Preliminary feedback for 4.04 (OS X Panther)

drumroll57 · Post by **drumroll57** » Fri Oct 15, 2004 4:14 am

Just downloaded and installed 4.04 for Mac OS_X 10.3.5, was running 4.03 previously on Alu 1.5 GHz with 1 Gig RAM, 5400 RPM HD.

Memory usage is much, much bigger on some existing sessions that were already created with 4.0x. It randomly was 'glitching' due to processor overload.

Running 'top' in the command line, it showed 0% processor available with 4.04.

Running 4.03, same exact session, 'top' shows 27% of processor free.

This is pretty considerable.

I just don't feel comfortable using 4.04 right now, and don't have time to try and troubleshoot it with a live show in a few hours.

Any similar experiences?

d.

hugo0 · Post by **hugo0** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 3:26 am

confirmed!

i'm running a Pb 1.5, 10.3.5, 1GBram and a 4200rpm HD,i've noted some more processor work since i download the 4.0.4 update,i tried in all of my project's and i confirmed,to have no doubt's about my project and way i did it,i loaded the project posted by adam on the perfomance thread,i can't have that song running on my machine without clip's and frezz's

ableton live soft optimization is getting worst every update that comes out,i'm back to the 4.0.3 previous version.

please ableton team...check this issue...it's to bad for believe,if this continue i'm afraid that i'll not buy another live version in the future

FaX-01 · Post by **FaX-01** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 4:02 am

I still think OSX needs at least a 1.8ghz single G5 proc to run effectively.
I have noticed an increase in CPU use on PC also (marginal).
The thing I want to know is this - Robert Henke and Co why does my Ableton CPU bar show 68% on a project (sure its an intensive project with 10 VSTi's plus reason rewired) yet if I CNTRL/ALT/DEL PC the task manager shows a solid 40% total CPU useage .... WTF ?

OH and to you guys on PB's I feel your pain.
This is not good news

I agree the issue sure needs addressing.
Why - becuase I'd rather gig with a PB than my P20 (just me it's the workhorse) but I'd prefer something that's tried and tested in the live arena. Maybe I'll look at an i-Mac next year for that purpose instead then .

MarkH · Post by **MarkH** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 5:40 am

Did you guys submit the OS X utilization issue as a bug? Please do so and hopefully we will see a fix soon. Be sure to send it to [email protected]

bensuthers · Post by **bensuthers** » Sat Oct 16, 2004 6:13 am

when will you lot realise that the CPU meter in Ableton is next to worthless?

drumroll57 · Post by **drumroll57** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 12:36 pm

MarkH wrote:Did you guys submit the OS X utilization issue as a bug? Please do so and hopefully we will see a fix soon. Be sure to send it to [email protected]

Sent the message as you suggested. Still, wondering about other 4.04 / Panther users out there?

Does the silence mean that everyboy else finds it an easy going upgrade?

D.

drush · Post by **drush** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:17 pm

haven't d/l'd it yet. don't have any issues with .3 and since the first thing i heard about .4 was issue this and issue that, not feeling too compelled.

rand · Post by **rand** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 6:28 pm

I noticed the HUGE cpu usage increase with Live 4.0.4 too!!
Running OSX.3.5 with a dual 2.5ghz with 4 gigs ram and Live nw uses 80%!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It was much better with Live4.03....
Please fix...
rRand

hoffman2k · Post by **hoffman2k** » Sun Oct 17, 2004 8:16 pm

During these strange increases on the cpu meter i get strange values.
I know the meter is not acurate. But when i throw in a sample it glitches to 1078% !!!!!
That was the highest i seen. But it jumps over 100 almost evertime i drag a sample into a clip.

I smell another update coming up

cheers

hoffman2k · Post by **hoffman2k** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 3:54 pm

MarkH wrote:Did you guys submit the OS X utilization issue as a bug? Please do so and hopefully we will see a fix soon. Be sure to send it to [email protected]

Yeah, i mailed them and they'll look into it. But did not confirm this is a known issue. So everybody who has these problems please mail Ableton so that they can nail this bug down.

I wish we could tell how to reproduce it, but it seems to happen on random occasions. Nothing specific to tell.

Cheers

anti-banausic · Post by **anti-banausic** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:34 pm

In response to FaX-01,

I believe that the reason for this seeming disparity is perhaps this:

With a HT enabled processor, the theoretical limit of 100% is really the combination of the "two" processors. Therefore, when you or LIVE, relegates LIVE to only one of the CPUs you are really only sending threads through the one processor, therefore, the maximum is only slightly above 50% in the task manager.

Don't fret, the computer is still way fast...and you know that through all of your research, and use of it for LIVE. But it is just an artefact of the HT.

If you have turned off HT in the BIOS, then I don't really know what is going on.

Incidentally, I am still on 4.0.1, and am very wary of all this information about increased CPU usage. I have also noticed the increase in glitches and crackles, but it is difficult at best to compare 4 with 3 due to the MIDI.

3phase · Post by **3phase** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 4:38 pm

It seems for me that Live 4 sucks on a mac in general...
A mail to the ableton support got answered "On my P4 system there are no problems..." I am not sure if that was a joke or a indikation that there is no big future on Mac for ableton software...
At least an 800 mhz P3 is faster than my 1 giga Powerbook G4 regarding Ableton Live...
That is not really necessary... And that this is still an issue, years after the first release of ableton Live, shows that there is either not the knowledge or the will to do a G4/5 optimisation.

If i could downgrade to Live 3 i probably would do so...
As a midisequencer my old atari is more interesting than the actual state of Live 4... especially regarding on stage midiloop creation...what is actually a bit funny..but hopefully a point that will be improoved one day.
The ability to use software synth is not so interesting for me.

However..maybe a V4.1 will bring some real improvements...
But when this is not happening soon i am probably back to cubase...
After 2 years with live i miss a bit the clear fat sound i had in earlier days...
This of cause only matters for vinyl and cd production... as a source for mp3´s´Live is fine.

MarkH · Post by **MarkH** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 5:02 pm

3phase wrote:It seems for me that Live 4 sucks on a mac in general...
At least an 800 mhz P3 is faster than my 1 giga Powerbook G4 regarding

That's odd, becuase my Powerbook 1.5 runs fine compared to my Dell GX260 Desktop [P4/2Ghz] and Dell Latitude Laptop [P4/1.8]. Live runs equally well on G5 compared to faster Intel/AMD chips and is no more/less optimized than the windows version. The G4 is not a fast processor by todays standards and that's the weakest link! If Ableton holds out long enough for the G5 Powerbook then performance won't be so cut-throat like it is on todays Powerbooks.

mg75 · Post by **mg75** » Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:34 pm

I am running it on PB 12 867mhz 10.3.5. There is no jump in CPU usage what so ever.

3phase · Post by **3phase** » Tue Oct 19, 2004 3:53 pm

MarkH wrote:That's odd, becuase my Powerbook 1.5 runs fine compared to my Dell GX260 Desktop [P4/2Ghz] and Dell Latitude Laptop [P4/1.8]. .

This is strange because i tested live on various pc systems and i found an audio optimized p3 800 systems as fast or faster for live on my 1 ghz G4 Powerbook.
Pc systems from noname PC with P3 coppermine processor or a dell Inspiron p3/850 or 900? at least less than 1 ghz

This of cause only applies to running live allone...
On my powerbook i can run a few other applikations in parallel without big problems...like Logic, or nord modular editors...
I dont think this combination would be faster on a P3...but i havent tested that.
Actually with Reaktor its pretty much the same with Live...runs much better on PC... Seems that the Berlin software developers are just better or more familar with the windows platforms.
Sven

Preliminary feedback for 4.04 (OS X Panther)

Preliminary feedback for 4.04 (OS X Panther)

no change