Plane or Missile?

Discuss music production with Ableton Live.
peeddrroo
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Post by peeddrroo » Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:07 pm

@forge:
:lol:
but there's got to be 2 alien races: the ones that control W.bush, and the ones that work for ableton...
or maybe it just means that robert henke is soon going to make it to the white house...
sounds great!
gonna have a massive launch party for Live5!

Alex Reynolds
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Post by Alex Reynolds » Fri Sep 03, 2004 12:41 pm

claudek wrote:I think many others may find this interesting how the US Gov't can hide important facts from the American people.
what's factual in this?

several problems:

• scale of plane in key does not match the scale presented within the timelapse photo footage

• when you hear a missle fly, you are hearing its turbine jet engine, much as you would hear in a passenger aircraft; the cherry-picked comments are subjective at best -- would these folks be able to tell apart a missile jet engine and one in a commercial jet through a double-blind test?

• conspiracy sites always keep showing a 757 hitting the pentagon at a pitch, yaw and roll "normal" or perpendicular to the building face

on the last front, there is footage to show that the aircraft was at a very sharp, skewed angle to the building face. thus the damage would not be as wide as expected.

i'd believe conspiracy theories about ted olson wanting to get rid of his evil bitch of a wife through a fake AA flight 77 hijacking before giving this tinfoil fantasy any more of my time.

if you kids want something to worry about, worry about the police firing a sonic weapon at you and destroying your hearing next time you exercise your first amendment rights.

-a.

hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Fri Sep 03, 2004 3:06 pm

Aliens and politics...
Conspracy's and newsreports....
oil for blood...

I'm surprised nobody mentioned the freemasons. They shock the world while they're planning they're next evil "show".
Religion got replaced by jerry springer and the likes.
It's all a show. THEY (who-ever) distract us from the real issues.
Example. How can the american gov. plan a iraqi war without drawing to much attention?
Just let an intern suck the presidents dick.

cyclyk
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Post by cyclyk » Fri Sep 03, 2004 3:43 pm

Alex> do they use it finally?! It is scary... I received a mail last week about that weapon, I can't believe it...

Komplex
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Post by Komplex » Sat Sep 04, 2004 4:13 am

forge wrote: And you have to admit, Ableton is very alieny. Look at some of the pictures http://www.ableton.com/index.php?main=people

Torsten Slama is a Wookie and Robert Henke is really a bunch of grapes and Stephan Franke is the chameleon who best blends in in Art Galleries.
I didn't expect to laugh as hard as I did when I opened this thread again :lol:

A DJ - It was only a joke, check pm's :)

claudek
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Post by claudek » Sat Sep 04, 2004 9:24 am

After the planes crashed into the World Trade Center,
where was any left over debris of the 2 planes over NYC?? This "film" here is trying to say there was no plane and not leftover traces in the vicinity
..I have to wonder though after the WTC crashes there was not be much found as well.(planes_
Just a thought..I still kinda suspect a missile though, just by the impact and the damage . If it was, the Gov't will never admit it .
I even still wonder about some of these planes that went down /crashed off NYC a few years back as well..
They still have suspition is was a heat guided missile training that hit one.
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hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Sat Sep 04, 2004 9:57 am

one of the most important question i found on that subject was: why did the towers collapse the way they did? like a controlled demolition. Not tilting over. ever chopped down a tree?

Martyn
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Post by Martyn » Sat Sep 04, 2004 10:40 am

Good thread! Personally, I love to hear other peoples opinions and discoveries on this forum because everyone here has at least one thing in common (music), discussions like this are very relevant here. If you're not interested you don't have to read. You can go and actually READ the manual to find out how to use Ableton Live, it's actually the very best way to find out what the pretty coloured buttons do.

This is the only forum I bother to use, there are some people with true conviction who hang out here. It's heartening to see others who actually care, apathy is the true enemy.

Oh, and Forge, next time you're going to post anything like that can you pm and warn me so I don't spit my tea on my keyboard :lol:

A DJ
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Post by A DJ » Sat Sep 04, 2004 12:30 pm

claudek wrote:After the planes crashed into the World Trade Center,
where was any left over debris of the 2 planes over NYC?? This "film" here is trying to say there was no plane and not leftover traces in the vicinity
..I have to wonder though after the WTC crashes there was not be much found as well.(planes_
Just a thought..I still kinda suspect a missile though, just by the impact and the damage . If it was, the Gov't will never admit it .
I even still wonder about some of these planes that went down /crashed off NYC a few years back as well..
They still have suspition is was a heat guided missile training that hit one.
claudek

there is a documentary where u can say strange things with the two planes that go into the towers.

there is a flash right before the two planes go in the building.

on the first plane it is very clear to see.

and on the second plane u can see something is onder the plane.

what it is is not clear

could this be a bomb or some fuel pod to do extra damage, maybe thats why the damage was so great.

also it is not possible that this plane came from a commercial airport.

people would have noticed this ....the working crew or the passsengers.

the witnesses that day that where there also stated several times that this was no ordinary plane.

i have seen these movies

if ya interested about them pm me.

i am on holiday for two weeks as of tomorrow.

forge
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Post by forge » Sun Sep 05, 2004 8:35 pm

Martyn wrote: Oh, and Forge, next time you're going to post anything like that can you pm and warn me so I don't spit my tea on my keyboard :lol:
I recommend having spare keyboards available at all times for this very reason!

Especially when you are partial to Beer.

claudek
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Post by claudek » Sun Sep 05, 2004 11:27 pm

I cannot believe 9/11 was any way an act in coordination with The US gov't..I just have some weird feeling the penatagon was hit my US miltitary and really covered up. Some French author wrote some book saying something like 911 was an act done by the US Gov't ..Thant is a load of crap if I could ever think of one..Maybe good for selling books but makes lil sense.. If the US gov't was to do something slick it would be something to not waste that much $ as that si what fuels the country and what Americans think most about.
C$st the Govt and economy too much $..Really messed up the economy allot..
Last edited by claudek on Mon Sep 06, 2004 8:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Martyn
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Post by Martyn » Mon Sep 06, 2004 12:20 am

There's some interesting stuff on this site http://www.freedomfiles.org
and a LOT of audio files, either stream or mp3 on this section http://www.freedomfiles.org/movies/

Quite a bit relating to 911 etc

Lucid
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Post by Lucid » Mon Sep 06, 2004 10:29 am

hoffman2k wrote:one of the most important question i found on that subject was: why did the towers collapse the way they did? like a controlled demolition. Not tilting over. ever chopped down a tree?
Supposedly it was not the structural damage caused by the impacts that caused the towers to fall, it was the eventual cascading catastrophic failure of support beams that were gradually melted by burning jet fuel. More like an avalanche than chopping a tree down, a critical point of gravity vs. suspension reached where the buildings basically imploded.

From all the videos, it sure looked like two passenger jets that hit the WTC towers, as for the Pentagon, I have no idea.

While I personally don't know what to believe, as crucial evidence has been withheld by the Bush Administration for unknown reasons, possible motives for the U.S. government or a more subtle, less visible global organization to stage such an attack would be to provide a justification for the unilateral use of military force by the US Gov't and an overall consolidation of power vis a vis the shameless public promotion of terror hysteria and providing a rationale for top-down, constitutionally questionable legislation such as the infamous Patriot Act, which has greatly broadened the powers of U.S. "law enforcement" to electronically snoop on basically via a variety of backdoors available in many communications networks, including cellular communications and the internet. These would be the more directly obvious, short-term implications, however, if there truly was a conspiracy, I believe that the motives must be more complex and far-reaching than simply going to war with Iraq.

An interesting global power group is the Bilderbergs. Google them for info.

hoffman2k
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Post by hoffman2k » Mon Sep 06, 2004 10:58 am

Lucid wrote:

An interesting global power group is the Bilderbergs. Google them for info.
Yeah. the bilderberg group, illuminati, freemasons, the skulls, The carlyle group,.........
Enough groups for the elite to find somebody to hook up with. Some people would think it's BS or your a conspiracy nut talking about stuff like this. Those are the same people who watched to many movies about this subject.
what you see on tv can't be real and the news is always correct. yeah right.

Compare american news with any other. Americans are pumped full of fear and BS. Did they ever catch that black guy in his mid twenty's that appears on every newschannel as a suspect? Or do they just lock up as many as they can?

Now they have a microphone that can talk inside your brain? Coca Cola uses them too.

There's alot of shit going on. And it's all about control of the crowds and the money.

forge
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Post by forge » Mon Sep 06, 2004 11:30 am

there was a Program on in the UK called 'American Colossus' which was on again about 3am this morning and I ended up watching it - it was all about the american empire comparing it to all the others - highlighting the differences - calling it the new Rome but showing where it was different to the old one.

one of the comments it made was that the thing that most notably changed the face of the world was the collapse of the soviet union because it was the last other great empire keeping the peace by posing as a deterrent. Once it collapsed the US could effectively do what it liked.

Add to this an increasingly ineffective UN through the 90s (which in itself with it's 5 permenant members is nowhere near the fair mediator it should be as, in the modern world having US, UK, Russia France and China having the final say over everyone else just doesn't make any sense - so it was only a matter of time before it's ineffectiveness came to a head.


The really amazing thing it pointed out, as crazy as it sounds nowdays is that if Truman had listened to McCarthy instead of the Electorate and had made it clear to the Chinese in the Korean war that they would have been prepared to use Nukes on chinese cities to win the war (at that time China had no nukes) then they would have won the cold war then and there and there may never have been any further Communist advancement in south East Asia - no vietnam war, and a wider long term peace in the region.

Basically it said the biggest flaw the American Empire has is it's political system because as we are seeing now, they are always on such a limited time scale. Elections come up and get in the way of doing the job properly (and properly rebuilding Iraq for a perfect example.) Bush has 'handed over' Iraq while it's in chaos because on the American Public are more interested in domestic affairs than foreign affairs. The Vietnam and Korean wars both could have been won - the declining British had proven it was possible a few years earlier and won a similiar guerilla style one in malaya because they went for all out victory, but the American policy of 'limited' war, and being kind of scared of it's own empire status meant the Presidents under-committed and failed to send enough troops - there was a point in the vietnam war where the general in charge was asking for an extra 200,000 troops and had he had them they could have won, but Nixon actually started cutting them because it was so unpopular at home. Ironic really - I would have been one of those protesters had I been around, but arguably it was that division in the long run which probably cost alot more lives because it meant they were half arsed, trying only to deter the communists rather than actually win. Ironically they realised afterwards that SE Asia was no where near as strategiacally important as they thought anyway and it was actually the Mid East they needed to get invloved in.

The US produces 8% of the worlds oil and consumes 40% - so they are having to pay for this by borrowing heavily.

And other problems are the facts that, unlike previous empires, the American people (including soldiers) are happy at home and have no desire to leave, so since West Germany and Japan they haven't established any real colonies, but they are consuming more than is economically sustainable at home, and to compound it it's actually the retirement of the baby boomers all drawing on their pensions and health care which is the most serious problem threatening to completely undermine their economy because the burden by 2010 will have doubled, while new tax payers contributions are barely adequate to coming close to paying for it, and most presidents wont raise taxes because it will almost certainly mean defeat, so the only way to keep up the lifestyle now taken for granted is to borrow heavily.

The conclusion was that the US empire is already well in decline, and the program made it look pretty much inevitable that the world is heading for a huge economic crash.

One thing's for sure - the world in 20 years from now will be completely unrecognisable.

Opened my eyes wider anyway.

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