someone can help with.

- i intend to use it both for controlling/editing live's devices and vst plugin synths so are there any "issues" when switching between the Live template and the VST/AU automap template? for instance, i'd imagine that the SL needs to "request" updated parameter values from the host after switching so that it can update it's display and for pick up mode to work?

- i assume that when i move a knob that's mapped to a VST/AU parameter, then the host is effectively bypassed and it's just like tweaking a knob directly in the VST's GUI? in that case can parameter tweaks still be recorded as automation data in live?

is there anything else i need to be aware of? i think i understand that i need to focus the device i want to control (live device or vst plugin window) in order for automap to work and i guess i can live with that. are there any other drawbacks i should know about?

thanks in advance!

[Timur]

- i intend to use it both for controlling/editing live's devices and vst plugin synths so are there any "issues" when switching between the Live template and the VST/AU automap template? for instance, i'd imagine that the SL needs to "request" updated parameter values from the host after switching so that it can update it's display and for pick up mode to work?

Live and the Automap Server application (runs in background if you want to control wrapped VSTs, but is not needed for controlling Live via its own template) send their refresh data on their own to the Remote. There is no issue with switching, but there is an issue with the Remote suffering Midi glitches whenever it receives data. That glitching only happens via USB though, so my workaround atm is to use USB only for Automap/control and the Midi connector for all real Midi data. According to the quoted update this will be adressed in an upcoming update (no date for that yet).

- i assume that when i move a knob that's mapped to a VST/AU parameter, then the host is effectively bypassed and it's just like tweaking a knob directly in the VST's GUI? in that case can parameter tweaks still be recorded as automation data in live?

There are actually two ways of controlling a VST, if you use the Live template and activate a VST by clicking on it in Live (or push the Remote's record arm button on a track twice to activate the first plugin of that track) then you can change its parameters right away without changing the template. This will send Midi data to Live (or whatever DAW you use) but when you record automations it will not record that Midi data, but you can record the plugin automation instead (i.e. a volume change). If you change the VST/AU via the Plugin template then the Remote will send Midi data via another Port to the Automap Server application, which in turn controls the VST/AU via Rewire. Again you should be able to record the plugin's automation, but not the Midi data.

is there anything else i need to be aware of? i think i understand that i need to focus the device i want to control (live device or vst plugin window) in order for automap to work and i guess i can live with that. are there any other drawbacks i should know about?

Actually its a drawback of Live that you have to mouseclick on a plugin in order to control it via Automap. But the record arm button is a good workaround. If you control VSTs/AUs via Automap Server then you can change the plugin you want to control directly via the Remote. That is you can scroll through a list via up/down arrows regardless wether the VST/AU is activated or has an open window or anything.

In both cases you can set it up so that the Remote will not track the currently activated/clicked plugin but stay on one even when you click through several others, can be handy in times. Most of the other drawbacks are connected to the quite complicate of how automap within Live works. There are some posts on the forum though that will describe things like how to use the non-endless knobs for the same value as the endless ones and how to customize knobs. Once I get my Remote back from repair I will try to setup a better workaround of making the faders max at 0db when using Automap (Live maps them to +6db max, but there are several workarounds, some better some worse).

[mrweasel]

you should be able to record the plugin's automation, but not the Midi data.

Could you explain this further please. It doesn't make much sense to me.

Thanks

[GUY SMILEY]

I have an SL25 and the pads are really crap. I have the same sensitivity problems, I nearly need a jackhammer to get a velocity of 127 out of the leftmost pad whereas the others react "rather" ok. I've read that this is a common problem with the SLs...I also want to use the buttons as triggers for certain things, but I haven't found out how to trigger beat repeat with a button. They send only short impulses so you can at best toggle beat repeat on/off with them but I want it so that as long as I hold down the button, beat repeat is active until I release the button. Anyone able to do this already?

so long
XL Foley

yep +1 those pads are utter bollocks. even the pads on the cheapest shittiest drum machines on the planet far outclass the shit ones on remote sl. Other than that I think its a pretty fucking amazing bit of kit though

[Timur]

you should be able to record the plugin's automation, but not the Midi data.

Could you explain this further please. It doesn't make much sense to me.

Thanks

You can record the automation data of the plugin in Arrangement View. So if you change some frequency or volume knob inside the plugin it can be recorded in Live as automation. That means the recorded clip will have an envelope of the volume change or frequency change. It doesn't matter if you changed that plugin knob via Midi, mouse or keyboard, only the actualy value of the knob/parameter is recorded.

That's different to recording Midi automation/CC of the knobs on the Remote. In this case you would record the Midi CC of the Remote's knob plus its value-changes regardless of what parameter is mapped to it. You could even change the mapping inside the plugin and have another parameter being controlled by the recorded Midi automation/CC.

[Timur]

you should be able to record the plugin's automation, but not the Midi data.

Could you explain this further please. It doesn't make much sense to me.

Thanks

You can record automation of a plugin in Arrangement View. So if you change some frequency or volume knob inside the plugin it can be recorded in Live as automation. That means the recorded clip will have an envelope of the volume change or frequency change. It doesn't matter if you changed that plugin knob via Midi, mouse or keyboard, only the actualy value of the knob/parameter is recorded.

That's different to recording Midi CC of the knobs on the Remote. In this case you would record the Midi CC of the Remote's knob plus its value-changes regardless of what parameter is mapped to it. You could even change the mapping inside the plugin and have another parameter being controlled by the recorded Midi CC. Problem is that you cannot record any Midi input in Live that is used for Remote Control as far as I remember. So when you use automapped knobs/buttons/faders on the Remote you will have to record automation instead of CC.

[Timur]

yep +1 those pads are utter bollocks. even the pads on the cheapest shittiest drum machines on the planet far outclass the shit ones on remote sl. Other than that I think its a pretty fucking amazing bit of kit though

You can still use them for launching some clips or effects though, that's better than not having them at all. Unfortunately they can only be used for hitting them, not pressing them like a key.

[GUY SMILEY]

yep +1 those pads are utter bollocks. even the pads on the cheapest shittiest drum machines on the planet far outclass the shit ones on remote sl. Other than that I think its a pretty fucking amazing bit of kit though

You can still use them for launching some clips or effects though, that's better than not having them at all. Unfortunately they can only be used for hitting them, not pressing them like a key.

Yeah point taken. unfgortunately on mine the right hand pad will not get above a velocity of 40 even with the sensitivity setting at maximum. and to be honest i have to hit the rest so hard to get a good velocity reading that every drum pattern ends up sounding like that monkey playing phil collins.

[Timur]

Are you aware that there are in fact two settings for Pad sensitivity? You need to lower the threshold (which default to 64 out of 127) in order to make the pads more sensitive. If you lower it to 0 the pads will react to even the slightest touch. Unfortunately on my unit the pads did not react uniformly (you need to use different force to reach the same value) so I send it in for repair. I had to neither any problem to reach full force (127) with any of them nor make them react very sensible (like 4 to 10).

[GUY SMILEY]

Are you aware that there are in fact two settings for Pad sensitivity? You need to lower the threshold (which default to 64 out of 127) in order to make the pads more sensitive. If you lower it to 0 the pads will react to even the slightest touch. Unfortunately on my unit the pads did not react uniformly (you need to use different force to reach the same value) so I send it in for repair. I had to neither any problem to reach full force (127) with any of them nor make them react very sensible (like 4 to 10).

hello timur,
thanks for pointing that out, i was aware though.. basically i've got the 'friday afternoon' model. it's just a shame that i didn't notice the pads were dodgy until a few months down the line. my rhb pad with a threshold of zero and a sensitivity of 127 stil won't hit above 40

[pat the dog]

thanks for the responses timur. exactly what i needed to hear. one more thing though - you mentioned that vst plugins can also be controlled via the live template. i assume in this case the mapping can't be customised?