Bit Rate Debate

[funky shit]

Not a lot of audio devices are 32bit anyway, are they?

[danoworks]

Thanks everyone for your input. I think I may just leave things at 24 for my live performance files and re-record at 32 the ones I select for my CD just to ease my mind that I got the best I could get. My favorite response was from hurlingdervish.
And no I'm not a robot....

[SubFunk]

you are so screwed with your technical wank.

sorry for that, but sometimes it's annoying me, maybe because i work in the audio field and can't be bothered anymore with those endless discussions and then people make and mix shit in 89732 mega pops that sounds like poo, because of THEM not because 23 vs 39982765 mega pops.

sorry again, but i just had again that experience yesterday, i was at electronic beats, great venue (tempodrom in berlin, good room acoustics!) donna summer (don't laugh i had free tickets) and i met a guy from pool sound there (the best and biggest sound company in germany and the one that supplied the PA) he is system engineer and really does know his shit, very good guy in his field, a VDOSC system PA (over 15 years old system still one of the best PAs on the market) a digico D5 console (no comment, it's top class stuff!) top outboard, SPL, TC, etc.

it sounded like shit, it was sooo horrorfying, reason: the guy behind the desk: FAIL! utter fail.
maybe because he used smaart (i hate it!) and was looking at graphs and numbers instead of listening!!!
and he even had a system engineer (who has taken half of his work away... what a luxury and still the result sucked)

any half decent FOH mixer could have gotten a better sound with a crap turbosound or behringer PA.

sorry for the rant, but that scenario applies all to often to studio work and all that gear wanking, etc. as well...

sorry for the rant, but i was sooo annoyed yesterday. damn.


p.s. i don't know which software or computers they used, but apparently ALL of there computer systems failed at once halfway through and there was a break because of that LOL.

[Tarekith]

32 bit files have the same dynamic range as 24bit files, the extra 8 bits are just there in case you go over 0dBFS. Quick and simple answer.

I'd doubt ANYONE can hear the difference between 24 and 32 bit.

don't think so Mr. T.

by your logic 24 bit files have no headroom?

proportionally they have the same amount of headroom.

even by your definition 32 bit files have more dynamic range, headroom is counted in dynamic range because it's the range of values the audio level can have.

I was under the impression from various reads that a 24bit file and a 32bit both use 24 bits of precision (ie, approx 144dB), however the 32bit file uses the extra 8 bits as part of the floating point calculations. It's these extra 8 bits of FP processing that can allow you to technically go over 0dBFS without clipping. I'm basing this off of information from threads like this:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/masterin ... float.html

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/masterin ... jects.html

I fully admit I'm no math whiz though (the word cosine makes me run for the hills), so if my laymans explanation is lacking somehow, I'd love some clarification.

[dave999z]

if you're recording at 24-bit, you have 2^24 possible volume levels for each sample.

if you're recording at 32-bit, you have 2^32 possible volume levels for each sample.

32-bit floating point system is more efficient, in that it only uses longer words if it has to. *If* the volume level happens to fall in between two of the volumes that are available via a 24-bit word (and your signal chain and ADC can reliably convey that), then the word will contain extra bits as necessary to capture that nuance.

that's my understanding anyway. probably wrong.

[ethios4]

+1 SubFunk

[SubFunk]

+1 SubFunk

yeah, sorry again if it is slightly off topic (actually it is not), but it really annoys the hell out of me.

i needed to vent.

[McQ714]

so who's the guy that actually voted yes???

[aqua_tek]

32 bit sounds warmer when i master with my zebra

[McQ714]

can't we use more RAM if we record at 32-bit? when will Live be able to record at 64-bit?

[Tarekith]

can't we use more RAM if we record at 32-bit? when will Live be able to record at 64-bit?

You're mixing up two different things. Once is processing resolution (ie, Live's 64-bit audio engine), and the other is a storage format (ie, 24bit wav, 32bit floating point wav, etc).

[chris vine]

+2 subfunk

it comes down to ears in the end - or even in the beginning.

The tech specs fill in the knowledge gaps later......IMHO of course.......... although I have changed methods after reading technical articles at times.

[McQ714]

can't we use more RAM if we record at 32-bit? when will Live be able to record at 64-bit?

You're mixing up two different things. Once is processing resolution (ie, Live's 64-bit audio engine), and the other is a storage format (ie, 24bit wav, 32bit floating point wav, etc).

i was joking!!!

where's Fun Fun Friday???

[SubFunk]

+2 subfunk

it comes down to ears in the end - or even in the beginning.

The tech specs fill in the knowledge gaps later......IMHO of course.......... although I have changed methods after reading technical articles at times.

don't get me wrong, technical knowledge and also the quality and technical specs of equipment do make a difference of what we can achieve sonically, sure thing, i just needed to vent, because all to often for to many people it seems technical issues are coming before they even reached the maximum with what they can actually achieve simply via using there damn god given ears and to train them properly first...

we are all to spoiled. drifting into technical wanking rather then developing skills with what we got.

end of rant (pt2)

[chris vine]

Venting is good for yr health anyway.
Best, C