"live techno" should and will be better

jonathanm · Post by **jonathanm** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:09 am

ollyb303 wrote: I consider what I do to be "Live Techno" and some of the best bits in some of my best sets have been "mistakes"!!

As a drummer, one of my mantras was... if you make a mistake, do it 4 times and you've got a new part.....

JJarvis · Post by **JJarvis** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:11 am

Just want to say here that I am a techno producer/performer and I have NEVER automated anything.

I used to do my set using an MPC2000, an MPC2000XL a TB303 and an SH09, and never even used a loop longer than 4 bars.

Now I do my set using Live and 3 Faderfox micromoduls and again I don't use any automation - everything is mixed and tweaked there and then using the foxes and I rarely touch my laptop during a set.

I consider what I do to be "Live Techno" and some of the best bits in some of my best sets have been "mistakes"!!

There are some of my old (1999-2002) MPC sets on myspace (link in sig) for free download if anyone's interested.

If anyone's in Bristol, UK, look out for "OB1" and the "Irritant" live p.a. if you'd like to hear real, live techno (shameless plug!)

Nice. I think that this sort of performance works great. Like I said, the tools are available to do some amazing shit live. I just don't want to see live sets that consist of simply moving down through scenes in Live. Worse yet, I'm tired of headlining techno producers performing dj sets on traktor. The whole point of the DJ was to bring the music to a small place without a lot of gear. Now that you can fit a whole studio in a laptop and maybe even bring a couple controllers and drum machines, why DJ on traktor? When it comes down to it, I guess I just hate DJ software.

ollyb303 · Post by **ollyb303** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:24 am

JJarvis wrote:I'm tired of headlining techno producers performing dj sets on traktor.

+1

Must. Try. Harder.

Crash · Post by **Crash** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:26 am

"Almost there."

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 11:41 am

JJarvis wrote:When it comes down to it, I guess I just hate DJ software.

when it comes down to it - you're a lazy shit who doesn't make the effort to find what you're looking for and you obviously don't know the difference between a DJ set and a live set.

As far as DJing goes, fuck-ya - use traktor. be lazy. be compact. only a faggot would go to something advertised as a DJ set and be bummed with the state of 'live techno' afterwards.

opuswerk · Post by **opuswerk** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 11:47 am

I must say I can't agree more with the topic.
As an act we really focus on being able to play our music like an instrument more than a cd. We work with Live7 a BCF2000 and a BCR2000. Everything's automated on the fly. So it's all midi being played.
Maybe you will find us interesting enough. You can grab our old liveset here : http://www.virb.com/opuswerk (link is in the player, and it should be the only track you can download) for some more recent work head to our myspace : http://www.myspace.com/opuswerk
I'd be really interested to see what you have to say about the set, as we really aim at being able to really really play it.

On a side note, I think Liveacts in general are just in their beginnings and it's just a matter of time and practice before they're gonna get really good.

90's child · Post by **90's child** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 11:50 am

You see this is exactly the fundamental issue I have with techno/house DJs & producers who feel that the technical performance is the most important thing. Its not.

What counts is the actual music. That's what is the most important thing. I don't care if the DJ/Producer is manually automating the beatrepeat plug through an autofilter.

I care about me hearing 60-120 minutes of good music. And dancing.

mrsakitumi · Post by **mrsakitumi** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 1:14 pm

i'm all for a live electronic gig, but I realise that some artists are probably just not capable of pulling it off.
Some of the electronic producers out there are just that, producers.
They spend ages clicking away at their various DAW's making toons, cos that's just what they want to do.
Suddenly some of their tracks get picked up and they have to gig it.
Now the pressure's on and they're just not ready/able to "bring it" live.
On the flipside, if they are able to and just being downright lazy about it
(automode), then that's just not on.
But how do you know?

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 1:26 pm

mrsakitumi wrote:i
But how do you know?

on the flyer it says DJ SET or LIVE SET.

it's complicated, I know, but you get used to it after a while.

dan aktivix · Post by **dan aktivix** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 1:29 pm

Gosh, isn't bounce a grumpy little so-and-so? Anyhoo, more thoughts from someone who doesn't go to enough gigs to satisfy bounce, but still has opinions:

I've played live all of three times in my life, and somehow the last time I forgot to allow myself many options for actual live playing in live. I was bored, and I think everyone else was. The first set - actually because I hadn't spent so long trying to 'produce' the tracks - was much, much more dynamic. Fun was had by all.

I mean - what else lets you chop up Duke Ellington and Amon Tobin so easily? (A combination that works surprisingly well!) Live is awesome. There are so many approaches to playing 'live' with it - and I don't buy the notion that, to be live, you need to be playing just with single loops and controlling everything. Mistakes should be allowable, and things can have a rough edge (luckily!), but it's nice to have some sections being just as you want em. The point is, Live allows endless mixes of control and playback. Well, no, that's not the point, is it? Someone said - it's about what sounds good.

The important thing about that first gig was that I was really into it - and that helped others get into it. I guess everyone gets that; a friend of mine has been playing out for years now, but only slowly did he allow himself to have fun. Going to his gigs now makes such a difference, coz people can see him jumping round like a monkey and grinning - rather than staring at his twiddly things with a furrowed brow like he used to. So the human element of performance is important - in more ways than just whether you're 'live'.

So: it's about what sounds good, but you gotta balance that with what floats your boat as a live player. You have to have fun. I think if you're up there stroking your chin, being ever-so 'experimental', furrowing your brow or otherwise taking yourself too seriously, then the audience would have to be the same as you. Personally, I think having fun is a better idea.

p.s. I'll give him a plug since its damn fine techno -

http://www.sabretoothrecords.com/sabre.html

Oo, I could go on, but I'll stop now. Jaysus I gotta do work!

Moody · Post by **Moody** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 2:46 pm

JJarvis wrote:
HEY FAGGOT.

It seems like techno producers are gettin lazy with their live sets ?
Not bad, not horrible, only average ?
The 'old tricks of the trade' are overused ?
Why aren't there more people pushing the envelope of what a live techno or electronic music set should be ?

These are bold statements. And you didn't go to eatstapes. I'm curious if your statements are even based on real experiences at all.

You suck beyond belief and should STFU on all techno related matters from here on in.
Over the last year I've seen Gui Borrato, Richie Hawtin, Matthew Dear, Modeselektor, Ellen Allien, Sascha Funke, Steve Bug, and all the other local clowns. Look, I've been listening to techno for nearly 15 years. I'm from Detroit and I've seen just about everyone at some point. I just miss the days when Stacey Pullen would open up for Robert Hood at Motor, or when Juan Atkins would perform a real live set at St. Andrews Hall. Techno, like a lot of genres has gotten a little too comfortable as of late. Some guys are doing it right. I enjoyed Modeselektor and yea sorry I didn't get to see your show. I work too much to be going out on a week night. I just can't understand why someone has to get upset about what I hoped to be a constructive discussion on music. As far as I'm concerned you have no room to talk on this matter.

Stacey Pullen, fucking freak... craziest and probably one of the best DJ sets I have ever witnessed. Right next to Hawtin in his Plastikman days amongst a few good friends that I hold in high regards as well. The Techno PA certainly needs a revolution at this point. I am working on one myself amongst many of my other projects.

JJarvis · Post by **JJarvis** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 3:44 pm

[quote]On a side note, I think Liveacts in general are just in their beginnings and it's just a matter of time and practice before they're gonna get really good.

+1. I think that the laptop performance will change dramatically in the next few years. To be fair, it already is happening. My comments have been based on the radical changes I saw happen in Techno performances starting about 8 years ago. Just like any new technology, it takes time to really explore what things are capable of doing. All these new portable touch screen interfaces are going to help contribute to the quality of the performance.

I remember seeing Akufen, who I'm quite fond of, perform a dreadful set with Ableton early on in his live pa career. Since then, I've noticed that he has moved over to doing more DJ sets. All the better I guess. Some talented producers just can't find a way to perform live that works for them like it does in the studio. It doesn't mean that DJing has to be boring though. I prefer DJs that make mistakes in their sets but play great records over DJs that mix everything flawlessly in Traktor or Ableton. DJs can have that raw live element to.

b0unce · Post by **b0unce** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 4:30 am

I'm willing to paypal up to five dollars to some slack-jawed queer who'll bash this cunt's head in.

Crash · Post by **Crash** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 4:43 am

Deal! errr, what again?

NativeOps · Post by **NativeOps** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 10:57 am

JJarvis wrote:It seems like techno producers are gettin lazy with their live sets. The music is all the same weekend from weekend. Not bad, not horrible, only average. DJ's no longer mix up their record selection and all the old tricks of the trade are overused. Why aren't there more people pushing the envelope of what a live techno or electronic music set should be? Today we have amazing tools to do the job. I'm hopeful that things will get back to how they were during the hardware era. Any thoughts?

Well, I'm working on it. I just need a little more money. Somehow I ended up with Ableton, a Macbook 2.4, a G5, 3 HDs with a Tbyte, the Predator VST, a guitar, a Vox FX board, a talk-box, a djembe, a darbuka, bongos, a didgeridoo, a full set of Honer Harmonicas, 3 jaw harps, a flute, a trumpet, an HDX turntable, a Korg padKontrol, a BCR2000, a small midi keyrig controller, and an 88 key weighted bed, but no audio interface yet.
As soon as I can afford the TC Electronic Konnekt Live, I will do something new. That is of course if it's a stable interface. I did purchase the MOTU 828 MK3, but it had serious bugs, too serious to consider for live use.
But hopefully in a few weeks, I can complete the loop, and when I do, I plan on playing almost everything simultaneously. It will be electronically influenced, but saturated with real instruments. Trust me, it will be something new. I'll have to hit the thread back up after I get a video online..

BTW, does any own Sylenth? I'd like to trade Predator for it...

"live techno" should and will be better

Live

Re: "live techno" should and will be better