OT.... 700 BILLION $$$$

NorthernMonkey · Post by **NorthernMonkey** » Sun Sep 21, 2008 10:59 pm

Been working in finance for the past twelve-ish years - it never changes, everyone's happy when they're making money and blaming everyone else when they're losing money. Humans, gotta love 'em!

4rest · Post by **4rest** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 12:37 am

yes....humans...gotta love em =)

forge · Post by **forge** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:00 am

4rest wrote:ok i don't normally do this but i got to thinking yesterday about
bush's plan to give / loan / whatever 700 billion dollars to a FEW companys that have made VERY bad investments.....but it is said without helping these companies our economy would colapse....

it's very ironic seeing as the Republicans are the ones that go on about government getting out of the way and letting the market run itself

they're all for minimal government if it serves their own interests

I've never understood how people can so easily accept that when the say that on one hand, yet have the audacity to say that government can tell people whether women can have abortions or gay people can get married

minimal government when it suits them, in most cases fascist police state

deva · Post by **deva** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 5:03 am

NorthernMonkey wrote:
nowtime wrote:
NorthernMonkey wrote: Your president isn't 'giving/loaning/whatever' anything away - he's buying bad debt in an attempt to free up global financial markets.
The president is buying it? I thought we, the people, are "buying" it, or being asked to pay for it.
Your tax is funding it - when you pay your tax the money is no longer yours, it belongs to and is controlled by the Treasury of your country, and that money is spent by the Government.

In this case though, this is money the government does not already have.

This pretty much marks the end of the U.S.

Gotta love this part: "Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency."

ethios4 · Post by **ethios4** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 12:41 pm

RIP USA

fatrabbit · Post by **fatrabbit** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:42 pm

But surely if you gave everyone $1 million it wouldn't make any difference - it would just be a radical and extreme form of inflation.

Just look at Zimbabwe - they're all technically millionaires in Zimbabwe but it doesn't mean anything, and a loaf of bread costs $1.6 Trillion Zimbabwe dollars, as of August (http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=72936).

NorthernMonkey · Post by **NorthernMonkey** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:44 pm

fatrabbit wrote:But surely if you gave everyone $1 million it wouldn't make any difference - it would just be a radical and extreme form of inflation.

Yes, it's called hyperinflation, i.e. when inflation becomes out of control. It comes down to supply and demand - there'd be too much cash, prices would sky-rocket and the currency would effectively become worthless which would completely destabilise the economy, and as it's the US, that would lead to global economic instability.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation

"The definition used by most economists is "an inflationary cycle without any tendency toward equilibrium." A vicious circle is created in which more and more inflation is created with each iteration of the cycle. Although there is a great deal of debate about the root causes of hyperinflation, it becomes visible when there is an unchecked increase in the money supply or drastic debasement of coinage, and is often associated with wars (or their aftermath), economic depressions, and political or social upheavals."

In other words, don't do it!

Pitch Black · Post by **Pitch Black** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 3:21 pm

deva wrote:Gotta love this part: "Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency."

Yikes! That looks... fishy... Can you give that sentence more context?

Crash · Post by **Crash** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 3:24 pm

Damn it fuckferuck. The world's falling apart and I'm working on my non-existant trumpet skills to please the Tim. We are not amused!

deva · Post by **deva** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 4:14 pm

Pitch Black wrote:
deva wrote:Gotta love this part: "Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency."
Yikes! That looks... fishy... Can you give that sentence more context?

That is section 8 from the bail-out bill.

Paulson would have unaccountable financial power "without limitation" or any recourse by any individual or court.

(b) Necessary Actions.–The Secretary is authorized to take such actions as the Secretary deems necessary to carry out the authorities in this Act, including, without limitation:

This includes bailing out foreign institutions as well... wtf!

Sec. 8. Review.

Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency.

Not even a pretense of democracy anymore. That is the language of naked fascism.

deva · Post by **deva** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 4:52 pm

Paulson is also resisting any effort to amend the bill to give some support to homeowners. So this bill, which is presented as helping the american people, has nothing in it to actually help people, effort to do so is resisted, but Paulson wants unaccountable power to bail out his buddies...

unbelievable... it is pitchfork time.

deva · Post by **deva** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 4:56 pm

This is priceless too

"Democratic leaders argued over the weekend Congress had effectively no role and no authority to shape the bailout under this plan -- despite putting lawmakers on the hook for votes that could threaten their careers if the bailout later runs into trouble."

They are worried about their careers!

NorthernMonkey · Post by **NorthernMonkey** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 4:59 pm

deva wrote:Not even a pretense of democracy anymore. That is the language of naked fascism.

I see your point but I disagree - there needs to be a quick solution to this 'crisis' before it goes REALLY bad - if it was open to debate/review it would drag along forever.

Grifter · Post by **Grifter** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 5:09 pm

NorthernMonkey wrote:
deva wrote:Not even a pretense of democracy anymore. That is the language of naked fascism.
I see your point but I disagree - there needs to be a quick solution to this 'crisis' before it goes REALLY bad - if it was open to debate/review it would drag along forever.

If it was politically open to debate or view it would be exposed for the sham it is, but as it stands we have views like yours perpetuating horse shit.

NorthernMonkey · Post by **NorthernMonkey** » Mon Sep 22, 2008 5:12 pm

Grifter wrote:
NorthernMonkey wrote:
deva wrote:Not even a pretense of democracy anymore. That is the language of naked fascism.
I see your point but I disagree - there needs to be a quick solution to this 'crisis' before it goes REALLY bad - if it was open to debate/review it would drag along forever.
If it was politically open to debate or view it would be exposed for the sham it is, but as it stands we have views like yours perpetuating horse shit.

Why is it a sham? Please explain.

OT.... 700 BILLION $$$$

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