Best way to make softsynths sound warmer

[madhattared]

I use camelcrusher a lot for warming things up. just use it subtly and not as an all guns blazing distortion unit. I really like the sound of the simple compressor built into this plugin. used this puppy on 3 albums now.

Steve

hot tip

thanks man

[stjohn]

I completely understand that doing-all-in software versus old-hardware-plus-mixer issue.
I moved from extensively using HW and analog mixers to doing everything in Live.
At the beginning I had the same problems, i found the sound of software thin.
However, i had to realize that it had more to do with my skills and experience then with the software itself.

Hardware is noisy, hardware introduces nonlinear distortions, crosstalk, and if we talk physical MIDI it also introduces latencies,
which might change with a complex pattern over time due to some interference with CPU clock and other things.
If we think of analog hardware for sound generation, we also have slight differences for each voice in a polyphonic system,
slight detuning that might change over time, and certainly never a pure sine, saw or square waveform, not for the oscillators and not for the LFOs.

Software does not offer all those things by itself. But what software offers is many ways to add those effects, and in contrary to hardware to be in complete control over the amount and color of those artefacts.

Re-recording your sound thru some external device is certainly a simple and effective way to add some character, and it can be lots of fun too, but I am 100% convinced and I heard examples from other producers, that one can create music with sonic warmth completely in software. In any software, that offers EQs, compressors and some kind of distortion units and a mixer.

Robert

Great insight...so give up the goods, dude...what are some quick-n-dirty tricks to warm up your Operators?

he's put them in bold

[forge]

warmth = 120-250Hz quite often

that's it ?

well that is the region often associated with warmth, but it is also the region associated with muddiness if there is too much there


as with anything it depends a lot on what is in the mix and how much is already going on in this range - if there's already a lot there then boosting will just make it muddy - usually you don't need all instruments to be strong in the same region at once and can give them better separation if they are stronger at different frequencies - even if it's only slightly

another thing to consider, especially with bass is the ratio between bass and low bass - so if you boost in the 120-250Hz then you could try cutting in the 80-120 region - and if you don't need your bass to have any sub (i.e. because the kick is really strong there) then you could just use a Hi-pass and cut everything below that 80-100 Hz region

alot of the time the 2nd harmnics of bass (certainly with bass guitar) can be nearly as strong as the fundamental, so you might not need the fundamental to really be heard as it might clash with the meat of the kick anyway

all this can make the bass tighter and sit better with the kick

warmth = 120-250Hz quite often

You know what's funny, a while back I felt that Zebra2 was sounding a bit thin compared to some other of my synths for basses and mid range leads when I was trying to get a certain bass sound starting from some presets. Then I raised the bass levels around this range with zebra's EQ. Problem solved. Thing is, I didn't hear it as missing bass, I heard it as just not sounding as warm at the time. I tend to use EQ subractively to cut frequencies away that clash or are uneeded, not usually adding, but in this case, it really was that simple.

and also, the mighty Bob Katz talks about the 'yin and yang of EQ' where sometimes cutting in a different frequency can have a similar effect

so for example, if you cut a little at maybe around 5kHz it can have the same effect - might not be exactly 5kHz, trial and error, but up in that region

[madhattared]

bob katz knows. the idea is if you cut 5khz, the corresponding frequency on the other side of the spectrum will appear to be boosted ~300 - 400hz even though we have not modified it.


NOISE!!!! put it -40 db to -60db under your other oscillators and you'll be surprised at how much warmth it can add.

[nebulae]

NOISE!!!! put it -40 db to -60db under your other oscillators and you'll be surprised at how much warmth it can add.

neat trick, thanks

[glitchrock-buddha]

bob katz knows. the idea is if you cut 5khz, the corresponding frequency on the other side of the spectrum will appear to be boosted ~300 - 400hz even though we have not modified it.


NOISE!!!! put it -40 db to -60db under your other oscillators and you'll be surprised at how much warmth it can add.

Very true! Noise is essential to nice warm synth patches.

[Incy]

Did anyone mention that trick where you add an Fx send of a high shelf eq of 3khz+ and and add saturator to that to create your own 'vintage warmer'?

Easier then running your app to a tube preamp and running it back in or other such foolishness. I'm sure the A/D converters along the way create their own color.

[forge]

Did anyone mention that trick where you add an Fx send of a high shelf eq of 3khz+ and and add saturator to that to create your own 'vintage warmer'?

Easier then running your app to a tube preamp and running it back in or other such foolishness. I'm sure the A/D converters along the way create their own color.

I'd call that more of an exciter - that wouldn't be warmth as such - the 3k range could be quite harsh with a saturator on it

[trash]

god youre fucking quick....

aint you twats got ears ? listen to yourselves...
if you cant make a decent tune - this is irrelevant...

[liveISlife]

microwave on high for 2 minutes, flip and cook and additional 1 minute.

[liveISlife]

microwave on high for 2 minutes, flip and cook and additional 1 minute.

Thanks, I'll give this a try

No problem man. You just got to know how to do these types of things or else you are lost in life. Fucking nOObz. ^^D

[baseinstinct]

if you cut 5khz, the corresponding frequency on the other side of the spectrum will appear to be boosted ~300 - 400hz even though we have not modified it.

WHat frequency is it then, the corresponding one?

Is there any table or formula which describes this correspondence across the spectrum?

[nebulae]

Just to give an update, I bought a second Presonus TubePre used from dcease - if I didn't already have one TubePre, I'd prolly get a Presonus BlueTube DP2 so that I had a stereo preamp. In any case, now, with my stereo chain, I can dial in some subtle tube air or some crunch. Overall, I believe this is what I was looking for, but I won't know for sure till I do a full song with a lot of passes thru the tubes. I'm happy to post individual files if people are interested, but I think the real test will be a full mix which will take a little while to do - I have a couple of Hot Bitch Arsenal remixes lined up, so that'll be a good excuse to try this new technique.

[forge]

if you cut 5khz, the corresponding frequency on the other side of the spectrum will appear to be boosted ~300 - 400hz even though we have not modified it.

WHat frequency is it then, the corresponding one?

Is there any table or formula which describes this correspondence across the spectrum?

well the 5kHz range is a good starting point - just try here and then sweep around a bit - that will often work

cutting here can also have the effect of pulling something back in the mix

but there aren't really any 'formulas' as such because every piece of audio is different

but if you think of it like this - you have your piece of audio and there are certain freqency bands that are louder than others - the ear is also more sensitive to some frequencies than others (look up fletcher munson curve) and so that will also affect which bit sticks out more to you. If you cut certain frequencies you are changing this ratio so that the ones that are loudest are no longer sticking out as much, meaning the others will appear more noticable - so by cutting at 5kHz, you are allowing the other frequencies to stand out a bit more, and at that range it can have the effect of taking away some of the higher, possibly harsher frequencies (which will tend to dominate as the ear is still a bit more sensitive to them) then this can allow the lower mid and bass frequencies to come through a bit more

a really good read is Bob Katz's 'mastering audio' he does cover a lot of this - in fact there is even some stuff on the web - google 'bob katz EQ yin yang' or something like that

[NorthernMonkey]

forge, just stumbled onto your site, 'Making TEN' is a good tune, has it made it onto the club scene?