what runs Live better PC or MAC?

AdamJay · Post by **AdamJay** » Sat Nov 20, 2004 11:24 pm

you misread my post...
and i think you misread paws' post too..

the instant you put an XP machine on the internet without all the security updates (which take at least 10 minutes to get on a broadband connection), your machine is attacked.

i OPENED NO INTERNET utility between installing XP and running Automatic Update. i didn't even use a web browser to obtain any kind of internet utility.
there are random ip scanners out there just looking for available ports to attack.

yea its easy to keep spyware out and keep your machine running fine.... both my machines run flawlessly. But paws post said "if you connect a WinXP box to the internet for fifteen seconds it'll be crawling with malware... " he's right to an extent. and you are right to the extent that its easy to fix. WE'RE ALL RIGHT! just pointing that out

no one is speaking bollocks here.

Martyn · Post by **Martyn** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 12:54 am

I take your point but didn't misread either of you, the 'crawling with malware' thing was a gross exaggeration you've got to admit. I'm not entirely sure that Ad-aware 'free' doesn't actually place a few unwanteds in your system to 'find' so you buy the big version, dunno what it's like these days, someone told me not to trust it a while back. I always use Spybot which has served me well for a number of years.

It's all much of a muchness really, which was all I was trying to say, it's easy to get paranoid about such things when they really don't present much of a problem or danger. It's not a good idea to have your main machine connected to the net anyway on any platform, I have an old 700mhz athlon machine for that.

If you're really paranoid about internet problems, and you use a separate PC for it, there's nothing stopping you using Linux. It's free, has blindingly good software for the task (also free) and is also UNIX based, so just as immune to virusses as OSX. I'm planning on doing that myself soon, but keep putting it off out of laziness.

Apologies if I sounded a bit snappy back there, it's amazing how a lack of nicotine can equate to an extreme lack of tact

Cheers all

Martyn · Post by **Martyn** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 2:19 am

On the subject of spyware removal tools, this is worth a read.

http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,a ... g,1,00.asp

MarkH · Post by **MarkH** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 9:49 am

AdamJay wrote:the instant you put an XP machine on the internet without all the security updates (which take at least 10 minutes to get on a broadband connection), your machine is attacked.

Adam - Funny you mention this. Last week I gave mama my old Dell P4 GX260 and did a fresh install of XP Home, MS Office, and I had to install her AOL 9.0 software before taking 13 hours to download SP2 from Microsoft. Her machine kept popping up with Spyware detection and said there were 10 spyware apps detected. I couldn't believe it. Thankfully I convinced her to switch to Cable Modem this week. No more 13 hour downloads!

Toneroll - You're missing the point. I have a Powerbook 1.5, G5 2x2Ghz, Dell Dimension 4600 P4/2.4, and a Dell Latitude 1.8Ghz. It doesn't matter which machine I'm running Live on, optimization is the pits. Whether I'm running Logic on the 2x2Ghz or Nuendo on the Dell, they both smoke the heck out of Live. It's just a matter of Ableton putting forth a valid effort, which I see as part of their due-diligence. Buying faster machines to bring Live up to par is just a band aid fix.

AdamJay · Post by **AdamJay** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 10:04 am

MarkH wrote:Buying faster machines to bring Live up to par is just a band aid fix.

and it would still PCs even more effecient for Live, dollar for dollar.

MarkH · Post by **MarkH** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 10:36 am

AdamJay wrote:and it would still PCs even more effecient for Live, dollar for dollar.

Yeah, so what. That's not the point. The point is people want confidence in knowing the developers of their chosen DAW have put forth the best efforts possible to provide the greatest value for their money - which includes stability and performance. When users sense a company has not done this (for whatever reason) it raises a lot of questions. The only baseline we have is to compare one DAW against another, and Live comes in last place in terms of performance. I think the part that bothers a lot of users is that it is so obvious to them yet Ableton denies there is a difference in performance between Live and the next DAW running the same plugins.

AdamJay · Post by **AdamJay** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 10:43 am

no, it is the point.
it shouldn't be a financial burden to own a mac and get good performance with your choice application. So many people bag on macs because there's a smaller base of applications available (though not applicable in terms of daw hosts). But Live IS available for mac, though the way it performs for demanding users like many of us are, it might as well not be available for mac. Because alot of us switched to PC to get what we wanted out of it.

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 11:59 am

AdamJay wrote:no, it is the point.
it shouldn't be a financial burden to own a mac and get good performance with your choice application. So many people bag on macs because there's a smaller base of applications available (though not applicable in terms of daw hosts). But Live IS available for mac, though the way it performs for demanding users like many of us are, it might as well not be available for mac. Because alot of us switched to PC to get what we wanted out of it.

hear, hear. Saying that money isn't the issue is SOOOO coming from people for whom money IS no object. But we can't all afford to buy big-ass dual-g5s in order to get the same PERFORMANCE that we get with our cheap-ass centrinos.... and why should we? I love macs, they look great, feel great, and they have that bling-bling thing going for them.

The thing is: I don't care. A lot of people do, which is great. I just .. don't. It's apples and oranges, really

Andreas.

noisetonepause · Post by **noisetonepause** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 12:08 pm

Machinate wrote:LOL! -- Ahem, dude [band quibble] try doing half the shit I do on my dinged up IBM on your ibook. Not gonna happen, mate.. And I've already told you the graphics issue was user error

Yeah well mine's smaller than yours!!

(I'll get me coat)

-Paws

Machinate · Post by **Machinate** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 12:11 pm

noisetonepause wrote:
Machinate wrote:LOL! -- Ahem, dude [band quibble] try doing half the shit I do on my dinged up IBM on your ibook. Not gonna happen, mate.. And I've already told you the graphics issue was user error
Yeah well mine's smaller than yours!!

(I'll get me coat)

-Paws

Bwarharrharrharr!!!

j · Post by j » Sun Nov 21, 2004 7:34 pm

MarkH said

"The point is people want confidence in knowing the developers of their chosen DAW have put forth the best efforts possible to provide the greatest value for their money - which includes stability and performance. When users sense a company has not done this (for whatever reason) it raises a lot of questions. The only baseline we have is to compare one DAW against another, and Live comes in last place in terms of performance. I think the part that bothers a lot of users is that it is so obvious to them yet Ableton denies there is a difference in performance between Live and the next DAW running the same plugins."

That's it right there.

It's strange that Live is such a great example of "good design", and yet this major flaw.

j

iskandar · Post by **iskandar** » Sun Nov 21, 2004 10:37 pm

powerbooks still use 5400 Rpm hard disks

i dont see how you can say they are better for auido applications...

The End

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Mon Nov 22, 2004 6:28 am

iskandar wrote:powerbooks still use 5400 Rpm hard disks

i dont see how you can say they are better for auido applications...

The End

The speed of the hard disk, or amount of RAM is the absolute worst way to judge the usefulness of a laptop, anybody who put any amount of thought into this would come to the same conclusion.

CPU, price, OS, the stability of the particular brand and model of laptop with audio applications, and real world experience.... these are good reasons to argue for one VS the other.

BigGreen · Post by **BigGreen** » Mon Nov 22, 2004 7:33 am

AdamJay wrote:as you are in Canada, i'd go for the Compaq R3320CA for $1699 Canadian from HP/Compaq.
Athlon 64 3000, 512MB, 60GB hd, Superdrive (DVDRW/CDRW), 802.11b/g Wifi, XP Home, etc.

www.hp.ca

its the same guts as my HP zv5000z, which is the same as the Compaq R3000z. But for some reason in Canada, HP/Compaq equips the HP's all with Intel CPU's and the Compaq's 90% with AMD cpu's.

i get great battery life, and mucho power for ableton live.

considering you're in Vancouver, if you can get or use an address in Seattle and order from HP US, i'd go with the HPzv5000z or CompaqR3000z. same specs, costs less, and you can make a custom order (faster cpu, etc.)

Yeah man, I just ordered that exact comp today from Compusmart here on vancouver island. It is being advertised on futureshops website for 1599. CAD. I just can't wait to see.

It's funny how insecure Mac guys can get eh. It's like guys with small packages. They always gotta be sayin "it's what you do with it. whatever. I guess I have an obsession with "performance" LOL

Machinesworking · Post by **Machinesworking** » Mon Nov 22, 2004 8:48 am

BigGreen wrote:It's funny how insecure Mac guys can get eh. It's like guys with small packages. They always gotta be sayin "it's what you do with it. whatever. I guess I have an obsession with "performance" LOL

You graduate grade school dude? or did you have an accident at work?