Panning stereo master on the mixer

Wallace · Post by **Wallace** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:34 pm

Hi,

usually I pan the stereo channel of my output on the mixer: left out panned to left speaker and right out panned to right speaker.
In my opinion, this configuration take advantage of stereo enanchement of my mixing work.

Btw, if I not pan the single output (that is, two mono channels on both speakers), the bass is more "present" (obviously I turn down the volume...).

What is better? Are there situations when is better to pan and others when is better not to pan ?

thank you

ChiDJ · Post by **ChiDJ** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:48 pm

Never pan your master.

Wallace · Post by **Wallace** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:29 pm

ChiDJ: ok, but can you give some explanations ? What I loose, what I gain - so, are stereo effects ineffective ?

thank you

ChiDJ · Post by **ChiDJ** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:34 pm

Think of your master channel as the size of your "canvas".

Panning (even a little) makes your canvas smaller.

This is why your bass sounds better without spreading your pan knobs. (in most music the bass and the kick should be right down the middle). When you try to spread or widen your mix, you cut a whole right down the middle and you lose the kick and bass.

get it?

laird · Post by **laird** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:35 pm

You can lose your bass if you pan them both center (i.e summing them).
Or you can cause clipping.
or you can cause both! FUN FOR NO ONE!!

if you want louder bass, then turn up the bass channel. Sounds simple, I know. but true.

laird · Post by **laird** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:39 pm

Here's an example:
Red is left, Blue is Right.

When combined (such as by panning everything center), you might get a louder signal if your bass is in phase, or you might get a silent signal if your bass is out of phase with itself (Green).

So, sometimes you'll get lucky and get a louder green signal. Sometimes you will be unlucky and get no green signal. And sometimes you will be unlucky and get a louder green signal that is so loud it distorts.

Which is why its safer to just turn up the bass when you want more bass

Wallace · Post by **Wallace** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:23 pm

thank you for your answer ChiDJ and laird, very exhaustive

But what about stereo effects ? Do I lose them ?

laird · Post by **laird** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:33 pm

Drop a Utility plug on your master channel and set width = 0%
then hear for yourself whether you "lose" a "stereo" effect or not.

I put those in quotes becuase those words have multiple meanings, making your question vague.

johnathon doe · Post by **johnathon doe** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:14 pm

Funny,

I've been working on recording my djs sets recently and I've had a similar question...

I've got 2 xlr 3-pole (R and L) coming out of the mixer into my soundcards 2 xlr ports.

Do I tell the soundcard to pan each single to it's corresponding side?
Or leave centred?
Then, in Live I make one channel pulling audio from 1/2...

??

Thanks

laird · Post by **laird** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:19 pm

create a track, arm it, hit record.

That's it.

if you really want to overthink it, you could create two mono tracks, select track 1's input to "input left" and track 2's input to "input right", assuming you have enabled the seperate inputs under audio/preferences. Then arm both tracks, assuming you don't have elclusive record enabled under preferences, otherwise you have to Cntrl-select the second record button, then hit play, record your audio, then move the pan knob onTrack 1 to 100L, and the pan knob on track 2 to 100R. Otherwise, both would be panned center, and this will sound weird (it'll sound like mono, first of all, and may give you weird phase artefacts). This is how people created "stereo" tracks back in the days of mixing consoles and multi-track tape.

laird · Post by **laird** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:27 pm

Also, here's a though experiment.

Do exactly what I just suggested... two Mono tracks... and record a good song to them.

1. now pan them both left.
2. now pan them both right.
3. now pan them left/right
4. now pan them both center.

Listen.

now, do the same thing BUT with 1 stereo track instead.
1A. pan it left.
2A. pan it right.
3A. pan it center

And Listen again.

Example 1 will NOT sound exactly like 1A.
Example 2 will NOT sound exactly like 2A.
Example 3 will sound exactly like 3A.
Example 4 will NOT sound exactly like example 3 or 3A.

unless you picked a song from a 78rpm record or something.

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 10:04 pm

laird wrote:Also, here's a though experiment.

Do exactly what I just suggested... two Mono tracks... and record a good song to them....

now, do the same thing BUT with 1 stereo track instead.

but that would be mainly because "panning" on a mono track is "panning", while "panning" on a stereo track is "balance".

I have complained about this mistake before, but apparently Ableton insists on calling a balance knob a panning knob.... I guess they've never seen an analogue mixer before...

johnathon doe · Post by **johnathon doe** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:50 pm

I'm not completely new to recording mixes,
but I've have had phasing problems, no bass etc.

So.

1. I have the L xlr panned hard L
R xlr panned hard R (setup in MOTU cuemix)

2. I then create a 'stereo' 1/2 mix ONE CHANNEL in ableton live.

Is this correct. I don't want to do tests if there is a correct yes or no answer. Phasing I understand.

Thanks for your time and consideration.
(I hope the OP does not feel I have hijacked thread, if so please let me know and I'll repost this enquiry)

peace

Panning stereo master on the mixer

Panning stereo master on the mixer

MIXING XLRS

simplify matters.