Not to sound stupid, but really...studio monitors?

dn83 · Post by **dn83** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:02 pm

What's the point of using studio monitors when most of them have a smaller frequency response range than most decent computer/multimedia speaker systems and when the average potential listener isn't going to be listening to your mix on studio monitors themselves?

I know that studio monitors are supposed to have a 'flat frequency response', meaning that they don't favor any certain frequencies (?), but are they really that much different from a nice ~$100 set of computer speakers with a subwoofer?

How much should a person really be concerned with? Do I also need monitor isolation pads? Do I need to have my room completely padded? Do I need to have an acoustic assessment? Do I need a psychological assessment for Obsessive Compulsive Disorder? (All the while my money is dwindling.)

roby · Post by **roby** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:05 pm

personally i do not base my mixing to what comes out of the monitors. i've been using the same pair of headphones for over 10 years and i know what to do and no to do with them. but i have decent monitors because, when i do send audio through them, i want to it to sound good, unmasked or colored by anything. it's not fun listening to your recorded music through cheap Roland/Boss speakers...

laird · Post by **laird** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:27 pm

dn83 wrote:What's the point of using studio monitors when most of them have a smaller frequency response range than most decent computer/multimedia speaker systems

where the heck did you get that info?

there is no industry standard for measuring "frequency response range", so when multimedia speaker companies advertise that they are better than studio monitors, that's because they are advertising to people who have no idea what that means or how its measured. hell, I'll show you a perfectly flat frequency response, I'll measure my Monitors (and only measure at two frequency points).

As for the importance of a flat frequency response, yes it makes a huge difference. if you've ever mixed a song with consumer speakers and then tried listening to it on other people's stereo systems, it should become pretty obvious.

if you can't hear the difference between monitors and multimedia speakers, though, then there is no reason for you to buy them... I say this in complete ernestness.

dn83 · Post by **dn83** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:36 pm

I've never used studio monitors as of yet.

Moody · Post by **Moody** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:40 pm

To set a baseline to work with. Most people who are mixing down music or mastering understand that the music will be played on many different systems but for them to get everything right they need an environment that they know well. For most people this comes in the form of a good monitor in a good acoustic environment.

dn83 · Post by **dn83** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:42 pm

Cheers.

laird · Post by **laird** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:53 pm

You can get away without using them for awhile, most likely.

To help counteract the problems that will occur by mixing in a less-than-ideal situation, burns CDs and listen to your mixes anywhere you can, and take notes. "muddy in the car", "lacks bass on my friends Hi-Fi. next song's bass totally overwhelms on said hi-fi", etc.. This is just good practice anyway, and while bad speakers can definitely be limiting, good speakers never replace skill.

a decent set of headphones can help out a lot on a budget. mixing solely on headphones can create a totally different set of problems, but switching between the two can help offset the problems if you know what to listen for.

Electronathan · Post by **Electronathan** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:51 pm

Monitors are the backbone of every studio.

On that note: what's up with ears...?

zsazsa · Post by **zsazsa** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 9:56 pm

consumer speakers (like the computer speakers with subwoofers) will give a good response on paper (like 20 - 20kHz)
but generally don't state within which limits (+/- x dB).
My experience is they don't give you the same frequency response as decent speakers (upmarket audio speakers or monitors).
There are a lot of different other influences:
- how much the cabinet resonates (you can definetely hear that)
- the amount of distortion (harshness to your sound)
- the way it produces your stereo image (placement)
- depth in stereo image (with good speakers you get a sense of distance/ closeness of the instruments)
- the amountof detail you can hear (huge difference)
- the way it translates to other speakers

epiphanius · Post by **epiphanius** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:34 pm

I have a pair of Yorkville monitors (no sub) as well as a Logitech 5500 system with sub-bass. They sound very very different with the same material. The monitors provide a lot of detail in the mid range I would never hear on the Logitech system. So, yes there is a difference.

SimonPHC · Post by **SimonPHC** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:32 pm

the point of having monitors is that you can make a mix that translates to a wide as possible range of other speakers. cars, computers, earplugs, cellphones, hi-fi's, whatever.
a friend of mine can mix extremely good on really cheap crap computer speakers, but his mixes translate very good to vinyl and other speaker systems. so that proves you don't need them, but whenever he's like "wanna jam a bit" I'm like "yeah, whenever yo get some monitors so I can actually hear the stuff I'm doing".

elxicano · Post by **elxicano** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:15 am

Electronathan wrote:Monitors are the backbone of every studio.

On that note: what's up with ears...?

Couldn't agree more... Ears are overrated.

apell · Post by **apell** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:33 am

You can get away with mixing on other speakers that aren't studio monitors but you will find it easier to get good mix that sounds consistent on a wide ranges of systems from PC speaker, Good Quality Hi Fi to a car stereo by using "flat" studio monitors. Using studio monitors you won't be mislead into adding too much mids etc. which can be the case especially if you mixing with you "bass boost turned on.

hambone1 · Post by **hambone1** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:17 am

IMO, it's all hype, gear lust, and 'Emporer's New Clothes'.

At least until consumers start listening on Genelecs in sound-treated studios...

spkey · Post by **spkey** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:20 am

dn83 wrote:What's the point of using studio monitors when most of them have a smaller frequency response range than most decent computer/multimedia speaker systems and when the average potential listener isn't going to be listening to your mix on studio monitors themselves?

Absurd. Studio Monitors have a much wider frequency response range than multimedia speakers. Also, there is no 'decent' multimedia speaker in the market as far as I'm aware.

There are many reasons why you need studio monitors to mix and it would take me an hour to list them. One of them is because of the non-linearity of the human hearing which means that the human hearing does not perceive tonality, loudness or quality linearly for the entire frequency spectrum (check wiki for Fletcher & Manson Curves to see an example of the non-linearity of the human hearing in regards with loudness). Even though this non-linearity is still present whether you have a pair of multimedia speakers or an expensive pair of studio monitors you still need to try and eliminate those insufficiencies as much as you can which also means that ideally, you should also treat your room acoustically as well. Your hearing is not autonomous! It depends on your monitors (you can only hear what your speakers allow you to hear) as much as it depends on the environment you mix. If your room for example is full of static waves no pair of monitors will ever correct this problem and your mixes will always lack bass on systems that are located on rooms that do not suffer from the presense of static waves.

Assume your multimedia speakers are colouring bass. You then decide to attenuate it in order to find out that your bass is insufficient on other hi-fi systems that are less sensitive to bass. Now assume your multimedia speakers lack bass so you decide to increase it in order to find out that your mix is bass-only on speakers more sensitive than yours. This is obviously a very simplified example as I'm only talking about 'bass' and 'treble'. Just try to imagine the above scenario happening with the entire spectrum.

While your listeners will be listening to your mix through their 'decent' multimedia speakers you need a pair of monitor speakers that give you a reliable representation of your mix so that you can decide for yourself how much of this or that you want to give your mix.

roby and Moody are also right. You 've got to know you speakers. Having a good pair of speakers is not enough. You need to know how 'cheap' speakers respond in order to be able to take the right decisions. That's why professionals also have a cheap pair of speakers to monitor their mix.

And I don't think you can get away with it as other users suggest above.

Not to sound stupid, but really...studio monitors?

Not to sound stupid, but really...studio monitors?

Re: Not to sound stupid, but really...studio monitors?