Zeitgeist part 2: Addendum

[silverlulu]

so do you think he lost the plot with the 2nd film or do you think it was a good move?

[Emissary]

i dont think it was quite as good as the first but still a very well made documentary. It all goes a bit new age with the jaque fresco stuff (although he was interesting). I dont think we will ever see something like that in our time. maybe in a few thousand years when all this has repeated a few hundred time people will start to question the society we live in.

I think society as a whole needs to collapse before we can build something great from its ashes. and i dont know when that will be, could be 5 years could be 5000. thats of course as long as nibiru doesnt destroy us all

[sublimelobc]

The thing to realise is :
"the government", "them", "the man", "the evil secret cabal", etc.
they are all us, people , humans. We as humans are one organism, they as dominators are like the eyeball, or the toenail.

Humans as part of the collective organism start to take on certain seemingly required roles within that organism. When you hate on "the man" for his oppressive ways you must realise you are hating on "humanity" - the particular person you hate has simply morphed into a required role. You can argue that the role of oppressor is not required, but the truth is we do not get a say on our group genetics. As a race and as individuals we have many latent facets waiting to spring to life - we are pre-programmed to mutate in certain situations.

The hippy munching on a raw organic carrot can be transformed into a greedy oppressive power broker simply by being transported into that slot of our collective organism.
Doubt that this could happen? It has been proven time and time again as people morph into oppressors simply by being put in the position to abuse.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment


Many of our worst politicians actually started out as idealists who strove to break the system / the man / etc. But when they got to that position, they fullfilled the exact same specified role asthe people they ousted.

we are humans, this is what we are.
You , me , them, us, none are without "blame".

perhaps it is necessary that we are like this.

It's hard to imagine this explanation NOT making total sense to anybody.

[funknotik]

This Zeitgeist contained more relevant information than the last one. The eutopian part was interesting but the CGI depicting the future was pretty crap. This is actually the most realistic down to earth thing posted by Emissary so far. No talk of shape shifting or xenu! Interesting movie alot of inacuracies, especially (maybe I heard wrong) 50% of the world living with under 2 dollars a day... Hmmm.

[silverlulu]

the bit which really effected me was that guy who was saying how they went in to countries and tried to bribe leaders to sell of their country's main industries and killed them if they didn't.

fucking assholes

[ethios4]

Me too. That's the part I keep thinking about...from what I understand it is true. That's why I feel sick when politicians go on and on about the US being the greatest force for good, blah blah blah. Sickening.

[silverlulu]

so this zeitgeist movement website should be starting up tomorrow... 12th October. i think everyone should at least check it out.

http://www.thezeitgeistmovement.com/

[Machinate]

Me too. That's the part I keep thinking about...from what I understand it is true. That's why I feel sick when politicians go on and on about the US being the greatest force for good, blah blah blah. Sickening.

I think every man, woman and child in the western hemisphere should be issued a copy of Naomi Kleins "The Shock Doctrine".

No global conspiracy nuttery.
No cloud-seeding tin-foilisms.

just plain old journalistic integrity explaining some of the biggest disasters in the last 50 years.

Fantastic read.

[Emissary]

This Zeitgeist contained more relevant information than the last one. The eutopian part was interesting but the CGI depicting the future was pretty crap. This is actually the most realistic down to earth thing posted by Emissary so far. No talk of shape shifting or xenu! Interesting movie alot of inacuracies, especially (maybe I heard wrong) 50% of the world living with under 2 dollars a day... Hmmm.

its nibiru dude , NIBIRU !! geez

[fatrabbit]

Even though it's just a holding page/mailing list sign-up their code is built and formatted badly and inefficiently. What good will they be at running a world?

FAIL.

(I'm joking)

[Machinesworking]

The thing to realise is :
"the government", "them", "the man", "the evil secret cabal", etc.
they are all us, people , humans. We as humans are one organism, they as dominators are like the eyeball, or the toenail.

Humans as part of the collective organism start to take on certain seemingly required roles within that organism. When you hate on "the man" for his oppressive ways you must realise you are hating on "humanity" - the particular person you hate has simply morphed into a required role. You can argue that the role of oppressor is not required, but the truth is we do not get a say on our group genetics. As a race and as individuals we have many latent facets waiting to spring to life - we are pre-programmed to mutate in certain situations.

The hippy munching on a raw organic carrot can be transformed into a greedy oppressive power broker simply by being transported into that slot of our collective organism.
Doubt that this could happen? It has been proven time and time again as people morph into oppressors simply by being put in the position to abuse.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment


Many of our worst politicians actually started out as idealists who strove to break the system / the man / etc. But when they got to that position, they fullfilled the exact same specified role asthe people they ousted.

we are humans, this is what we are.
You , me , them, us, none are without "blame".

perhaps it is necessary that we are like this.

It's hard to imagine this explanation NOT making total sense to anybody.

It makes sense, but I'm not sure about the spin of it? Forgive me if I misunderstand the intention, but required role is a stretch IMO.
Mankind is in it's infancy, especially when it come to dealing with larger civilizations. We at this point are still operating under the survival mode, when we easily have plenty to go around.
Our intelligence and desire for community are our biggest assets, our fear of other people and desire to stockpile more than the neighbor are our biggest downfalls.

While I agree that mankind as a whole has to figure this stuff out, there is no us VS them, (and when you go down that path you IMO create the roots of 'evil'), I don't think dominion and power are required roles, they're just leftover reactions to times of scarcity and desperation. We as a whole are capable of doing better than this, but who knows how long that will take?

IMO the first place to start is with your own brain, how do you perceive humanity and what does that do to affect the way you interact with people? Nothing will change unless you become the person you want around you ( etc... new age hippy shit.....etc.) For instance I'm in a new band, I've spent ridiculous amounts of money on equipment in the last six months, years etc. I could easily pull a Kurt Kobain and take 60-70% of any profits as I write all the songs. Me and the singer could pretty much rape the drummer financially as the initial song and lyrics are in US law 90% of any income from sales etc. What I proposed and implemented was that all three of us have a 1/3 share apiece in whatever we get back from any projects we do together. You say you're a anarchist/socialist/communist, that you are interested in being 100% fair, then do it. Too many people say they want real change, but act just as greedy and self absorbed as the "oppressors".

[silverlulu]

the website is now up and running so go and support it

http://www.thezeitgeistmovement.com/

[funknotik]

One thing I that really stood out about The second Zeitgeist was the fact that it had proposed solutions to the monetary system. Something I rarely see anywhere, even most people who are dissenters, freethinkers, etc rarely have a solution outlined in a reasonable and scientific way. It's refreshing to see the "Venus project" thing even though it looked a little goofy. Atleast someone is trying to find an alternative. Another alternative I've seen is called "participatory economics, or PARECON." (check the wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Participatory_economics

This is one of the most reasonable explanations to eliminating class struggles and having a more "free society." Perhaps Parecon could lead to something like the Venus project in the future. Although im sure it will be a couple more world wars before any change occurs. Does anyone know of any other proposed solutions to the current capitalist, polyarchical, fucked up system of government and economy? These are the only two I've seen thus far that have real potential if anyone cared to invest the time and money required to fund them.

[WaveRider]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 7695921912

good watch. well for some of you anyway. others will despise it.

I liked part 1 but that venusian society is a scam....

[Aequitas123]

I liked part 1 but that venusian society is a scam....

Support your argument or move on.