mac os10.2

astromass · Post by **astromass** » Thu Sep 19, 2002 3:59 am

10.2...

worth the $129?

any improvements in audio performace???

thanks all, +

Alex Reynolds · Post by **Alex Reynolds** » Thu Sep 19, 2002 5:49 am

Seems to depend on what you're using.

If your audio adapter uses native CoreAudio drivers, then you may get better results (I did, in any case).

Other users still report troubles with third-party drivers/adapters.

In every other respect, 10.2 is worth the money. Overall performance and features are much improved.

-Alex

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Sep 19, 2002 7:05 am

for general computing it seems to be much better and a little faster. the Core Audio and MIDI part is cool but i'm still waiting for a bunch of software to make it to X. i say if all your apps are OS X ready then go for it, just to future-proof yourself.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Sep 19, 2002 7:43 am

that is the problem

I don't want to buy a special os just to be future proof, its suppose to make my computer the ultimate music machine and it turned out to be a load of crap, they said the same thing about os 10 and now jaguar. I'm not buying any more lemonade from apple.
and they've got us jumping through hoops for the ability to plug and play midi devices, audio devices and not have to go through oms. big deal. the wintels have been able to do that since late win95-win98,

tjwett · Post by **tjwett** » Thu Sep 19, 2002 8:05 am

i posted just above you but i got logged out.
dude, i agree with you on that. OSX kind of turned out to be little more than eye candy. yes, it can multitask much better and no more memory allocation but from my experience with OSX so far(REason, Live, Logic) the performance has not improved. and don't forget we still don't have many apps, and the ones we do have are Carbonised without proper AltiVec ability. i still suggest buying it though. you can et it for $69 with a student discount. and they don't actually check to make sure you are a student. trust me

i say buy it because as we all know Apple have no problem doing sudden changes leaving it's users with obsolete products. they've already disabled .mac for OS9 and most of the new stuff requires 10.2 it sucks that we have tp play ball with Apple but it's either that or go to Windows, which i don't think i could handle.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Thu Sep 19, 2002 9:46 am

I know what you mean, it just sucks cause it seems like a windows machine is what wer'e after in the end. windows -no memory allocation
windows- the multitasking has always been better. I'm trying to figure out what about windows I hate so much now, from the features that osx-jaguar are supposed to offer, to the power of those machines its like the most thing i hate about windows is that its not mac, yet we are breaking are necks paying high prices just to get a little taste of what the wintels have been doing for years. and all we can do is throw irq conflicts in their faces, which Bill Gates must be laughing cause my girlfriend is, she's like if macs are such the music artist computer then why are their more music programs for pc's. I think a revolution is on the horizon, its like a feeling in my gut i'm starting to feel like i've been had by a giant media machine.

seriously if I can go through all of this over jaguar and audio units, then maybe IRQ conflicts aren't such a big deal, when ever i bring windows problems up to my girlfriend, she tells me i'm living in the stone ages and she never has problems with her computer, and she's no genius. what really pisses me off is that somebody on this forum said that even with altivec that still macs would fall behind, if thats true why are we screaming for altivec? I don't think one of those artsy commercials is going to get me through this one. I guess i'll get the student version since its kinda cheap but i dont even know why.

atom_b · Post by **atom_b** » Thu Sep 19, 2002 2:49 pm

Well, there's nothing to hate about Windows, especially not when reading the pricing-tag on the powerful machines you can have for it. I'm using the very stable and reliable NT-line up to WinXP for more than five years now - and nothing tops WinXP Pro at this moment.

But, while I always was a little disrespectful against the MacOS from 8 to 9, because of its somehow retarded behaviour in so many ways, I think that with the Posix-based MacOS X you're on the right track. Sure, since it is an OS-baby still, you'll have to count in one or two years more to have it making you completly happy. But then it will be coming to its full effect and with highly integrated audio.

Additionally the aggressive businesss-strategy of Mr. Jobs should asure you, that there'll be more highly integrated pro-apps available then;)
And what is better, having an apple-machine you can now expect some open-source or other BSD-stuff to arise, wich will be easy to implement into your system, without having to run on the native MacOSX.
In other words: The deeper you'll dive into what your machine is capable of, the better you'll get your special needs integrated. I bet there will be some well tailored MacOS-derivates in the future to suit your audio needs - even better than native MacOS will.

From my POW working on Win NT was great, but too less audio applications were available. When the successor Win2K came you had to face very bad written device-drivers from third party developers, and still no sufficient situation with applications (and win98 never would be an alternative when it came to reliability and stabilty). But all this would never have made be switch to a system I don't have respect for - and I had been working a lot with Macs, so I knew why.

After that MS changed their API-policy. And when finally WinXP came out everything went very smooth. Software, drivers, all where right there at the start. It paid to stick to NT.

So my advice would be, use the system you love best.

astromass · Post by **astromass** » Sat Sep 21, 2002 4:22 am

thanks all for the relies.

i actually LOVe osX because it IS (as steve jobs sez) my "digital hub". i mean, i LOVE itunes and imovie, and my music rig consists of reason 2.0 and LIVe 1.5 and all seems pretty dope.

i will NEVER go back to windows, just way too many miracle mac moments with osX.

oh, how does one get the student discount of osX.2?

thanks again, +()Dd

Geraldo · Post by **Geraldo** » Sat Sep 21, 2002 5:44 am

Well I can't resist weighing in on this one. OSX Jaguar is the crappiest upgrade I have yet experienced from Apple. There is NO difference in the way LIVE performs, or doesn't perform. I guess that is saying something because Spark LE no longer recognizes my sound card in Jaguar. At least LIVE still works. I do however still get little dropouts in LIVE, I don't know if that is MOTU's fault or Ableton or both. But after all is said and done, I still would not go on stage with LIVE under OSX. IT is just not ready for showtime.

amwintx · Post by **amwintx** » Tue Sep 24, 2002 8:07 pm

All:

I have been using macs for audio and midi since the Macintosh SE and Mastertracks Pro! I am currently running Live/Reason/Spark ME under OSX 10.2.1 on a desktop g4 933 with a m-audio Delta TDIF card for I/O. I have 2 LCD monitors hooked up to the machine and two mouse/keyboards (I have two desks on either side of where I sit with a monitor on each desk).

With an absolute minimum of configuration/setup fuss, I am able to run iTunes, Spark ME, Live, Reason, Flash, iMovie all at the same time, all accessing the SAME audio hardware at the SAME time (if necessary), all utilizing dual monitors, all responding to either mouse/keyboard with 100% stability and plenty of power. This clearly makes OSX 10.2.1 the best Mac OS I have ever used in the studio and my mac the most useful computer I've ever had. OS 9.x was the product of decades of kludges and minor improvements, and in its last rev it was a highly optimized OS with lots of apps. But, that couldn't go on forever, Apple had to make a clean break and the apps vendors will catch up soon. From an app choice/availability perspective, I agree we are at a low point, but its only up from here, and I feel very good about OSX as a platform for the future.

http://www.themorrows.com

tjwett · Post by **tjwett** » Wed Sep 25, 2002 3:38 pm

i too have been trying to figure out what it is that keeps me breaking the bank to buy Apple's increasingly slow computers instead of an ultra fast and very cheap Wintel. i just don't trust Windows. the way it fills your machine with .dll files and registries and directories that you can't get rid of. and uninstalling programs sucks. perhaps the Macs do all of these things also but it's hidden away where i don't have to deal with it. as for the argument that Macs are more stable i have to disagree. i have just as many hang ups and freezes with a Mac as any Windows machine. and even more with OS X. i force quit more than i ever did in OS 9. only good thing about OS X, Force Quit actually works!

Alex Reynolds · Post by **Alex Reynolds** » Wed Sep 25, 2002 5:11 pm

This has little to do with audio issues but I thought I would mention it.

I've found that "upgrade" installs of Mac OS X 10.1.x to 10.2 end up poorly.

The best thing to do is an "archive and install" option to a Mac OS X 10.1.x installation, if you want to migrate to 10.2. This puts a fresh copy of 10.2 system on the machine.

I haven't had nearly as many (if really any) problems running applications since I went this route for migrating older machines to OS X.

-Alex

(tjwett) · Post by **(tjwett)** » Wed Sep 25, 2002 5:35 pm

just thought i'd add this. for the 3rd time this week my a Windows machine has just crashed on me at work. lost a bunch of important stuff.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sun Oct 06, 2002 3:39 pm

I´m not a mac user,I will switch soon.
just would like to ask something about Core MIDI and Core Audio.
Does anyone knows if it is possible to transfer more MIDI and Audio Sequences from one Sequencer to the other one with the CoreMIDI/AUdio drivers??
anybody knows??..tried??

Thanks to everyone who can say something about it:)

peterkirn · Post by **peterkirn** » Tue Oct 08, 2002 5:22 pm

File formats are still proprietary -- Core Audio / MIDI is basically a hardware/software layer in the OS. I.e., it's drivers -- it's not magically possible to exchange files between applications although in theory once developers get stuff worked out it will be easier to connect up multiple apps running at the same time.

As to the other replies, perspective seems sorely lacking. An upgrade is "crappy" because you don't see a performance boost in ONE application?! The OS provides things other than performance. System 6 performed faster than System 7 on the same machine. That didn't make System 7 a crappy upgrade. And many of us are finding significant performance improvements. The underlying problem is that MIDI/audio support is still evolving. That's frustrating, but we're moving MUCH faster than some of us anticipated. I think it's reasonable to expect to be performing regularly with OS X in 6 months. MAX coming out by the end of the year, Cubase/Logic/DP all on by the end of the year, Pro Tools by 2nd quarter 2003 -- this is all good news.

I think you'dhave to be one of the developers to appreciate what Apple has done with 10.2 . . . and the developers I'm talking to are still figuring that out! So the best thing is to (cautiously) keep pace with OS updates, and be sure to have OS 9 as a backup for everything you do as we work on the transition. -P

mac os10.2

mac os10.2

thanks

OSX Jaguar for Audio/Midi and Live