MBP owners - how shit is your onboard soundcard?

leedsquietman · Post by **leedsquietman** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 3:50 am

If you want to do any serious audio work, you would get a proper audio inteface with good pres and several IO options etc anyway. Onboard cards are good enough for playing back mp3 and gaming and that's about it, Apple's are no exception.

dazzer · Post by **dazzer** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 4:16 am

@ Andy - Yea, I know, I was joking to cheer myself up.

@ leeds - as I said in 1st post I use an Ultralite, which is great and works well. The pisser is that I could never use the onboard for doing stuff on train, in a bar etc. My old and now sadly defunct Powerbook had a great onboard, 4 years later the story is different. Does it matter ? I think it matters if you pay that much money. Problem is, I have no idea what would be a good alternative to a MBP for me.

taikowaza · Post by **taikowaza** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 9:14 am

well this is a coincidence, I just spent the morning talking with applecare about this same issue. I discovered it yesterday after spending some time with my headphones on with no music running. Brand new Macbook Pro Penryn 2.5, saved for a LONG time for this one to replace a powerbook 12" which had no issues with headphone audio.
The original poster is completely correct, the r2d2 noises and background noise floor are completely unacceptable. those who cannot hear it have upper frequency hearing loss or do not have trained ears, it is in every intel mac on the headphone output. There is a power saving codec which cuts out the noise between 10-20 seconds after the last sound event, and then there is silence. When audio begins again, the background hum and noise restarts, and blips and bleeps show the lack of isolation from the CPU and system artifacts. I am critically disappointed in this amazingly callous oversight from apple, this is an issue that has been plaguing the macbook pro community for over a year. This morning I was told by an applecare representative that 'serious audio' requires an interface anyway, and that the headphone output is just for 'casual' listening. I was truly disheartened to hear this, I have my headphones on all day and I did not spend almost $3000 for 'casual' listening, I spent this money for a professional and high-quality listening audiophile experience. There is no fix for this issue, it is not software but rather a hardware issue that is a known issue. The general approach of apple to this is to make us doubt our own ears, by recommending that we visit a genius bar, where the geniuses will try to listen and then will say "I don't hear anything, you must be dreaming". Don't waste your time trying to convince apple reps of the poor audio quality. There are recordings online of the artifacts which you can easily find through a quick google search of 'macbook pro r2d2 artifacts' or another similar search.
I only found out about all this yesterday and have been reading everything I could find online about it today because I was so incredulous about the whole thing, I simply could not believe it, at first I thought I had a defective unit. However, many individuals have returned their computers and been without them for weeks while the logic boards, audio chips and even whole systems have been replaced, only to get a machine with the identical problem. Can you imagine how they must have felt? So, the solution is to get an attenuator from radio shack. how stupid is this, to have to lose audio resolution and headroom by putting a macbook pro through a radio shack volume control. Apple is getting bigger and more popular and they are cutting corners. Most people will never even hear this audio issue but for those of us who really appreciate sound and quality we simply can't miss it- it's plain as day.

8O · Post by 8O » Thu Apr 03, 2008 9:18 am

My MBP on-board soundcard was fine for iTunes, streaming audio and very light Live use. No major sound quality issues. Until I installed the Airport Extreme Update last week - now it's fecked.

8O · Post by 8O » Thu Apr 03, 2008 9:32 am

taikowaza wrote:...The original poster is completely correct, the r2d2 noises and background noise floor are completely unacceptable. those who cannot hear it have upper frequency hearing loss or do not have trained ears, it is in every intel mac on the headphone output...

Understood, but you should try a Dell laptop in comparison - that's truly unlistenable. R2D2 in the mix for every song! Compared to the Dell, my MBP is high-end hi-fi

Still, your post adds to the steady downwards spiral in Apple product quality - it's a real shame...

keithwired · Post by **keithwired** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 10:49 pm

I'm running on a dell d520 with a core 2 duo t5600, 2 gigs of ram and on-board audio which happens to be a sigmatel high-definition audio card. In ableton I get 11ms latency input and output so total latency 22ms, no popping whirring or r2d2 sounds at all and I produce using over the ear $160 noise cancelling headphones and play at pretty large venues using the headphone out on occassion. Must be the new MBPs

hambone1 · Post by **hambone1** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 10:56 pm

Vercengetorex wrote:No hum, hiss, blips or bleeps on my MBP Santa Rosa 2.2

+1.

Tarekith · Post by **Tarekith** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 11:49 pm

Very rarely I can hear my external HD spin up from my headphone jack, but that's it. Otherwise my MBP headphone jack works fine, I've even used i for playing last minute house parties and working on tunes while out and about.

But yeah, for anything serious in terms of music production, you're just delusional to think that the build in headphoen jack on ANY laptop is up to par. I'd have to agree with

, my MBP is much better than any other laptop I;ve used on this front, no complaints.

muthafunka · Post by **muthafunka** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:47 am

Yep, got it here on MBP 2.4. I do a lot of transcription work, dropping material from vhs to quicktime then transcribing (spoken material) from there so I'm hitting play/stop frequently at relatively short intervals and listening to the so-called 'silence' in headphones....boy do I know those squeeks and bleeps well by now. As far as the 'it's just the built-in audio, what do you expect?' idea goes, pfft, it's a pricey machine and no previous machine has ever done this, it's a positive, noticeable annoyance. From Apple's MBP features page:

"MacBook Pro sounds as good as it looks, with unprecedented attention to audio detail. For musicians on the go, MacBook Pro offers pristine sound through crisp, clear stereo speakers, a built-in microphone, and optical digital audio on both input and output."

The sound coming from the output during play certainly isn't too bad at all but close listening between plays is quite noisy and aggravating.

Tarekith · Post by **Tarekith** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 2:59 am

"MacBook Pro offers pristine sound through crisp, clear stereo speakers, a built-in microphone, and optical digital audio on both input and output."

Notice the words headphone jack are not mentioned at all. And anyone who refers to audio thorugh a tiny 1" speaker as 'pristine' is already someone you shouldn't trust

taikowaza · Post by **taikowaza** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 3:02 am

you hit the nail on the head. While music is playing there's no issue, but it's the silences that really start hurting. With my Powerbook I could have the headphones on all day with no problem. Today I had to take the headphones off because the artifacts were so bad. I spend several hours researching external audio interfaces and bought the gold-plated radio shack "Volume Control Headphone Extension Cord" unit part number 42-2559. It works like a charm, it is a solution for this issue. I admit that it is pathetic that this is required on a macbook pro, but it completely solved the artifact/noise floor problem for the price of $7.99. (seven dollars ninety nine cents).

I will probably get an ultralite but this is a good fix in the meantime.

dazzer · Post by **dazzer** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 6:29 am

Update:

Shop said it was fine, just my imagination. Then I moved it to a quieter room and they agreed there was "background noise". Then I showed them the links on the Apple forums to people with the same issue. So then they said that as it was a problem on all MBP and not just mine, they wouldn't do anything.

Two hours (!) on the phone with Apple and then Apple talking to the shop results in a refund. I took the refund ;cos at that point I was fuming after around 3 hours spent in the shop. Not even sure if I made the right decision as a - everything else about the MBP was hunky dory and b-what the fuck am I gonna get instead? I know what TITHEAD would suggest but I've got no idea about Windows. Mac Pros too expensive, iMac and Macbook haven't got TI firewire chipsets.

And meanwhile, I'm typing this in a cafe cos my Powerbook is dead, the reason for attempting to upgrade in the first place.

Oh woe is me. Maybe I should learn to play guitar and start reading books again.

Fuck Apple.

mkelly · Post by **mkelly** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 8:28 am

dazzer wrote:The pisser is that I could never use the onboard for doing stuff on train, in a bar etc.

Would you really expect to be doing high quality audio work in a bar or on a train? IMO the headphone out (noises included) is fine for casual use - I can dial up sounds and get rough work done while I'm "on the go", and fine tune it when I get back home.

pixelmechanic · Post by **pixelmechanic** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 9:44 am

+1 for R2D2 on tail end of files

I don't think anybody has mentioned the increase in noise out the socket when you connect an external display... for me that's also a major PITA

dazzer · Post by **dazzer** » Fri Apr 04, 2008 12:10 pm

mkelly wrote:
dazzer wrote:The pisser is that I could never use the onboard for doing stuff on train, in a bar etc.
Would you really expect to be doing high quality audio work in a bar or on a train? IMO the headphone out (noises included) is fine for casual use - I can dial up sounds and get rough work done while I'm "on the go", and fine tune it when I get back home.

Thing is, mine sounded terrible IMO, really off putting. I don't expect it to be as good as my Ultalite but I expect it to be ass good as my old iPod shuffle, y'know?

Anyway, gonna give it a break for a few days then get something I suppose, cheesed off with computers.

MBP owners - how shit is your onboard soundcard?

headphone out on macbook pro

Re: headphone out on macbook pro

well said muthafunka