hi hat programming

nylarch · Post by **nylarch** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:22 pm

My hi hat programming sucks. Any tips?

It generally comes out sounding dry and boring. Tried some reverb to give it some space and they sound reverb-y and boring....

help!

infiniteB · Post by **infiniteB** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:40 pm

try adding some delay to them, slight variations in panning, using more than one hight hat sound, using more than one high hat pattern, changing sounds, slight variations in velocity, slight variations in placement (non quantized) a/k/a swing, slight/large variations in hit length, using triplets, various lengths of high hat loops (1bar, 4 bars, 800 bars) that change up or variate every Xth bar, etc...

What style of music do you make? This ultimately doesn't matter (rules are meant to be broken), but is useful in giving you a rough basis to start...

nylarch · Post by **nylarch** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 4:26 pm

mostly beats driven stuff - usually a programmed drum pattern mixed in with some process loops, or parts of loops. Mid tempo.

My programmed loops sound a little dry and stiff. Particularly the hats....

infiniteB · Post by **infiniteB** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 4:34 pm

Mid tempo? What do you define as mid-tempo?

Beat driven? Most forms of music at some point are beat driven... What (if you had to) would you define yourself as making (could be more than one style, of course)--- Breaks, Drum'n'Bass, Rock, Trance, Techno, House, Hip Hop, Trip Hop, Ambient, Noisecore, Hardcore, Glitch, GoGo, Pop.... ? ?

laird · Post by **laird** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 4:42 pm

turn off quantize. Play the pattern with your fingers or something.

nylarch · Post by **nylarch** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 6:15 pm

breaks-y sort of....I guess I just say "beats" b/c when I DJ I'm all over the place but its all funky (from early 90's Native Tongues to current Glitch Mob to random funky pop / classic rock, etc.).

And I'm just getting into writing so I guess what I'm trying to do is a bit all over the map as well.

But my hi-hats really suck.

infiniteB · Post by **infiniteB** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 6:55 pm

nylarch wrote:breaks-y sort of....I guess I just say "beats" b/c when I DJ I'm all over the place but its all funky (from early 90's Native Tongues to current Glitch Mob to random funky pop / classic rock, etc.).

And I'm just getting into writing so I guess what I'm trying to do is a bit all over the map as well.

But my hi-hats really suck.

look at my above suggestions...

also, try starting your programming by making sure your measures are broken into 16ths (good starting point, but as you gain experience, this won't mean as much)...start your high hats on the "ands" ... if a measure is broken into 16ths, for example, a high hat would be on the 3, 7, 11, and 15.... then try a hat on ALL of the 16ths, then only the even ones (2, 4, etc)... one you got this down, try putting in some extra hat(s) next to (before, after, in between) the ones you have in some of the above patterns I mentioned... Then on the "all 16ths" pattern, try taking out random hats (for example the 2, 5, 6, 10, and 12)..... and all of these are just ideas for one bar.... just imagine what you could do with 2 or more bars, with the above posted suggestions (swing and velocity fluctuation help things sound more natural and human - imperfection), multiple high hat lines going at once give depth--- both could be complex or one complex and one very simple, etc....., etc... also an uneven, say 5 bar (5 measure) high hat line playing while other tracks (Bass, synth, snare, bass kick, whatever) are even numbered in terms of measures (2, 4, 6, 8...) sounds like the hat is weaving in and out in different patterns....... also hear the difference between open high hats and closed high hats in music you listen to (tribe, de la, etc...) and see how/when they apply either and/or both......
also overall volume of hats is eally important (sometimes they should be "heard" only when you listen closely for them, other times they blend well, and other times they take the lead).... in other words, a hat is not a hat is not a hat... oh yeah, besides pan variations (mentioned in above post), the general placement/pan of the hats is very important, relative to the rest of the mix... try, as only as a starting point, panning the drums as you would "see" a drum kit--- for example, bass kick center, hat 10-15% left, snare 7-15% right, side stick 18-25% left, etc...

nylarch · Post by **nylarch** » Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:50 pm

thanks so much...appreciate the help.

Mr Lager · Post by **Mr Lager** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 3:43 pm

Side chain your hats to your kicks and snares
not much - just a slight dip in volume
gives them a little more dynamic movement and gives your beats a bit more character

nylarch · Post by **nylarch** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 6:04 pm

that sounds like a great idea - thanks....

dominicw78 · Post by **dominicw78** » Thu Oct 30, 2008 10:13 pm

Find some songs or loops where you like the hats and then try to emulate them yourself. Work with real hat samples so you learn the different types of hits and when to use them ie closed, open, pedal, etc.

You can do some very realistic hat loops with just 2 or 3 samples, 2 closed and one open. Either play them with you fingers or place them in unquatised and match them to your beat. Most patterns are fairly simple, it is the slight variations of accent and timing that give them their groove and make them sound sophisticated.

Snurker · Post by **Snurker** » Sun Nov 23, 2008 9:55 pm

I don't know how you make your loops but personally found that all the humanizing gadgets in the world don't compete with my own fallibilities for making interesting loops! I use a pad controller (Akai mpd 24), bash away with quantize switched right off. Keep what you like, ditch the rest.

Jekblad · Post by **Jekblad** » Mon Nov 24, 2008 2:21 am

Mr Lager wrote:Side chain your hats to your kicks and snares
not much - just a slight dip in volume
gives them a little more dynamic movement and gives your beats a bit more character

that is so simple and bad ass. thank you

Nick the Zombie · Post by **Nick the Zombie** » Tue Nov 25, 2008 5:44 am

Jekblad wrote:
Mr Lager wrote:Side chain your hats to your kicks and snares
not much - just a slight dip in volume
gives them a little more dynamic movement and gives your beats a bit more character
that is so simple and bad ass. thank you

Agreed, this is a great idea. Additionally, don't neglect the swing capabilities in Live. The last thing you want is for your hi hats to sound too robotic (although sometimes that's precisely what you DO want, but that's for another conversation).

makehaste · Post by **makehaste** » Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:26 pm

Mr Lager is right on point with the side chaining, what i like to do is program a hi-hat pattern as close as you can get it to the way you like, then throw abletons gate plugin on the hi-hat track and side chain it off the kick and snare adjust the attack and relase controls to taste ( i personally like short attack, and relase and a longer Hold) set the threshold for just the amount of cut you want and presto.... on top of that i then assign the hi-hat volume fader to a actual fader on my midi controller and then just cut it in and out like a dj fader ... give it a try

ryjan

hi hat programming

hi hat programming

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