So far I am really dissapointed

sweetjesus · Post by **sweetjesus** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:23 pm

gjm wrote:If I use the Clips>Mallets>Bell Forge Riff2.alc clip all by itself the CPU monitor hoovers between 2%-3% when not playing and 14%-18% when playing this one clip alone. Is that not a big CPU hit by any standards?

see thats a bit of a misunderstanding, its a LiveClip yes, but its not an audio clip.

that clip is quite likely a live instrument of some kind which takes up all the resources of an instrument as it's not merely just playing back an audio file.

if it was a .wav or .mp3 clip causing that much cpu overhead it would be understanable.

Lo-Fi Massahkah · Post by **Lo-Fi Massahkah** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:24 pm

I get 10-11% on that clip. It's four Simplers (multimode) stacked with a chorus on just about every chain. I don't think that's too bad for what it is.

gjm · Post by **gjm** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:34 pm

sweetjesus wrote:
gjm wrote:If I use the Clips>Mallets>Bell Forge Riff2.alc clip all by itself the CPU monitor hoovers between 2%-3% when not playing and 14%-18% when playing this one clip alone. Is that not a big CPU hit by any standards?
see thats a bit of a misunderstanding, its a LiveClip yes, but its not an audio clip.

that clip is quite likely a live instrument of some kind which takes up all the resources of an instrument as it's not merely just playing back an audio file.

if it was a .wav or .mp3 clip causing that much cpu overhead it would be understanable.

Ok. Picture getting clearer now. So there are apples AND oranges.
Lo-Fi Massahkah wrote:

I get 10-11% on that clip. It's four Simplers (multimode) stacked with a chorus on just about every chain. I don't think that's too bad for what it is.

So there is quite a bit packed into that one example. So Lo-Fi, your 10-11% is on a multi core system?

Lo-Fi Massahkah · Post by **Lo-Fi Massahkah** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:41 pm

gjm wrote:So Lo-Fi, your 10-11% is on a multi core system?

Yup. Mac Mini Core 2 Duo, 2 ghz. 2.5 gig RAM.

gjm · Post by **gjm** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:46 pm

b0unce wrote:
gjm wrote:
b0unce wrote:(crank your audio buffer to the MAX when you're not doing liveish stuff)
Sorry b0unce, I am not quite sure what you mean. Is the MAX the biggest value or the smallest? And what would this be likley to affect in a positive way when using Live. Thanks. G.
MAX is the biggest, crank it right UP.
it gives you greater CPU overhead, but it costs you latency.
put it low when you are entering note data, like playing a beat on some drum pads or a melody on your keyboard, any kind of data-entry where timing/monitoring is important...
when that's done, crank it up again.
think of your audio buffer like gears on a bike, on any single journey you may need to change the gears a few times depending on what hills and valleys you come across.

Ok, so I cranked the samples to 4096 with 95.3ms latency in and out. I added the same 4 clips plus the Bell Forge Riff2 mentioned earlier and got a 61% max CPU hit in total when playing the scene. There was a marked difference in the audio play back quality. I was listening really hard and thought I heard a crack or two. It wasn't obvious in any case. However, the M-Audio device won't let me change the buffer size while I have Live open. The fast track thinks its still engaged somehow and so does not want to be adjusted. I have to exit Live, make the buffer change, open Live, load my set to see a difference. What a pain in the Ahole if I have to keep doing this.

Thanks b0unce for the tip

gjm · Post by **gjm** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:48 pm

Lo-Fi Massahkah wrote:
gjm wrote:So Lo-Fi, your 10-11% is on a multi core system?
Yup. Mac Mini Core 2 Duo, 2 ghz. 2.5 gig RAM.

So 14-18% on my system is actually ok then.

dcease · Post by **dcease** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:58 pm

you bastards narrowly escaped a major ass reaming. god dammit, i have had nothing but problems all day... thanks gjm, you passed your headache to me. but maybe if you figure it all, i can get live to quit shutting down mid song. oh, and if you hold a macbook by its' front corner, round bout the battery, it shuts off and beeps at you. and some times usb harddrives wount mount. fuck all. but my new beat sounds fucking terrific. i just can't fucking write lyrics to it right now. hrumph. [/rant]

have a nice saturday night. i am getting fucked up.

d.

Patch · Post by **Patch** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:22 pm

If you find Liveclips that you like, and are going to use, why not bounce 'em down to audio (ie - render them to disc) as use them as a regualr audio clip? This will save you TONs of system resouces...

Re: Dual boot. If you know how you should DEFINITELY do this. I have a dual boot (an Internet partition, and a muic partition). If you switch off all the extra crap you get on a clean install, follow all of the tweaks in musicxp.com, and lose all of the bells and whistles on your music partition you'll see a huge increase in performance.

gjm · Post by **gjm** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:30 pm

So the questions now come down to these:

1. Do I max out the RAM anyway, in the light of my single core 3.2GHz P4 XP sp2 system?

2. Do I need to consider upgrading from the M-Audio Fast Track? This is a legitimate bottleneck right?

3. This laptop is my only computor. I will often have open several programs at a time like MS Outlook, SKYPE, an Antivirus program with firewall all running while I working in Live. My CPU resources are being shared. Should I consider a dual boot set up? Would this maximize avaliable CPU resources for my current system?

I originally purchased Live for two reasons. The first was so I could create backing tracks for my guitar students to play along to while practicing chord structures and sequences, scales and lead work, and duets. Also backing tracks for my drum students.

The second reason was so I could make recordings of my own material, and maybe give the world some of the gjm flavour

if I get the courage up. I am not a DJ type and I have a fairly realistic undersanding of my abilities or lack thereof. I have little to no budget to work with.

Cheers. G.

gjm · Post by **gjm** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:35 pm

Patch wrote:If you find Liveclips that you like, and are going to use, why not bounce 'em down to audio (ie - render them to disc) as use them as a regualr audio clip? This will save you TONs of system resouces...

Re: Dual boot. If you know how you should DEFINITELY do this. I have a dual boot (an Internet partition, and a muic partition). If you switch off all the extra crap you get on a clean install, follow all of the tweaks in musicxp.com, and lose all of the bells and whistles on your music partition you'll see a huge increase in performance.

I actually have never done a dual boot, and know nobody personally who has. I was going to follow this http://www.homerecordingconnection.com/ ... ory&id=151 Any other better advice on how to do dual boot would be much appreciated. G.

doc holiday · Post by **doc holiday** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:21 am

just a heads up for you, live is very flexible, but resource hungry at the same time. I have an old and slow computer, you just need to learn to work around it if you like the advantages that live has to offer.

thecoloursound · Post by **thecoloursound** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:21 am

gjm wrote:
3. This laptop is my only computor. I will often have open several programs at a time like MS Outlook, SKYPE, an Antivirus program with firewall all running while I working in Live. My CPU resources are being shared. Should I consider a dual boot set up? Would this maximize avaliable CPU resources for my current system?

dude - not sure if you noticed, but i think you just answered your own question ... LIVE runs a very heavy load on your system. like you, i have one computer for everything. when i am running LIVE, i have to have my wireless card disabled, and all other programs OFF. i get pretty good performance with my system, but i am not running any other programs when i am working in LIVE. even then, my system performace can be a little imperfect or quirky (at times). i can't imagine what it would sound like with outlook and skype open. i hope this helps.

dcease · Post by **dcease** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:24 am

i take big loads in the toilet. it stinks.

gjm · Post by **gjm** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:29 am

dcease wrote: have a nice saturday night. i am getting fucked up.

d.

Fucked up where? Of course it will stink.

gjm · Post by **gjm** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:37 am

thecoloursound wrote:
gjm wrote:
3. This laptop is my only computor. I will often have open several programs at a time like MS Outlook, SKYPE, an Antivirus program with firewall all running while I working in Live. My CPU resources are being shared. Should I consider a dual boot set up? Would this maximize avaliable CPU resources for my current system?
dude - not sure if you noticed, but i think you just answered your own question ... LIVE runs a very heavy load on your system. like you, i have one computer for everything. when i am running LIVE, i have to have my wireless card disabled, and all other programs OFF. i get pretty good performance with my system, but i am not running any other programs when i am working in LIVE. even then, my system performace can be a little imperfect or quirky (at times). i can't imagine what it would sound like with outlook and skype open. i hope this helps.

Yeah, thanks man. Its kind of obvious eh. The other thing was thinking that the clips I was loading were not as big as they are. Also, I have not just tried a bunch of Audio tracks yet. There is still lots of room for me to now adjust things.

I am not so dissapointed anymore. Thanks everyone for helping me understand better what I have and what can be done.