jomox vs elektron?

[rikhyray]

^^^ hmmm a jomox sounds like a 909 who cares about a 909 drum sound those days unless you make trance and progressive a la 92' - 94'

Sorry this is such BS, I dont give a fuck about tarnce or how/if Jomox compares to roland - I would rather get shot then hear anything of what you mention or any beaten to death electronica with overused vintage rolands.
Jomox sounds great, easier and more reliable use then any vintage stuff, but real advantage is to use it as it is and not what it might remind of, perhaps the most important let you create, tune BD like nothing else.
Unlike the BD only module, the full Jomox let you tune and tailor the BD sound like nothing else, the best part is to do it at the end of production, instead of EQing,FXing and what not, you can go to the source sound, which in real world would mean getting the drummer back, do drum, mic placing again etc,etc. Having few dials under your hands (that is advantage over 1 dial module) let you change, adjust in seconds what would take hours in regular way. just for that BD jomox is worth it, the rest could be seen as a bonus.
Machine drum is great too, compact, easy to take to gigs, it is digital but much more practical for musical use then software. Both are so different that comparing makes no sense-different sound, music, application. Try and listen, get both if you can but if I would have to choose only one then definitely Jomox because there is no way to get that sound and flexibility with any other soft or hardware. Think what your needs are but above all listen before you buy.

[Sibanger]

Yeah that DSI / Linn thing is gonna be a while by the looks of things . . . I wouldn't wait as they have had no new info up for, like, forever now. .

I also think that the UI on the MD compared to Ableton is a joke.

i know it's hardware and probably very good and all that. However somehting that i can do in less than a minute in Live takes a fair bit longer on the MD.

I really, really don't rate it and am probably going to sell mine in the near future. i thought it was alright untill i started transferring stuff I had done on it over the last year or so into Live and was astounded by how awful the drums sounded. . .

Go and listen to them both before you buy em.
And if you are thinking about an M bass or whatever, why not just get one, sample the hell out of it and then run the sample live. The XOX boxes are very limited and if you had a bit of time and patience you could get a usable sampkle set from them.

I am still surprised that UA haven't done a XOX box for the UAD1 yet. They would sell bucketloads of those cards. Still we have been waiting for the UAD fatso for a year or so. . .

So TS,
When you say you get better results using Live than say MD, are you using Live's Drum Racks?
Do you use samples from your hardware(MD or other), Live's 'Drum Machines' or other libraries?

You sound like you know your drums, and I would like to know a little more about your approach, if you wouldn't mind.

Thanks,
Si

Sorry OP for being OT.

[diskowipe]

machinedrum is something that is often misunderstood as a drum machine i think. mainly because people buy it expecting some amazingly fat analog sounding drumsynth and it's just not really that... it can be if you take the time, but as many have said here, the overall sound of the machines is very cold and cheap out of the box.

i realized it was time to part with my beloved Sps-1 mk2UW when i found myself doing the same things in the software domain and leaving it turned off most of the time. for me, i don't really care how amazing the sequencer is and all the crazy lfo routings, if i spend that much on an instrument it's purely for sonic benefit as im not looking to replace my computer as the main tool...

i traded it in for an RME fireface 800 and that was a good decision for my recordings...

i'd also like to add that my jomox and dsi gear will never leave my setup as they definitely have the sound characteristics that warrant spending money on hardware

[porfiry]

So TS,
When you say you get better results using Live than say MD, are you using Live's Drum Racks?
Do you use samples from your hardware(MD or other), Live's 'Drum Machines' or other libraries?

You sound like you know your drums, and I would like to know a little more about your approach, if you wouldn't mind.

Thanks,
Si

Sorry OP for being OT.

Apologies for needling in, but I'm kind of excited about what I've been doing in an attempt to tame my drooling lust for a Machinedrum. I recently bought a padKONTROL, and have been making a 16-voice all-Operator drum rack. The 16 "modules" are simply instrument racks inside the drum rack, each with one Operator set to do certain things and mapped to the instrument racks' macros. After the Operator there are two banks of effects racks in each chain, which I stole from the defeq Machinedrum sample pack ( http://www.defeq.com/wp/2008/08/29/elek ... mple-pack/ <<- this in itself is a not-nearly-as-flexible-yet-still-excellent substitute for a MD ).

When you take a rack like this and play it with a padKONTROL, you get total velocity sensitivity on the fly...you can bust out a couple measures of very nuanced beat in about 10 seconds, instead of diddling around with a step sequencer, going back and adding accents, etc. You also get the flexibility of being able to put whatever kinds of modules you want into any note slot...if you want a rack of nothing but kicks or snares or bleeps or whatever, no problem. And of course you have essentially unlimited storage for your presets/kits/effects/whatever.

Operator has godlike power, and a die-hard knob twiddler could sure buy a lot of multipurpose midi controllers for the price of a Machinedrum.

None of which is to say I won't buy a bunch of hardware drum machines someday.

[Zky]

Kind of an odd comparison.

MD and 808/909 are very different. Yes there is some cross over, but if you really want 808/909 sounds, then you want the real thing,

err..i didnt say that i wanted to emulate 808/909, i already have a well done sample bank made by myself form both rolands on my mpc..

just checking opinions on wich of both drum machines would you choose,,talking about the machines itself..on their own capabilities..because i would like to add a nice drum machine to my studio set up

seems that the jomox have better presence on a mix,,and machinedrum seems more for percussion fx..would be great to have both

so far the jomox seems better choice for solid drums..

[interpolate]

For super experimental stuff... that machinedrum has a devil inside of it.

Basically comes with the territory of being able to record and manipulate about 32 tracks of automation at a time on all the instruments at once.

Srsly man.. that MD is crazy.

[tw1nstates]

Yeah that DSI / Linn thing is gonna be a while by the looks of things . . . I wouldn't wait as they have had no new info up for, like, forever now. .

I also think that the UI on the MD compared to Ableton is a joke.

i know it's hardware and probably very good and all that. However somehting that i can do in less than a minute in Live takes a fair bit longer on the MD.

I really, really don't rate it and am probably going to sell mine in the near future. i thought it was alright untill i started transferring stuff I had done on it over the last year or so into Live and was astounded by how awful the drums sounded. . .

Go and listen to them both before you buy em.
And if you are thinking about an M bass or whatever, why not just get one, sample the hell out of it and then run the sample live. The XOX boxes are very limited and if you had a bit of time and patience you could get a usable sampkle set from them.

I am still surprised that UA haven't done a XOX box for the UAD1 yet. They would sell bucketloads of those cards. Still we have been waiting for the UAD fatso for a year or so. . .

So TS,
When you say you get better results using Live than say MD, are you using Live's Drum Racks?
Do you use samples from your hardware(MD or other), Live's 'Drum Machines' or other libraries?

You sound like you know your drums, and I would like to know a little more about your approach, if you wouldn't mind.

Thanks,
Si

Sorry OP for being OT.

hey sorry, took a while to reply to this one.

For drums I have a few different racks I have put together that split the kick up, compress etc so they can be tweaked to case 9secret weapon is a lil distortion from Amplitube's ampeg sim on the lower frequencies sometimes the higher ones. . ).
To be honest though i quite often end up replacing the kick when I get to a final mixdown with something sampled. not always but i happens as i'll be checking against something i like and i know sounds fat on a big system and often the operator / 808 / 909 kicks just don't quite cut it. Saying that however i think some of hte time it\'s been a comparable level thing as well as )dbs is 0 dbs or minus 6 or whatever you are using as a yardstick.

For other drums I use battery a lot for metal works, so hats, cymbals etc. I also have bfd but I haven't had great results with that yet, it's a recent purchase and i am trying to get it to play with the basic XOX sounds to make techno / deep house etc.

i listened to some of th eVengance samples recently and was amazed ho awful they are. A lo of ppl on forums 9not here but other ones) really rate em. i thought they were awful!

Other drums, I have got a neat lil sound bank called lifted drums which is just samples. I also use a lot audio realisms adm drum machine, often with something else 10 dbs or so below so that it's not just straight XOX sounds, Stylus gets a look in a lot as does Microtonic, although I often use that for pitched percussive sounds and wierdness. I think it's more flexible than the MD and sounds as good.

The MD, meh. It's sitting opposite me at the moment and is not even getting a look in on the few things I am currently working on. I just picked up a metasonix KV 100 so I might try running it through that before I ebay it.

I got the waldorf attack a while back and used it once Didn't find it was that great sounding. ..

Also use Kontakt 2/3 a lot as well as storm drum, colossus and a few other sample sets. there is a good XOX one called Gold tape or summat I recall. Think he also sampled several other types of drum machines as well. . .

Hope that helps?

[Nick the Zombie]

I prefer the Elektron MachineDrum, because of it's awesome superplayable interface on top of the amazing sonic spectrum it has. I would highly recommend Elektron to never make a software version out of any of their instruments, ever.

Big +1 on this.

[Sibanger]

Yeah that DSI / Linn thing is gonna be a while by the looks of things . . . I wouldn't wait as they have had no new info up for, like, forever now. .

I also think that the UI on the MD compared to Ableton is a joke.

i know it's hardware and probably very good and all that. However somehting that i can do in less than a minute in Live takes a fair bit longer on the MD.

I really, really don't rate it and am probably going to sell mine in the near future. i thought it was alright untill i started transferring stuff I had done on it over the last year or so into Live and was astounded by how awful the drums sounded. . .

Go and listen to them both before you buy em.
And if you are thinking about an M bass or whatever, why not just get one, sample the hell out of it and then run the sample live. The XOX boxes are very limited and if you had a bit of time and patience you could get a usable sampkle set from them.

I am still surprised that UA haven't done a XOX box for the UAD1 yet. They would sell bucketloads of those cards. Still we have been waiting for the UAD fatso for a year or so. . .

So TS,
When you say you get better results using Live than say MD, are you using Live's Drum Racks?
Do you use samples from your hardware(MD or other), Live's 'Drum Machines' or other libraries?

You sound like you know your drums, and I would like to know a little more about your approach, if you wouldn't mind.

Thanks,
Si

Sorry OP for being OT.

hey sorry, took a while to reply to this one.

For drums I have a few different racks I have put together that split the kick up, compress etc so they can be tweaked to case 9secret weapon is a lil distortion from Amplitube's ampeg sim on the lower frequencies sometimes the higher ones. . ).
To be honest though i quite often end up replacing the kick when I get to a final mixdown with something sampled. not always but i happens as i'll be checking against something i like and i know sounds fat on a big system and often the operator / 808 / 909 kicks just don't quite cut it. Saying that however i think some of hte time it\'s been a comparable level thing as well as )dbs is 0 dbs or minus 6 or whatever you are using as a yardstick.

For other drums I use battery a lot for metal works, so hats, cymbals etc. I also have bfd but I haven't had great results with that yet, it's a recent purchase and i am trying to get it to play with the basic XOX sounds to make techno / deep house etc.

i listened to some of th eVengance samples recently and was amazed ho awful they are. A lo of ppl on forums 9not here but other ones) really rate em. i thought they were awful!

Other drums, I have got a neat lil sound bank called lifted drums which is just samples. I also use a lot audio realisms adm drum machine, often with something else 10 dbs or so below so that it's not just straight XOX sounds, Stylus gets a look in a lot as does Microtonic, although I often use that for pitched percussive sounds and wierdness. I think it's more flexible than the MD and sounds as good.

The MD, meh. It's sitting opposite me at the moment and is not even getting a look in on the few things I am currently working on. I just picked up a metasonix KV 100 so I might try running it through that before I ebay it.

I got the waldorf attack a while back and used it once Didn't find it was that great sounding. ..

Also use Kontakt 2/3 a lot as well as storm drum, colossus and a few other sample sets. there is a good XOX one called Gold tape or summat I recall. Think he also sampled several other types of drum machines as well. . .

Hope that helps?

Thanks for your reply TS.

there is a good XOX one called Gold tape or summat I recall

Gold Baby maybe? I think that's a pretty good x0x drum sample collection.

Layering up with the ADM sounds like fun. Do you do this with the kicks only?

Cheers

[timothyallan]

I've had a MDUW sitting next to me for almost 3 months now. I know the thing inside and out, but can never get anything I make in it to sit right in any of my tracks.

I think you almost need to make a certain style of music to be able to get the MD to work for you. I'm glad I never bought it and got to borrow one instead. Funnily enough, the guy I borrowed it off is in no rush for it back as he doesn't use it much either... and he makes techno fwiw.

[tw1nstates]

Yes mate, it's the Gold Baby one.

I tend not to do it with the kicks as much as the hats and snrs and claps and so on ( I do but then i always end up ditching them as detailed earlier).

Am working on stg at the moment which has quite a nice clap that I made from Stylus (very short envelope) into sonalksis eq taking out a db or so in the mid into the Snr punch fx fack which is then multed with a tr 505 clap from battery into saturation and URS channel strip pro's compresor to give it some groove and a lil 12.5 khz (db or so).

One really really useful thing I learnt was from mixing with your mind where Stav is talking about the use of compressors and how to set them properly so that they make the music groove rather than just compressing. Honestly I can't recommend that book enough. . . That will do your tracks more good than any drum machine or sample set and it's muh cheaper.

Another thing tyou can try is eq'ing (boosting) into a limiter. If you have a kick that isn't so fat or the way you want it sounding this can be a way of gettgin a bit of extra oomph (again a lil distortion goes a long way also) but to be honest I reckon the old rule of make everything else and sample your kicks still works as good if not a bit better. . .

if you think about it a lot of the kicks that you hear will have been sampled and processed several times n this seems to give them a fairly monolithic quality! I just went back to compare and at equal levels the 5 or so that I have in my lifted drums folder that I use are way better than anything I have made myself. Loads punchier, even the 'softer' ones. . .

Just look for decent stuff on big labels (cos they will have paid for decent mastering) and if there are any kicks on their own then nab em. . . )

@Timonthy, yes, I honestly don't get the hype around those things. When you AB them they are crappy sounding, and a load of money for what they are. . .But each to their own, i'd def say try before you buy and try to do some comparisons. . .

[Sibanger]

Thanks for the insight TS.

Am working on stg at the moment which has quite a nice clap that I made from Stylus (very short envelope) into sonalksis eq taking out a db or so in the mid into the Snr punch fx fack which is then multed with a tr 505 clap from battery into saturation and URS channel strip pro's compresor to give it some groove and a lil 12.5 khz (db or so).

I'm losing you on the "into the Snr punch fx fack which is then multed with a ......" bit.

One really really useful thing I learnt was from mixing with your mind where Stav is talking about the use of compressors and how to set them properly so that they make the music groove rather than just compressing. Honestly I can't recommend that book enough. . . That will do your tracks more good than any drum machine or sample set and it's muh cheaper.

I've heard that Stavs 'Mixing with your mind' is the shit.
I will grab a copy and read up on his unique approach.

Cheers

[tw1nstates]

it's wicked!

best book on music I have read.

[33tetragammon]

Really the ESX is the best bang for the buck hardware drum machine for versatility.

The LFO can be made into a spare envelope to control the pitch "kick" effect on raw waves.

Plus, you've got endless variety via samples...

this i can see, because you are not stuck with just the sounds it comes with... plus the UI on the korgs is superb.

yes,the Electribe SX is amazing.i love it!!!!!
time for Korg to produce a new version of it,a major kick-ass electribe SX on galactic steroids,more refined.it's been almost 6 years......

but kick ass anyday,especially with that awesome Kaosspad 3.

yes,this is VERY off-topic,i know.......forgive me.....

[interpolate]

I made an album in Feb that was all MD+Virus, no samples or anything else.

Quite an enjoyable experience. I had no problems integrating the MD into my setup with Ableton, or getting things to sit in the mix. Everything was done in 32 bit and came out squeaky clean. I kinda found out what kinda drums I liked after beginning to see patterns in all the kits I made (no pun intended).

The music is experimental but if would help you make a decision, send me a PM and I'll let you have a listen.