Lush reverb in the style of Bonobo and Emancipator

[PLfan]

I've been wanting to make this reverb for years, the one on Jets by Bonobo. Didn't really realise what it was until I got a new headset. Pretty sure it's a multisample, with the same sample on both sounds, but FXed differently. So, what I do to make this verb is make a multi by duplicating the sample inside the drum rack in session-view, deleting all FX on both samples, and typically adding some heavy LP-EQing on one (and some compression and Flux Bittersweet), so I get a sub kick, no high frets at all. Then add some HP-EQ on the second kick and make it a top kick. When these are played together adjust the volume so that they sound close to the original sample. Then, start adding MFLs convolution reverb to the top kick only (!), and adjust that until you have the sound you need.

[re:dream]

Wow, thanks, will try this at home.

[outsidesys]

You can also experiment with Live's Multiband Dynamics audio effect to split a single sample into 2-3 frequency ranges.

Create 2-3 chains with MB Dynamics in an effect rack, and then use the solo buttons and crossovers in the Split Frequency section of each MB Dynamics to taste.

For example, in chain 1 you could solo the highs, in chain 2 you could solo the mids, and in chain 3 solo the lows. Then put whatever effects (if any) after each MB Dynamics effect to affect just that frequency range.

[re:dream]

Yip. Using the expander in the multiband dynamics after the reverb gets interesting effects.
Keep the reverb fairly minimal, but set the expander ratio above 1
It exaggerates the effect of the reverb without causing the reverb to drown out the dry sound.

Example in Vespers's percussion tutorial here http://youtu.be/S1NZQIQ-XLc

[TomViolenz]

Has anyone tried making a multi-band effect unit (let's say 4 bands) that is transparent when all effects are at 0% Wet/100% Dry ---- only using effects in Live?!

I tried to transparently seperate with EQ8 but that's not remotely possible. ( I tested with white noise and phase inverting an unaffected chain).

I ended up using Equilibrium (which has filters with 3dB/Oct slopes) which works much better. But it's still not truly transparent.

[beats me]

Is it better to use quality headphones at least in part to gauge reverb? I think a lot of the problem can be if you don’t have quality monitors or a properly treated room you either hear no reverb or too much reverb on the monitors and there’s all kinds of middle area that you just aren’t hearing.

[re:dream]

Has anyone tried making a multi-band effect unit (let's say 4 bands) that is transparent when all effects are at 0% Wet/100% Dry ---- only using effects in Live?!

I tried to transparently seperate with EQ8 but that's not remotely possible. ( I tested with white noise and phase inverting an unaffected chain).

I ended up using Equilibrium (which has filters with 3dB/Oct slopes) which works much better. But it's still not truly transparent.

Yes there is a rack like that somewhere. Can't remember where I found it. Claims to use some kind of phase inversion trick to get perfect transparency.

[TomViolenz]

Yes there is a rack like that somewhere. Can't remember where I found it. Claims to use some kind of phase inversion trick to get perfect transparency.

ehm, could you be a little more specific

[re:dream]

On my iPad now. Will look around on my hard drive when next I get back to my computer. I can't remember where I found it but I think the website is defunct.

[TomViolenz]

On my iPad now. Will look around on my hard drive when next I get back to my computer. I can't remember where I found it but I think the website is defunct.

It would be very much appreciated!

[re:dream]

http://rhythminmind.net/STN/?p=43

[TomViolenz]

Thanks a lot!

I'll check it out and will try to understand how it works.

Edit: It works amazingly well! Better than the commercial multiband effects I sampled!!!
Residual noise floor with a 0 dB audio source (in white noise phase canceling test) -180 dB

And all of this: Free, only with Live devices and minimal CPU use. Amazing!
This should be a standard rack with every Live install.

Now off to trying to understand what is actually going on there

[TomViolenz]

Ok, I think I understand what is going on. Pretty simple and clever actually.

I'll summarize for a 2 band separator:

Separate the audio signal with a rack into two chains.
One chain you lowpass with any EQ you like. (let's say at 120Hz)
Into the second chain you put another rack, in which you also make two chains.
One chain you leave empty. Into the other chain you copy the EQ from the lowpass chain and put a Utility after it.
On that Utility you activate both phase invert buttons.

So what happens is that the low passed chain only passes the low passed signal, while the other chain passes everything(the empty chain) and adds a phase inverted signal of the low passed part.
When these two secondary signals get summed, the phase inverted low passed signal and the same low end part of the empty chain cancel each other out, so that only the not low passed signal passes.

It get's a little more complicated because you want to do this over 4 bands, but the principle stays the same.

A tip, for people who download it now and have Live 9. This rack was made under Live 8 when EQ8 didn't have the 24dB/octave filters (4x), so he used 4 filters on top of each other to achieve the higher steepness. When you change that to the 4x filter you can get by with using only one per EQ, which should save on CPU.
Just don't forget that you have to make that change on both the normal phase and the phase inversion EQ.

I think Ableton should just make a new native device founded on these principles. The tech is obviously already programmed, just needs a nice GUI.

[TomViolenz]

This very useful rack has disappeared from the original location, so I re-uploaded it to Filepi:

http://filepi.com/i/W3H1Oca

[Stromkraft]

This very useful rack has disappeared from the original location, so I re-uploaded it to Filepi:

http://filepi.com/i/W3H1Oca

Good Karma for you. Thanks for sharing this useful tool!