MIDI Question: Can you have both, digital (USB) and analog

[Halycon]

Is it possible to have both Analog, and Digital forms of MIDI running thorugh a PC? The reason I ask is that I am unable to use any USB based controller at the sametime I'm using the analog 5 prong running to the back of a keyboard, into my interface. Is this not a possibility, or is it just perhaps my drivers conflicting with each other? Thanks for the help guys, always appreciate it here!

[Tone Deft]

there's only one form of MIDI, it's very much like a 32kbaud modem standard, read the wikipedia page to read about it.

something else is going on.

make sure you're not creating a midi loop, that would be when midi goes out of Live, into an external keyboard, which sends the midi back into Live, which sends the midi out of Live and into the keyboard, which sends the midi back into Live, which sends the midi out of Live and into the keyboard, which sends the midi back into Live, which sends the midi out of Live and into the keyboard, which sends the midi back into Live, which sends the midi out of Live and into the keyboard, which sends the midi back into Live, which sends the midi out of Live and into the keyboard, which sends the midi back into Live, which sends the midi out of Live and into the keyboard, which sends the midi back into Live, which sends the midi out of Live and into the keyboard...

... and locks up Live.

[Halycon]

While I'm appreciative of you replying to this thread, I'm not quite sure you answered my question. In fact there are 2 forms of "transfer" for MIDI, and those happen to be digital, and analog. My question still remains, is it possible to have both running at the same time? Has anyone else experienced this issue?

[arachnaut]

... In fact there are 2 forms of "transfer" for MIDI, and those happen to be digital, and analog. My question still remains, is it possible to have both running at the same time? Has anyone else experienced this issue?

What do you mean by '2 forms of transfer' of MIDI?

MIDI is a 5 wire analog signal of a digital communications loop protocol. It's been that way since the 1980's.

By transfer do you mean encapsulation? Such as MIDI over USB, in DirectX, etc? There are more than 2 types of these...

At any rate, you can have multiple MIDI ports and channelize MIDI networks in multiple ways, depending on your software and hardware capabilities.

Maybe if you describe what you are trying to do we can understand it better.

I used to have a MIDI patch bay that let me wire in multiple MIDI setups and the software I was using let me save performance groups and all the patches at a keystroke. (This was Dr. T's XOR software for the Atari way way back).

If you want to simulate multiple MIDI 'wires' you can program your devices to respond only to unique MIDI channels. You could have 16 independent, simultaneous, bi-directional MIDI transfers of data.

[arachnaut]

Is it possible to have both Analog, and Digital forms of MIDI running thorugh a PC? The reason I ask is that I am unable to use any USB based controller at the sametime I'm using the analog 5 prong running to the back of a keyboard, into my interface. Is this not a possibility, or is it just perhaps my drivers conflicting with each other? Thanks for the help guys, always appreciate it here!

I have an Axiom 61 and an Axiom 25. I can plug the Axiom 25 into the external MIDI port of the Axiom 61 and use both keyboards over one USB connection.

I used this in MIDI OMNI mode, so all the notes sent go to all devices, but there are ways to select one MIDI channel for each device, and you can even split the keyboards into MIDI channel zones. This can simulate a large number of distinct keyboards each controlling an independent set of devices.

[Halycon]

Jim, thanks for the reply. You asked about a more in-depth explanation of my set up and the issue, so let give a bit of insight to whats happening.

Im running a Desktop PC on Windows XP Home, with an EMU 1616 Interface (w/ 5 prong analog connections), and Ableton Live 7.1 as my DAW and MIDI receiver.

Ive got my Korg R3 keyboard that is 5 wire, and USB capable for MIDI, however I'm running it through the 5 prong from the keyboard to the inerface. Now I have a freshly new Korg NanoPAD that only offers a USB connection, that once plugged in, and drivers installed, i get no readings from Live's MIDI indicator. I've gone into settings to make sure all the MIDI preferences were set up right, and they were. I hope that information helps, but from what I took away from your post, it is possible to share both USB Midi, and 5 prong midi to the system. So that helps me alot, thanks!

[Palmer Eldritch]

Hi Halycon,

It is not a question of analog versus digital.
The question is, if ableton supports two midi interfaces at the same time cause the midi in/outs of your audio interface are one midi interface and the korg nanoPAD is another midi interface. (keep in mind that you maybe will have several ports per midi interface).

The answer if live supports more then one midi interface is yes.

When you open abletons preferences and check the midi/sync tab you should see a list of all available midi ports (at the top the input ports and below the output ports). In your case you should see the (midi) port(s) of your EMU 1616 and the port(s) of your nanoPAD.
If you do not see -for example- your nanoPAD then I think there is something wrong with the driver (maybe a conflict). But unfortunately then I can not help further cause I do not know much about windows OS (see my specs in signature)

Cheers, p.e.

[arachnaut]

...

Im running a Desktop PC on Windows XP Home, with an EMU 1616 Interface (w/ 5 prong analog connections), and Ableton Live 7.1 as my DAW and MIDI receiver.

...

Theoretically what you want to do is possible, but there may be limits in the software drivers, configurations, etc.

You should search for MIDI-OX and download it (and MIDI Yoke from the same place). These are free and essential MIDI diagnostic tools.

MIDI-OX will show you what MIDI data Windows will receive from your gear and allow you to make many interesting and useful MIDI connections.

I always use it to solve MIDI problems. You can set up pass through monitoring of all the MIDI data, set up filters, and do simplistic MIDI message modifications among many other possibilities.

MIDI Yoke allows you to have multiple MIDI channels so you can create an output from one track in Live and pass it into another Live track input (for example).

[oddstep]

I think the that installation of the korg's midi drivers has banjaxed something in windows. I've had similar problems with usb devices in the past. I think my solution was to blindly meddle with stuff in Control Panel, (un)install drivers and keep on untill I got my own way.

[Halycon]

Thanks for all the support guys! I wanted to come back here and share my end results with those who may have this issue int he future. It was most definitly a conflict with the drivers (wether from my current audio drivers, or 3rd party software, not sure which one). I was in need of reformatting my harddrive anyways, so this made a perfect time to do so. After a fresh, clean installation of Windows, and before installing my EMU interface drivers and software, I made sure that i installed the USB Audio Device driver before hand this go around. Installed it successfully, and it was found, then installed my EMU interface software, and Live was able to recognize both the 5 prong connections from the interface, as well as the USB midi device, simultaneously. Def an issue with software, and not a question of wether using both at the same time is possible or not... b/c it is. Thanks again for all the help and feedback! best