The RIAA is at it again...

[andydes]

I don't like this idea that the only way musicians can make a living is by touring. Intellectual property stands for something. Those of you out there stealing all of your music and entertainment better hope and pray that the technology that you're raping the world with doesn't come back and eat your ass for breakfast in the next five to ten years.

Are you saying it's right that if I buy an album, I can't listen to it on an mp3 player unless I buy the download as well? That's what's being suggested here.

And frankly, if it's illegal to copy my albums to mp3 for my own use, I might as well just steal it in the first place. Right now, all my music is on original CDs. I will not pay for it again.

[forge]

Right now, all my music is on original CDs. I will not pay for it again.

there is a case in point - how many people out there have bought the same music on vinyl, cassette and CD, and now even MP3?

probably heaps - over time it just happens because you lose some or they get damaged then replace them in the new format

that is what the record industry wants us to do every time

[acroberts]

Right now, all my music is on original CDs. I will not pay for it again.

there is a case in point - how many people out there have bought the same music on vinyl, cassette and CD, and now even MP3?

probably heaps - over time it just happens because you lose some or they get damaged then replace them in the new format

that is what the record industry wants us to do every time

That's always been the headscratcher for me - the way I understand it, the argument is that we're paying for the 'right' to listen to the music or watch a movie, but not necessarily the distribution media itself, correct?

So if I've paid for my 'right' to listen to the music, it doesn't matter 'how' it gets to me, and, in fact, one could make the argument over beers that the recording industry 'owes' replacement copies of worn or faulty media to hold up to their end of the bargain, which was to provide that listening experience. No?

Further, if the quality of distribution increased over time (VHS to DVD to HD, for instance), shouldn't my rights to watch that movie extend to following and improved technologies?

I'd be happy to pay a pressing fee for my improved HD video to replace my DVD, but I think I've already paid royalties once to the studio and actors, so re-upping for those kinda pisses me off.

Too simplistic or am I simply re-iterating what's already been said?

-drew

[noisetonepause]

The RIAA don't give a fuck about music. They might not even know what it is.

They refer to it as 'content'. The CD, the plastic disc, is their product. Everything else is details to them. They just want to sell as many discs as they can. This involves reinventing the disc once in a while to sell all the old ones again. The music isn't a factor in their business model at all. It's just a footnote.

The RIAA has proven several times over that the business they run is a racket, and that they have no qualms about bullying innocent people into paying them large sums of money outside of the courts to prevent being sued - even when there isn't a case. They're big, rich and have all the lawyers.

They routinely resort to slander and libel, calling copyright violation 'stealing', knowing full well that if any lawyer tried to report a case of copyright violation as a transgression of criminal law, as an act of theft, like, say, stealing a car, they would be laughed out of court and maybe stripped of their right to practice.

This is all in addition to how they treat what they call 'content providers', ie. musicians, ie. the very foundation of their business - except in their flawed profit-centric view of what they do.

Look up Courtney Love's article in Salon from a few years back, it is absolutely insane that society has allowed these vampyric companies to exist for so long. Their existence is a rotten sore on the face of civilisation.

Basically, anything that denies them profit or hurts their business in any way is fair game as far as I'm concerned. That this may hurt some unfortunate musicians in the process, well, that is a shame. But it is ultimately a price worth paying.

[Sales Dude McBoob]

I don't like this idea that the only way musicians can make a living is by touring. Intellectual property stands for something. Those of you out there stealing all of your music and entertainment better hope and pray that the technology that you're raping the world with doesn't come back and eat your ass for breakfast in the next five to ten years.

Are you saying it's right that if I buy an album, I can't listen to it on an mp3 player unless I buy the download as well?

No. I think you should be allowed to make copies of stuff that you have bought. You should be allowed to (discretely) make compilations for friends. You should be allowed to make DJ mixes, etc. If you bought something on VHS tape, I don't think that entitles you to a free HD DVD or whatever version.

I just don't like this thinking that the only way to make a living as a musician is by playing live and touring. Musicians have always made money this way. Something has been taken away from musicians. I'm not a fan of the evil music coprorate conglomorates either.

I am a fan of physical media.

I too am one of those consenting adults, Forge. I love vinyl, and I buy a lot of new vinyl all the time. I love new releases on wax. And now that some record companies give you a certificate for free high quality downloads with your record makes it all the better.

I just have little patience for this narrow minded thinking that the only way for a musician to make money is by touring. I also don't like this noodle-brainery of thinking that in the future all music is going to be free. We're in a weird transition phase right now where we lack the laws and the technology to track what, how, and by whom intellectual property is being stolen. At the end of the day you're either an honest person or you're a crook.

[Noel]

Most musicians / bands are effectively giving thier music away for free anyway when you take into account how little they make from record sales. Only the megastars who can negotiate decent contracts make money that way. The main source of income is royalties from getting your music played on the radio. Touring is another source of income, but there again only major bands can get a decent slice of the ticket sales, most bands make more from t-shirts and other merchandise.

[forge]

Sales Dude - I dont think the ONLY way to make music will be touring - in fact personally I spend much mroe time at home than going out gigging so it would be better for me if I oculd make mega bucks from recording

but I also dont think you can stop free downloading and I dont think you should either

I am saying I still think there will be plenty of people who buy recorded music but I also think it is fair enough to check it out before knowing if they want to keep it

maybe it should work like shareware where you get "nag' messages

having said that, I buy off beatport based on their preview system

I dont think there will be no way to make money off recordings - I just think it will be proportionate to how it should be, not selling 1 million and having the record company keeping 99% of it, but selling 10,000 and keeping all of it (or 50% is you haev a small label)

or as popslut pointed out in another thread, he got the figures that 10,000 bought his album and 4 times that downloaded it - meaning 50, 000 people now own his record - that is amazing distribution and is likely to keep growing because of that - even if only 10% of those 50, 000 told someone else about it or played it to them, that is an extra 5000 that might buy it or go and see him when he's in town

I think as musicians we just have to take the example of people like radiohead and not take the example of greedy desperate bastards who use fascist tactics to try and force people to do things

[Machinate]

the stupid fucktards jus keep on hammering those nails into their own coffin

every time they do insanely stupid things like this it makes me feel happier and happier about the future of the music industry because the ONLY alternative for musicians with half a brain is to function completely outside of the RIAAs version of the music industry - and this is happening more and more

this makes the independent music industry stronger because less musicians are even getting involved in that corporate industry

this is actually good news for people like us who make music that isnt corporate crap

the music industry of the future will be one where people see "the big 4" and the RIAA as just some old fogeys who tried to milk old music past it's sell by date

I love you, Forge.

[benaline]

I just don't like this thinking that the only way to make a living as a musician is by playing live and touring. Musicians have always made money this way. Something has been taken away from musicians. I'm not a fan of the evil music coprorate conglomorates either.

I am a fan of physical media.

musicians have always made money this way?? 100 years is a long way from always! In fact historically, its completely the other way round, over the centuries of time you choose to ignore, musicians have mostly been payed for performing, some might say thats even where the skill and talent lies. Physical media was just a way for other people to make more money out of musicians, giving the musicians a tiny cut, and also controlling much of who succeeds and who doesn't......aka exploitation and corruption.

I don't own any physical media (well two cd's given to me as presents..copies!), nor do i produce any. Thats not where its at for me, If I wanted to make money out of products I'd have a factory and a shop, and I'd probably make mugs or wooden items. If people want to hear me play, they need to come and hear me play!

thats why I use live...

the future's soon, brace yourself!