How many controllers is too many?

logic_user99 · Post by **logic_user99** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:45 am

Just a thought...

I've got one 'master' keyboard for recording with, an Oxygen 8 for gigging, and a USB game pad for tweaking live. I'll have, before the week is out, a UC-33e for the studio AND live use...

Is four too many? Should I have more? How many have you got?

xzusa8ky · Post by **xzusa8ky** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:53 am

To many is to many!

weeddigger · Post by **weeddigger** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:30 pm

I'd say go with the least amount possible.

But, don't sell yourself short either.

Use what you need.

ollyb303 · Post by **ollyb303** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 12:36 pm

4 is too many to use at once. Most of us only have 3 hands

I use 3 faderfox controllers and have thought about maybe getting a nocturn or another fox just for tweaking plugs but I'm not sure I'd have enough hands (or my brain might not keep up!).

LeifonMars · Post by **LeifonMars** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 1:17 pm

When performing I used to have Novation Remotes for faders and knobs, but then I bought padKontrol and pretty soon I realized all I need is two of them. I use clips with automation embedded for fades and stuff. Basically it works so that with left hand I launch loops and fader clips and stuff, with my right hand I play instruments via 2nd padKontrol. At studio I mainly work on PT and I'm so used to using shortkeys that I don't miss designated controller for that. So my answer is two (padKontrols).

glitchrock-buddha · Post by **glitchrock-buddha** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 2:23 pm

Just depends what makes it more fun and how much cash you can spare...

I used to be a huge minimalist. When the novation SL came along, I saw it as a way for me to just have one controller (plus a full keyboard). But over the last year, I've realized I can't do what I want live while having access to only a few parameters at a time.

I had the SL for faders and controlling the selected tracks first 8 parameters, as well as some buttons for scenes, pads for fills and a few extra knobs for global controls. But I didn't like controlling either volume or sends (they were the same slider on the SL), so I needed something for sends. Ended up with the BCR2000 which is perfect for 4 sends plus the sends parameters. But then I also wanted something to control individual hits in a drum rack as well as control parameters of the drum rack/sends etc/ So I got an mpd32. I had also acquired an x-session pro at some point for scratching/cutting with Ms.Pinky in Live, which I also decided to use for my return tracks and their sends. Oh ya I also had a little O2 mini keyboard for travelling. Now I was a minimalist with five controllers and a full keyboard. Then I started using my laptop for live jamming, including guitar, so I decided to get a behringer FCB1010 for controlling guitar rig and also scenes/recording if I one day chose. Make that 7 controllers. Then I decided the remote 37SL was a bit big for sticking in a bag and figured I'd get a novation zero SL for the mixer/live stuff and use the 37 for plug-in automap. 8 controllers. I'm even considering Kore.....

wha'happened?......

logic_user99 · Post by **logic_user99** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 2:28 pm

[quote="glitchrock-buddha"]Just depends what makes it more fun and how much cash you can spare...

I used to be a huge minimalist. When the novation SL came along, I saw it as a way for me to just have one controller (plus a full keyboard). But over the last year, I've realized I can't do what I want live while having access to only a few parameters at a time.

I had the SL for faders and controlling the selected tracks first 8 parameters, as well as some buttons for scenes, pads for fills and a few extra knobs for global controls. But I didn't like controlling either volume or sends (they were the same slider on the SL), so I needed something for sends. Ended up with the BCR2000 which is perfect for 4 sends plus the sends parameters. But then I also wanted something to control individual hits in a drum rack as well as control parameters of the drum rack/sends etc/ So I got an mpd32. I had also acquired an x-session pro at some point for scratching/cutting with Ms.Pinky in Live, which I also decided to use for my return tracks and their sends. Oh ya I also had a little O2 mini keyboard for travelling. Now I was a minimalist with five controllers and a full keyboard. Then I started using my laptop for live jamming, including guitar, so I decided to get a behringer FCB1010 for controlling guitar rig and also scenes/recording if I one day chose. Make that 7 controllers. Then I decided the remote 37SL was a bit big for sticking in a bag and figured I'd get a novation zero SL for the mixer/live stuff and use the 37 for plug-in automap. 8 controllers. I'm even considering Kore.....

wha'happened?......[/quote]

You went overboard, son! Good lord that's a lot of gear. If you can use it all, more power to you!

I'm looking at a BCR2000 or UC-33e. The BCR is half the price, but I'm not sure if it's going to have enough knobs on it!

glitchrock-buddha · Post by **glitchrock-buddha** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 2:35 pm

I bought the uc-33e a few months back, but ended up taking it back and getting a bcr. I much prefer the bcr - endless encoders with visual feedback is pretty great. You end up getting far more useable knobs than a UC-33e.

hacktheplanet · Post by **hacktheplanet** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 4:50 pm

"Too many" is when they can't fit in your bag!
I'm all for compact setups.

Baron von Case · Post by **Baron von Case** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 5:44 pm

glitchrock-buddha wrote:Just depends what makes it more fun and how much cash you can spare...

I used to be a huge minimalist. When the novation SL came along, I saw it as a way for me to just have one controller (plus a full keyboard). But over the last year, I've realized I can't do what I want live while having access to only a few parameters at a time.

I had the SL for faders and controlling the selected tracks first 8 parameters, as well as some buttons for scenes, pads for fills and a few extra knobs for global controls. But I didn't like controlling either volume or sends (they were the same slider on the SL), so I needed something for sends. Ended up with the BCR2000 which is perfect for 4 sends plus the sends parameters. But then I also wanted something to control individual hits in a drum rack as well as control parameters of the drum rack/sends etc/ So I got an mpd32. I had also acquired an x-session pro at some point for scratching/cutting with Ms.Pinky in Live, which I also decided to use for my return tracks and their sends. Oh ya I also had a little O2 mini keyboard for travelling. Now I was a minimalist with five controllers and a full keyboard. Then I started using my laptop for live jamming, including guitar, so I decided to get a behringer FCB1010 for controlling guitar rig and also scenes/recording if I one day chose. Make that 7 controllers. Then I decided the remote 37SL was a bit big for sticking in a bag and figured I'd get a novation zero SL for the mixer/live stuff and use the 37 for plug-in automap. 8 controllers. I'm even considering Kore.....

wha'happened?......

Please explain the limits of the SL on your live performance. Remember in doing so to do it as you wold to a retarded boy, as I am relatively very new at all this. Veteran to music, baby to electronic production.

terborg · Post by **terborg** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 5:50 pm

the remote sl, pad kontrol, and the mackie mcu pro, everything else i have just collects dust. the remote sl is something everyone should own

fatrabbit · Post by **fatrabbit** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 6:11 pm

Didn't that DJ guy in Linkin Park have about 10 Trigger Fingers in his live setup? Probably didn't realise there were 'scenes'.

EDIT (found it): http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... ght=linkin

logic_user99 · Post by **logic_user99** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 6:45 pm

Gonna add a BCR this week...! And, I think the LP chappy (Joe Hahn?) plays the TFs like a keyboard...or MPC-style pad playing...

10 is too many, though!

glitchrock-buddha · Post by **glitchrock-buddha** » Tue Sep 30, 2008 6:48 pm

Baron von Case wrote:
Please explain the limits of the SL on your live performance. Remember in doing so to do it as you wold to a retarded boy, as I am relatively very new at all this.

The main limits to the SL that found were with sends. Now I'm just talking about using the automap template here. Keep in mind that you can manually assign (midi learn) whatever controls you want in Live. I want to use the automap template because it allows me to see the tracks names on the lcd, hit record enable and automatically have the first 8 parameters show up for the encoders and on the lcd screen (perfect for rack macros). My problem was that the faders were also responsible for sends. You have to press a button and the faders would control pan and sends. This is not good for me because I wanted to be able to control both at the same time, primarily because I like to use sends pre fader, so I can suddenly boost the send amount and cut the volume at the same time, making it be 100% wet from a return track. So anyways, I got a bcr, which lets me control volume and sends for a track at the same time. It's basically that I don't want the overlap of the parameters on the same controls.

The other thing I was mentioning was that the SL automap doesn't have a way to control the individual channels in a drum rack, so I dedicate my mpd32 controls to that. Now of course I could make another template on the SL for manually assigning, but again, it's the case that I want control of both at the same time and switching templates on the SL would not accommodate this.

Make sense?