Ableton, it's just a big tease for DJ's...?

robbmasters · Post by **robbmasters** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:42 pm

bensuthers wrote:I don't understand. just type in a new number into the loop start, or length. it will do it in real time. you can jump all over the audio no problems. if you don't want to type in a number, use the arrow keys.

In my experience, this doesn't work in the way I would want.

For example, when I move the start (or end) position, Live's play head seems to instantly jump to the point that it would be at if that had been the start (or end) point all along. What I want is it to ignore anything I do with the loop start (or end) point until it actually hits the loop end point - when it would simply jump to the loop start point.

But more than this, I think CD deck style loop controls (i.e. where you press a button to mark the current playback position as the loop start point in realtime, and then press another for the loop end point) would be useful - and again more live!

2kilo · Post by **2kilo** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:43 pm

I don't understand. just type in a new number into the loop start, or length. it will do it in real time. you can jump all over the audio no problems. if you don't want to type in a number, use the arrow keys.

I've found it moves the play head position around in an unpredictable manner...? and jumps...? Try this

Image having a clip set to 95bmp and one set to 120bpm. When you jump from one to the other Lives tempo with change... Crossfade cut between bpm's...

bensuthers · Post by **bensuthers** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:54 pm

re: loop offset moving when you move loop positions to retain current position in file

I for one agree with you here. I wish this was a 'preferenced' behaviour.

> I think CD deck style loop controls (i.e. where you press a button to
> mark the current playback position as the loop start point in realtime,
> and then press another for the loop end point) would be useful - and
> again more live!

do you own reaktor?

there are many loop recording ensembles that emulate this behaviour.

..but I fail to see what is gained by emulating CDJ behaviour. Just use the CDJ!

likewise with Traktor behaviour. Just use Traktor!

2kilo · Post by **2kilo** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:55 pm

@StompJ

The reason behind my outpourings is the frustration at looking at raw potential not quite realised in Live and I do give the Traktor forum and NI a good bash for the exact same reason...

StompyJ · Post by **StompyJ** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:58 pm

2Kilo:

cool

I know I seem like I don't want Live to change at all, but its not that, I just reallllly want Live to keep forging its path as a new, live instrument, as opposed to kinda retreading too much functionality found in other products.

I'm just really looking to use this to do some new and different things, I'm not saying you're not, but I guess we want different things from Live

2kilo · Post by **2kilo** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:58 pm

Just use the CDJ!
likewise with Traktor behaviour. Just use Traktor!

coz we wants it all....

bensuthers · Post by **bensuthers** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:02 pm

2kilo,

I can only see a couple of things that you can't do;

you're unable to modify the global tempo from within a clip envelope.

you are frustrated by the loop offset moving when you move the loop around.

but it seems like all of the other behaviors are there in live - they're just not laid out like you want them....

robbmasters · Post by **robbmasters** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:09 pm

bensuthers wrote:I fail to see what is gained by emulating CDJ behaviour. Just use the CDJ!

likewise with Traktor behaviour. Just use Traktor!

Well I'd rather not have to carry a pair of CDJs, a mixer and a box or two of CDs as well as my laptop, controller, soundcard and effects!

And I'm sure many people would rather not have to *buy* a pair of CDJs, a mixer as well as their laptop, etc.

Similarly for Traktor (well the buying bit anyway).

But the biggest reason is that I want to be able to do all the stuff Live *can* do as well as CDJ style looping. If I use the CDJ or Traktor, I lose Live's functionality. I realise that I could have the CDJ as a Live input and maybe even rewire Traktor into Live, but I still won't be able to do everything I could do with an audio file in Live to those sources AND it's a whole heap more complicated - especially when you've got to get your gear conected to whatever greets you at the venue...

StompyJ · Post by **StompyJ** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:12 pm

is traktor a rewire client?

ryansupak · Post by **ryansupak** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:12 pm

i'd like to see audio playback become more malleable as well. here's a discussion i started about aspects of this a while back:

http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic. ... =scratcher

robbmasters · Post by **robbmasters** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:21 pm

StompyJ wrote:is traktor a rewire client?

Dunno. That's why I said "maybe". Don't have it. Don't want it.

But if not, then that's not even an option. So that would be another reason not to want to use Traktor for that kind of thing...

2kilo · Post by **2kilo** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:21 pm

but it seems like all of the other behaviors are there in live - they're just not laid out like you want them....

most behaviors are there, yes, but often not in a manner that is not flexible or creative for performing with Live live... Thats the tease, why sling just a crossfader in for DJ's while not giving them the other tools they kinda expect as normal...?

2kilo · Post by **2kilo** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:25 pm

is traktor a rewire client?

nope it has this nutter thing going on with IP address style networking...
not really looked at that pref box much.... networks aaarrrgghhh

noisetonepause · Post by **noisetonepause** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:50 pm

It's called Open Sound Control - OSC.

Which'd be fantastic, if more apps used it. I don't think it's more difficult to use than MIDI, but I've not much experience with, really, as the only one of my (two) apps that uses it is Reaktor.

-Paws

2kilo · Post by **2kilo** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 6:05 pm

It's called Open Sound Control - OSC.

been looking at the prefs, seems Traktor and Intakt could work together, Traktor can also send MIDI clock data, but the documentation is lacking....
looks like a mighty forum/web search is in order