gear whore and the synths of today

Sales Dude McBoob · Post by **Sales Dude McBoob** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:46 pm

morerecords wrote:nothing sounds like hardware, mixing them gives you twice the musical depth

+1

scientist · Post by **scientist** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:00 pm

monstrejumo wrote:do you know with what gear Mr oizo worked this fat huge bass?

i believe analog worms attack is all korg ms-20. other than that no idea.

i think one thing people miss out on with vsts is that synth are actually instruments just like a violin or a guitar...the knobs/sliders/keys/cases/sound of hardware make each one a unique instrument. its not as big a difference as say a real guitar vs playing a sampled one on a keyboard, but there is simply just something "real" about having a dedicated box that you enjoy playing. there are some v.a. hardware synths that are dirt cheap these days, comparable to the cost of a decent vsti...i've bought/sold or borrowed plenty of synths over the years and i'm finally settling down with a couple that i really enjoy playing...the sound and interface keep me interested, so i can easily dig deeper and get more out of them than i could out of soft synths. that said though, if a particular soft synth keeps your interest beyond flipping through the presets, stick with it and you'll be able to create some great sounds...the new reason synth is really versatile and sounds great, ya just gotta put some time into it.

downfader · Post by **downfader** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:08 pm

frahnque wrote:There's but one synth to end your gear mongering misery, The Buchla 200e:

http://www.buchla.com/200e/index.html

Buy it and you will have a happy smile on your face, and not to mention a black hole in your bank account (eventually it might suck the life out of you )!

Buchla looks great. Have you seen the Analogue Systems modular stuff..? Much cheaper to buy (well here in the uk) and just as powerful, possibly more so.

sxezskoz · Post by **sxezskoz** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:31 pm

monstrejumo wrote:sxezskoz,
do you have some links where I can download some tracks you made with minimonsta?

http://www.myspace.com/sxezskoz

Skywalk's bassline is a minimonsta. I played it live once all the way with the rest of the track playing, tweaking the filter as i played. After the track end, I went back and tweaked my midi steps (the end especially since I had one good series of stabs that I wanted to repeat throughout the outtro). After that, I froze it and kept it as audio prior to adding effects and beginning my final mix. One of the reasons I did that was because I like to work and tweak things as the song loops. Unfortunately, whenever I would tweak the automation of say another synth and I made a mistake, sometimes hitting undo would undo a piece of automation occurring in the minimonsta at the time (not sure why, perhaps it was interpreting my recorded tweaks as still incoming and thus overriding the Undo priority).

The other two tracks were done almost a year prior and hopefully it shows.

suburbanbather · Post by **suburbanbather** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:16 pm

scientist wrote:
monstrejumo wrote:do you know with what gear Mr oizo worked this fat huge bass?
i believe analog worms attack is all korg ms-20. other than that no idea.

i think one thing people miss out on with vsts is that synth are actually instruments just like a violin or a guitar...the knobs/sliders/keys/cases/sound of hardware make each one a unique instrument. its not as big a difference as say a real guitar vs playing a sampled one on a keyboard, but there is simply just something "real" about having a dedicated box that you enjoy playing. there are some v.a. hardware synths that are dirt cheap these days, comparable to the cost of a decent vsti...i've bought/sold or borrowed plenty of synths over the years and i'm finally settling down with a couple that i really enjoy playing...the sound and interface keep me interested, so i can easily dig deeper and get more out of them than i could out of soft synths. that said though, if a particular soft synth keeps your interest beyond flipping through the presets, stick with it and you'll be able to create some great sounds...the new reason synth is really versatile and sounds great, ya just gotta put some time into it.

Yep! an MS-20, drum machine, and a sampler. Oizo's album "Half a Mustache" is definitely mostly software. "Half a Mustache" is good but
"Analog Worms Attack" is in a league of its own on sound and composition. Screw presets, get a small modular synth with 3 or 4 vco's, 2 filters, 2 eg's, 2 vca's, sample and hold, noise source, and some utility modules like mixers and distributors.....oh and a midi to CV converter.

mr.e hurtz · Post by **mr.e hurtz** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 11:06 pm

suburbanbather wrote:
scientist wrote:
monstrejumo wrote:do you know with what gear Mr oizo worked this fat huge bass?
i believe analog worms attack is all korg ms-20. other than that no idea.

i think one thing people miss out on with vsts is that synth are actually instruments just like a violin or a guitar...the knobs/sliders/keys/cases/sound of hardware make each one a unique instrument. its not as big a difference as say a real guitar vs playing a sampled one on a keyboard, but there is simply just something "real" about having a dedicated box that you enjoy playing. there are some v.a. hardware synths that are dirt cheap these days, comparable to the cost of a decent vsti...i've bought/sold or borrowed plenty of synths over the years and i'm finally settling down with a couple that i really enjoy playing...the sound and interface keep me interested, so i can easily dig deeper and get more out of them than i could out of soft synths. that said though, if a particular soft synth keeps your interest beyond flipping through the presets, stick with it and you'll be able to create some great sounds...the new reason synth is really versatile and sounds great, ya just gotta put some time into it.
Yep! an MS-20, drum machine, and a sampler. Oizo's album "Half a Mustache" is definitely mostly software. "Half a Mustache" is good but
"Analog Worms Attack" is in a league of its own on sound and composition.

I totally agree.

dj superflat · Post by **dj superflat** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 11:46 pm

someone should post samples and ask for guesses on HW vs. SW. i think HW often gets the nod because it's recorded via a pre and/or other things in input chain that color sound (not denying that old analog synths sound great on own, but think SW's almost there). as others have noted, i also think much of this is that, for many of us, tweaking a sound on a HW synth just works waaaaaaaaay better than doing so in SW.

Johnisfaster · Post by **Johnisfaster** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:03 am

dj superflat wrote:someone should post samples and ask for guesses on HW vs. SW. i think HW often gets the nod because it's recorded via a pre and/or other things in input chain that color sound (not denying that old analog synths sound great on own, but think SW's almost there). as others have noted, i also think much of this is that, for many of us, tweaking a sound on a HW synth just works waaaaaaaaay better than doing so in SW.

I think alot of it comes down to aliasing. and various things programmers do to moderate cpu at very minute audio quality expense.

I don't know why but my nord lead is digital and it's filter sounds incredible to me. but almost all soft synths and soft filters I've used sound like trash to me. the best I've heard are fabfilters volcano and lives analog. but even those can't hold a candle to my nord lead IN MY OPINION. so I really think there is something deeper to this issue that hasn't really been talked about yet. and I don't think it's placebo.

any why is it that digital has never been able to create a filter that sounds as good as analog? if digital is so special then why can't they do that?

not trying to start a fight or anything I just think it's a strange issue that isn't really thought about enough cause most people love their softsynths too much to take the time to compare their sound side by side a quality instrument.

not saying all soft synths sound like crap... I'm sure someone will say that I said that though...

elemental · Post by **elemental** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:19 am

suburbanbather wrote:Screw presets, get a small modular synth with 3 or 4 vco's, 2 filters, 2 eg's, 2 vca's, sample and hold, noise source, and some utility modules like mixers and distributors.....oh and a midi to CV converter.

word

but be warned - modular synths suck your time and money!!
you will get unique sounds for sure.

I just forked out for an analogue solitions Oberkorn sequencer to add to my modular ! :-]

lesterdiamond · Post by **lesterdiamond** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:40 am

markaugust · Post by **markaugust** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:00 am

scientist wrote: i think one thing people miss out on with vsts is that synth are actually instruments just like a violin or a guitar...the knobs/sliders/keys/cases/sound of hardware make each one a unique instrument. its not as big a difference as say a real guitar vs playing a sampled one on a keyboard, but there is simply just something "real" about having a dedicated box that you enjoy playing. there are some v.a. hardware synths that are dirt cheap these days, comparable to the cost of a decent vsti...i've bought/sold or borrowed plenty of synths over the years and i'm finally settling down with a couple that i really enjoy playing...the sound and interface keep me interested, so i can easily dig deeper and get more out of them than i could out of soft synths. that said though, if a particular soft synth keeps your interest beyond flipping through the presets, stick with it and you'll be able to create some great sounds...the new reason synth is really versatile and sounds great, ya just gotta put some time into it.

word word word

its the workflow that makes it what it is... my machinedrum/monomachine/spectralis/evolver/sh101 i all love because of this and will never part from; they feel like good old friends who rammble beside me when im layin down my beats and sometimes ask to chip in..

there is a romance to being surrounded by hardware that isnt possible to explain in words.. I always explain it like that feeling you had a s a kid while you imagined being the captain of your own spaceship

spectralis boys
most beautifull sounding synth i ever had in my hands

the_viirus · Post by **the_viirus** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 7:08 am

the soundsource has a marginal importance. what is more important is what you do with the audio you get; whether it is an analogue or a softsynth...80% of the magic of music is WHAT YOU DO with the sounds you make.

Imagine Slowdive or My Bloody Valentine without delay or reverb.
Imagine not being able to doubletrack your vocals.
Imagine Cher without autotune.
Imagine Aphex Twin without his edit sprees.

supamonsta · Post by **supamonsta** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 11:15 am

hi all of you, very interesting topic.

I'm still thinking about selling my virus Ti (which I find not appropriate for me and could bring me a little money back), but this HW had the convenience to allow me to run multiple sounds in parallel, and I don't know what to get instead of it... analog stuff is often monophonic (or really really expensive

, and software vst need lots of cpu power...

what would you think about buying, say an ATC 1 X just for running some great basslines, and having, say, a NI Massive or U he Zebra or else to complement it...?

(got little budget, think about 1400$)

the ATC 1 X (quad) seems the most affordable and powerful synth for me (I'm really obsessively focusing on the FAT BASS ABILITY), the lack of controls is a bit annoying, but midi controllers do exist...

(I know some of you will say "don't sell the virus Ti", it's a good piece of gear that can indeed create great sounds", but I'm in bad terms with "her", I'm not happy when I see her, I find her too much over-complicated, not excited to touch her, and the sound of her voice tends to bring on my nerves... since two years ! better give up, no?

cheers

long life to hardware !!!

downfader · Post by **downfader** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:52 pm

Johnisfaster, I almost see what you mean about digital filters. TBH the ones I have been into have been for a particular sound (Z Plane on me Emu gear, and the Line 6 Filter Pro).

I do have the sherman, which is a monster of an analogue sound source for filtering!

If I'm being thoroughly honest I thing the digital filter manufacturers seem to be trying to cram too much into the box, instead they should be trying to concentrate on getting one or two basics, and get them GREAT, not good!

elemental, have you seen the AS Vostok suitcase module synth? Man were Analogue Solutions onto a winner with that one!

dj superflat · Post by **dj superflat** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 7:57 pm

there seem to be at least two kinds of sounding better: sounding better in a way that inspires you to play/write better stuff, and sounding better in a way that's meaningful to the audience. while every little bit of better sound helps (in terms of audience appreciation), i think the more meaningful part of sounding better for many musicians is the inspiration, whether you're talking a HW synth, or a great old amp, or whatever.

that's why i think HW wins for many -- sounds a little better, and is way easier to tweak (for many). actually, it was put better above -- just much more like a real instrument, rather than programming.