US soldier throws puppy off cliff.

jamester · Post by **jamester** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 4:57 am

Tone Deft wrote:
b0unce wrote:I think the whole "I support our troops but not the war!" bit is a classic example of modern day double-think.
so yeah... I accept that we need a military. I respect the people who join the military for the commitment (don't want to have dinner with them, but thanks for the service.) I do not feel that using them in Iraq is a justifiable use of their time and lives.

there's the people, there's how they're used. it's not double think because it's two separate ideas.

Exactly.

Personally I don't feel that we should even have to make a distincton on the troop's behalf; this is a modern tactic from the conservative side to try to make those who oppose the war appear as if they are somehow hateful towards the military personnel on the ground. It's ridiculous. They are doing they're job, it has nothing to do with them personally.

I use the phrase "I support our troops" in a tongue-in-cheek way (though in all seriousness) to mean "immediate withdrawl from Iraq", as this is the action that will save the most soldier's lives.

olio89 · Post by **olio89** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 4:57 am

hes married!!

she signed and agreed in gods name shed do it for life

Tone Deft · Post by **Tone Deft** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:02 am

b0unce wrote:
Tone Deft wrote:I've had this conversation with lots of people on both sides of the idea, you're the only one who didn't get it, that's cool, I accept that.
Just curious, the people you've talked to about this idea....how many weren't citizens of an imperialist nation ? or were members of an indigenous community that suffered from genocide and/or occupation ?

I'm guessing I might be the only one, probably just a coincidence, right ?

no foreigners I've talked to about politics has ever dropped this line on me, no. all the people I have had this dialog with were Americans. nope, still not getting it.

it's soooo easy to spout out whiny war is horrible stories, you guys are all just jerking each other off. expand the conversation. killing puppies is bad, war is bad, fascinating dialog.

if you have a clue about me, I'm not pro military, I'm not pro Iraq war or any war, we're ALL pretty much liberal leaning anti war peace loving musicians. I'm not going to be the sounding board for whiny ass war is horrible rants.

b0unce I think you're making the point like why the election is important to you, because it can affect you in a bad way. I don't think this is the same thing because armies are a necessary evil and blah blah blah all the other stuff I've written that's been ignored.

Tone Deft · Post by **Tone Deft** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:03 am

jamester wrote:I use the phrase "I support our troops" in a tongue-in-cheek way (though in all seriousness) to mean "immediate withdrawl from Iraq", as this is the action that will save the most soldier's lives.

I do the same thing.

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:04 am

jamester wrote:
Tone Deft wrote:
b0unce wrote:I think the whole "I support our troops but not the war!" bit is a classic example of modern day double-think.
so yeah... I accept that we need a military. I respect the people who join the military for the commitment (don't want to have dinner with them, but thanks for the service.) I do not feel that using them in Iraq is a justifiable use of their time and lives.

there's the people, there's how they're used. it's not double think because it's two separate ideas.
Exactly.

Personally I don't feel that we should even have to make a distincton on the troop's behalf; this is a modern tactic from the conservative side to try to make those who oppose the war appear as if they are somehow hateful towards the military personnel on the ground. It's ridiculous. They are doing they're job, it has nothing to do with them personally.

I use the phrase "I support our troops" in a tongue-in-cheek way (though in all seriousness) to mean "immediate withdrawl from Iraq", as this is the action that will save the most soldier's lives.

oh wow...so let me get this straight, the pro-war yahoo demographic suggest not supporting the war is not supporting the troops....and from that you form your opinion ? The one that allows you to support the troops fighting an illegal war. and assign blame to the momentary muppet. and you don't see how that system is flawed. because that's what the assholes want you to think. or something.

Kool, i just look at the facts and my opinion comes from that. Not some knee-jerk abstract reaction to another asshole's opinion

Tone Deft · Post by **Tone Deft** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:05 am

b0unce you're not listening. it's clear you have an agenda and won't stray from it. we're not stupid stop treating us like it.

c'mon man...

we can't have a dialog if only one side is listening.

if we keep this up it'll get shitty, let's not. I understand you're fired up and pissed off but we are not our president.

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:18 am

Tone Deft wrote:
b0unce wrote:
Tone Deft wrote:I've had this conversation with lots of people on both sides of the idea, you're the only one who didn't get it, that's cool, I accept that.
Just curious, the people you've talked to about this idea....how many weren't citizens of an imperialist nation ? or were members of an indigenous community that suffered from genocide and/or occupation ?

I'm guessing I might be the only one, probably just a coincidence, right ?
no foreigners I've talked to about politics has ever dropped this line on me, no. all the people I have had this dialog with were Americans. nope, still not getting it.

OK. first of all, what nationality were these foreigners ? America is not the only imperialist nation on this planet you know. Secondly, you seem to be straying. you said you talked to people specifically on this idea, and I'm the only one who doesn't get it. Now you're saying no foreigner ever came up with the same idea when discussing the broader term 'politics'...that's not the same thing. at all.

So which is it ?
you discussed this doublethink/support-the-troops-but-not-the-war thing with a bunch of 'foreigners' and I'm the only one who holds my opinion ?
or
I'm the only one who's brought it up, when talking politics ?

and then back to my question. out of the folks you discussed this idea with who 'get it' , how many were not citizens of an imperialist nation, or were members of a community that has endured genocide and/or occupation? I'd say 0, or 1 if you include me.

Tone Deft · Post by **Tone Deft** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:25 am

isn't it like 5:30am where you are? have you been doing any drugs?

I've already answered some of your questions.

I respect your ideas, I'll think about them, seriously, I will. let's not argue, in the big picture our views don't differ that much. I've learned new ideas from you and others but I don't want to argue. you're also completely blowing off anything I have to say.

I'll keep in mind what you've had to say but this is getting weird.

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:29 am

Tone Deft wrote:b0unce you're not listening. it's clear you have an agenda and won't stray from it.

Tone Deft wrote:isn't it like 5:30am where you are? have you been doing any drugs?

hehe, eat a dick Mr Red Herring.
if you can't stick to what's being discussed without employing such trite tactics ...well. who am I kidding. It's not like I need to prove you're an asshole.

Tarekith · Post by **Tarekith** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:52 am

There's times I wish I could throw this forum off a cliff....

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:56 am

Tarekith wrote:There's times I wish I could throw this forum off a cliff....

what time is it in Seattle ? Shouldn't you be doing something else ? You're on drugs. You've obviously got an agenda. Seeing as you're saying those things.

nathannn · Post by **nathannn** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 5:58 am

3 pages of this.. mostly post from people disgusted by the pussy in the video
thank God there is at least some humanity left in this sick world!

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 6:02 am

Honestly b0unces point here is indicative of the wishy washy BS the liberals in the US have swallowed. Support Our Troops, sure, in WWII maybe, but ever since then it's been a series of bullshit wars that are only about politics, nothing else.

Why try co-opting the rights language? it just makes you look weak. and backs you into a corner that you can't talk your way out of.

knotkranky · Post by **knotkranky** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 6:39 am

just an idiot, just a puppy.

jamester · Post by **jamester** » Thu Mar 06, 2008 6:59 am

b0unce wrote:
jamester wrote: Exactly.

Personally I don't feel that we should even have to make a distincton on the troop's behalf; this is a modern tactic from the conservative side to try to make those who oppose the war appear as if they are somehow hateful towards the military personnel on the ground. It's ridiculous. They are doing they're job, it has nothing to do with them personally.

I use the phrase "I support our troops" in a tongue-in-cheek way (though in all seriousness) to mean "immediate withdrawl from Iraq", as this is the action that will save the most soldier's lives.
oh wow...so let me get this straight, the pro-war yahoo demographic suggest not supporting the war is not supporting the troops....and from that you form your opinion ? The one that allows you to support the troops fighting an illegal war. and assign blame to the momentary muppet. and you don't see how that system is flawed. because that's what the assholes want you to think. or something.

Kool, i just look at the facts and my opinion comes from that. Not some knee-jerk abstract reaction to another asshole's opinion

I honestly do not understand the point you are trying to make here.

....and from that you form your opinion ? The one that allows you to support the troops fighting an illegal war. and assign blame to the momentary muppet. and you don't see how that system is flawed.

The "momentary muppet" is the one ultimately resposnsible for this illegal war. So yes, I assign blame to him. How is that flawed? The fact is that Ron Paul recieved more money from military donations than any other candidate, because he was the only one calling for immediate withdrawl. Most of the military is against this war and wants out.

I think you are misunderstanding what I was saying about the saying "I support the troops". I do support having a military for defense - should we not have a military? I do not support the decision to send them to Iraq for an illegal occupation.

No assholes make me think anything, I think for myself thank-you.